800's to end in 2011

"crisis mode" desperate times, desperate measure. IF ONLY THEY HAD LISTENED TO KING KENNY ALL THIS .... WOULD HAVE BEEN SOLVED. Now theyre looking to cut cost, amazing.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (alex29 @ Jul 18 2009, 02:01 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>http://www.roadracerx.com/features/road-ra...racerhead-29/3/


Interesting read. 800 to be replaced by new Moto1 class?? Tough times in motogp with the grid getting smaller, could this be the answer??


Also mentions Alex de Angelis has signed with Pramac Ducati for 2010.

this is the guy ive been saying for over a year should be given a shot on the ducati... something about his riding style.

thanks for the link

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Jul 18 2009, 02:20 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>"crisis mode" desperate times, desperate measure. IF ONLY THEY HAD LISTENED TO KING KENNY ALL THIS .... WOULD HAVE BEEN SOLVED. Now theyre looking to cut cost, amazing.


+100000 so true.....

there is 1 thing i hope doesnt happen and thats a single engine supplier... that would ruin everything.

990+ CC and less of the laptop stuff and il be happy

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jazkat @ Jul 18 2009, 10:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>990+ CC and less of the laptop stuff and il be happy



but i agree

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (alex29 @ Jul 17 2009, 06:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Interesting read. 800 to be replaced by new Moto1 class??

The only thing worse than the 800s would be a bogus two tiered system. How would they regulate fuel? It doesn't seem possible that a spring-valve screamer I-4 is going to make the type of economy required to race in GP. Furthermore, the governing body will never let a 1000cc team win b/c the sport would turn into WSBK part II.

After 2011, they should go to 1000cc and change the rules to allow production parts. Mandate 4 cylinders then impose a rev limit at something easily achievable like 16,000rpm. Raise min weight to 155kg and raise fuel back to 24L. Most MotoGP teams will probably go back to the 990cc engine even if they're giving up 10cc. Unfortunately, Honda will be forced to scrap the mighty V5, but that's what HRC gets for being the dumbest motorcycle racing company on the planet. After the sport is stabilized they need to figure out a way to ditch fuel and displacement regs altogether so Honda can stop ruining the sport every time they want to try something new.

In the interim, they need to ban fuel regs, and impose a rev limit.

750's ?

Not saying I like it but it does make sense for Dorna to go to a Moto1 concept. Right now if Honda, Yamaha or Ducati say "we will not be fielding bikes next year" the sport is over. If they go to a spec engine in a custom chassis then all they have to do is go to tender for engines every 3 years and wait for the rush from every wanna be chassis builder to field a bike and fill the grid.

Couple of questions for those more technically minded:

1. Would a chassis in Moto2 be relevant to Moto1 and a bigger engine and therefore teams in Moto2 field a bike in Moto1 and spread the cost?

2. Would the general public be treated to a host of retail bikes based on chassis developed in Moto1/Moto2 available for purchase in order to fund the racing budgets?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TP70 @ Jul 18 2009, 04:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Not saying I like it but it does make sense for Dorna to go to a Moto1 concept. Right now if Honda, Yamaha or Ducati say "we will not be fielding bikes next year" the sport is over. If they go to a spec engine in a custom chassis then all they have to do is go to tender for engines every 3 years and wait for the rush from every wanna be chassis builder to field a bike and fill the grid.

Couple of questions for those more technically minded:

1. Would a chassis in Moto2 be relevant to Moto1 and a bigger engine and therefore teams in Moto2 field a bike in Moto1 and spread the cost?

2. Would the general public be treated to a host of retail bikes based on chassis developed in Moto1/Moto2 available for purchase in order to fund the racing budgets?


1, Not a far stretch for 750

2. Yes 750's hae mysteriously hung around for some years now on the showroom floor 800's as a capacity seems crazy as few 800's in market...... but there are still 750s ....... and MV may field a bike?

To go back to the dinosaur 990's would be crazy. They are pretty much relegated to the task of drag racing as they produce too much power and detract from other aspects of a bike such as handling.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TP70 @ Jul 17 2009, 10:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Not saying I like it but it does make sense for Dorna to go to a Moto1 concept. Right now if Honda, Yamaha or Ducati say "we will not be fielding bikes next year" the sport is over. If they go to a spec engine in a custom chassis then all they have to do is go to tender for engines every 3 years and wait for the rush from every wanna be chassis builder to field a bike and fill the grid.

Couple of questions for those more technically minded:

1. Would a chassis in Moto2 be relevant to Moto1 and a bigger engine and therefore teams in Moto2 field a bike in Moto1 and spread the cost?

2. Would the general public be treated to a host of retail bikes based on chassis developed in Moto1/Moto2 available for purchase in order to fund the racing budgets?

The sport is already over b/c they don't have enough bikes on the grid to maintain world championship status for next season (as things stand ATM). Honda are allegedly adding bikes for next year.

I don't think Moto2 and Moto1 chassis would be interchangeable. MotoGP is allegedly moving to 150kg for next season and Moto2 is still listed as 135kg. A MotoGP chassis and a Moto2 chassis are also built to handle different amounts of power.

It is conceivable but unlikely that a stellar Moto2 chassis would see mass production, imo. The parts from a production 600 would probably not fit into a Moto2 chassis, and I doubt a manufacturer would redesign their bike around an experimental Moto2 frame, but never say never.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Jul 17 2009, 10:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>750's ?

