the points system

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (stop_killing_dead_things @ Apr 3 2007, 11:22 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>so rossi DOESNT win the majority of races then?
funny. its about consistency not wins. what if a rider won every race he finished but only finished half of them because he bins it alot. does he deserve to win the crown then over someone who gets on the podium every time they race?

Whoever gets a podium 'Everytime' is kind of trying harder than just the safetyzone, isn't it?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Apr 3 2007, 11:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>in my oppinion yes he does deserve the crown. winning is what racing is all about.

I am with you Rog!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Apr 3 2007, 10:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>funny how the topic is purly about weather people think the point system is fit for purpose or not and all the haydonetts come running in with the rossi vs hayden argument. geeeez it you guys that need to get over it. my only reason for giving more race points to the winner is to give an insentive for closer racing. not once have i said im talking about it in a 06 senario more for the future.

Question is, what can we debate without it becoming a Rossi/Hayden bashing.

I like the current system with a fair balance between wins and consistency. It might be adjustet a little with a few extra points but not as much as you sugest. Giving pole points might also be a good idea. First of all, qualification would be so much more fun to watch. I mean, as a Rossi fan it's ok to see Rossi get pole, but nothing more, as you know that it doesn't really matter for the race as long as he is on one of the two first rows. For other riders, the fans would probably hope for a first row, but either way the pole is not at all that important. Yes, the pole man often win, but not because of the advantage pole gives but because he has been faster all the way. On those other occations the effort of a greate pole should be rewarded too.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Apr 3 2007, 04:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>

It's Pete, remember sarcasm?Yeap .... I was joining in.

As I have said many times here and elsewhere. Winners win and anything less than victory is a loss for them.

Getting a pole position is winning isn't it? Winning the right to the best spot on the starting grid. Does'nt matter WHO it is or what year it is.

I consider Dani a winner. Why? Because even though he's only won 2 races in his young MotoGP career he rides to win. It showed in Jerez when he didn't give up and coast into 2nd even though Vale countered every move he tried to make to close the gap.

Does that mean he didn't try as hard? Nope. It means that he didn't have what it took to beat the guy ahead. Now. What if he caught and passed Rossi on the last lap because he hung it out and squeeked by in the last corner. Does he deserve more than a handful of points more than the 2nd place guy. You bet yer ... he does. Why? Because on that day on that track he proved he was a winner and no one could beat him. See, it really doesn't matter how a winner wins only that they do.

Schwantz was a winner well before he won the world title.

SS

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rgvneil @ Apr 3 2007, 02:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Christ guys no matter how you look at it you're always returning to the same topic.
It is now 2007 let's move on PLEASE.You can quote me on this next year.

When the World Title is back in a winners hands the 06 topic will be dead.

SS

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Yamahamer-AL @ Apr 3 2007, 10:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>i still think the 1 point per umbrella girl nailed should be implemented....
with live feed.

I'd love to see Nicky in action..mind you..I'd prefer 'live' than 'live feed' !!!! Given the opportunity I think I'd add quite a few points to his total

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Apr 3 2007, 11:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Will you people move on,we are 1/4 of the way thru 2007 and you are still inventing scenarios where Rossi gets the title for 2006.

1/4 of the way?!?!?
DAMN!!!! I seem to have missed at least two races...I only seem to have watched 2 so far!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bikergirl @ Apr 3 2007, 07:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>
I'd love to see Nicky in action..mind you..I'd prefer 'live' than 'live feed' !!!! Given the opportunity I think I'd add quite a few points to his total
1/4 of the way?!?!?
DAMN!!!! I seem to have missed at least two races...I only seem to have watched 2 so far!


Read it again,nowhere does it say 1/4 of the 2007 race season.It says we are thru 1/4 of 2007.End of March,3rd month =1/4 of 12.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bikergirl @ Apr 4 2007, 12:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I'd love to see Nicky in action..mind you..I'd prefer 'live' than 'live feed' !!!! Given the opportunity I think I'd add quite a few points to his total :

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Apr 3 2007, 11:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I guess Hayden should give Rossi the BMW he won last year because Rossi had more poles than him.It doesnt matter that for the year,Hayden was over 5 second faster than Rossi in the BMW Qualifying Award.Will you people move on,we are 1/4 of the way thru 2007 and you are still inventing scenarios where Rossi gets the title for 2006.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Apr 4 2007, 02:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Read it again,nowhere does it say 1/4 of the 2007 race season.It says we are thru 1/4 of 2007.End of March,3rd month =1/4 of 12.

Apologies Povol...from the deepest part of my heart. It was 2 in the morning and I'm on hard drugs!!!! However in my defence, this being a motogp forum where everyone, including yourself, is talking about racing, to me 2006 refers to the season, as does 2007. Guess I'm just a sad motogp nutcase huh?

I am not going to bring up the debate of Nicky/Vale of 2006. roger_m does bring out a valid point in regards for riders to fight harder for the win.. Ernie of F1 have proposed a change to the F1 points system as he said that rewarding the winner may force the runner-up to fight for the win instead of consolidating points... Ernie went on to say that the new points system may increase passing/overtaking stunts that are lacking in F1.. With that said, MotoGP is not short of the great and close battles that we all enjoy so much..

But if I were to come up with a new points system, I will not award points to the first 15 riders out of a 19 bike field... hell, all you gotta do is stay on the bike while others crash and you get some points.. this is a little stupid. I think roger_m points for pole is a little much.. 1 point is enough...

This is how I would do it.
1st: 25
2nd: 15
3rd: 10
4th: 6
5th: 4
6th: 3
7th: 2
8th: 1

pole: 1
fast lap: 1

I think there will be more crazy riding with this point system at the beginning of the year, but with someone like Rossi on board but with a Hayden mentality will cause someone who wins consistently at the first half of the season to slow down in the 2nd half

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ChemiKaze @ Apr 4 2007, 10:59 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I am not going to bring up the debate of Nicky/Vale of 2006. roger_m does bring out a valid point in regards for riders to fight harder for the win.. Ernie of F1 have proposed a change to the F1 points system as he said that rewarding the winner may force the runner-