Why all of this talk about 750s? MotoGP won't allow itself to turn slower lap times than WSBK, and they aren't going to endanger their franchise riders by raising cornering speeds.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Jul 18 2009, 07:42 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>750's ?
Thats just moronic, unless your talking 750 2 strokes

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Jul 19 2009, 12:43 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Why all of this talk about 750s? MotoGP won't allow itself to turn slower lap times than WSBK, and they aren't going to endanger their franchise riders by raising cornering speeds.


Do they turn faster lap times now? 800 - 750 isn't a far stretch.

You guys are all bangin away about "bring back the 990's!" ....... claiming it will make it all better.

Its never been so exiting!.

Both MGP and FI are development series. They start out with big engines and as the power increases they drop the capacity. When has that not been the case?

What you are suggesting is like F1 turning into Indy cars ....... well gee thats real good.


Why the F@#K would you want to bring back an engine size that has already been superceded and made for nothing but better straight line drag racing?

Bring back Bentley to F1 I suppose too

It is all about cost cutting and I think TP70 brings up a good point, ie. can they get cost savings across Motogp1 and 2 .......... well I can see it as not being a far stretch from 600's to 750. And Also 750 was historically a size that was "out there" at the re-establishment of 4 strokes as a powerplant in bikes again. They are still pretty available now ....... so it also brings it closer to a capacity that the "wanabe" public need. How many guys out there felt "alienated: with their R1's when they went 800's. And for that market .... the "wanabe market" 800's are a dead loss. to get back some "wanabe connection" 750's is the go.

I was surprised they stopped off at 800's, and moreso that they are going 600 for Moto2

Cos to me the sensible capacities are, 750, 500 and 250. And I would love to see the formula whereby 250's are 2 X 125 pots, 500's 4 X 125, 750's ( yeah!! I'd love to see 6 X125 pots, but only as an option ie. anthing from 3 to six pots )


But 990's again!! why!!??? they'd be nothing more than drag bikes.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Jul 19 2009, 10:41 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>But 990's again!! why!!??? they'd be nothing more than drag bikes.


Very bold this, they seemed to get around a corner pretty well to me, and while the 1000cc sportsbike remains the dominant force on the road I can't imagine them decreasing displacement....only Suzuki has really bothered with the 750 because no one can take these things around corners on the road like they can be anyway, the thous have the fun-factor Grunt with decent handling-which will always wins on the road.

Lets face it the 800's have provided us with a handful of good races in nearly 3 years, not a good conversion rate. Control tyre hasn't fixed it either.....and probably wont

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Jul 19 2009, 01:41 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Do they turn faster lap times now? 800 - 750 isn't a far stretch.

You guys are all bangin away about "bring back the 990's!" ....... claiming it will make it all better.

Its never been so exiting!.

Both MGP and FI are development series. They start out with big engines and as the power increases they drop the capacity. When has that not been the case?

What you are suggesting is like F1 turning into Indy cars ....... well gee thats real good.


Why the F@#K would you want to bring back an engine size that has already been superceded and made for nothing but better straight line drag racing?

Bring back Bentley to F1 I suppose too

It is all about cost cutting and I think TP70 brings up a good point, ie. can they get cost savings across Motogp1 and 2 .......... well I can see it as not being a far stretch from 600's to 750. And Also 750 was historically a size that was "out there" at the re-establishment of 4 strokes as a powerplant in bikes again. They are still pretty available now ....... so it also brings it closer to a capacity that the "wanabe" public need. How many guys out there felt "alienated: with their R1's when they went 800's. And for that market .... the "wanabe market" 800's are a dead loss. to get back some "wanabe connection" 750's is the go.

I was surprised they stopped off at 800's, and moreso that they are going 600 for Moto2

Cos to me the sensible capacities are, 750, 500 and 250. And I would love to see the formula whereby 250's are 2 X 125 pots, 500's 4 X 125, 750's ( yeah!! I'd love to see 6 X125 pots, but only as an option ie. anthing from 3 to six pots )


But 990's again!! why!!??? they'd be nothing more than drag bikes.
This is supposed to be a "cost cutting" exercise. The money that would be involved to get a 750's as fast as the 800's are now and faster than wsb would be immense. Big cc is the way to cheap power. Use your brain berry

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chopperman @ Jul 19 2009, 08:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>This is supposed to be a "cost cutting" exercise. The money that would be involved to get a 750's as fast as the 800's are now and faster than wsb would be immense. Big cc is the way to cheap power. Use your brain berry

Big capacity saves dollars!!?? care to explain that one to me Rog.!!???

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Jul 19 2009, 11:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Big capacity saves dollars!!?? care to explain that one to me Rog.!!???
Sure, look how much money the change from 990 to 800 cost and look at the teams that had to drop out because of it. Now your suggesting a further reduction in cubic capacity to save money do you work for dorna by any chance. Getting power from a larger engine is always going to be cheaper than from a smaller engine when the rules say they have to be normally aspirated.

800 never made sence anyhow...simple...dust of the 990...everyone has one...Honda bike to RULE once again.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chopperman @ Jul 19 2009, 08:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Sure, look how much money the change from 990 to 800 cost and look at the teams that had to drop out because of it. Now your suggesting a further reduction in cubic capacity to save money do you work for dorna by any chance. Getting power from a larger engine is always going to be cheaper than from a smaller engine when the rules say they have to be normally aspirated.



Good one ... I was wondering what you were going to dream up but thats pretty funny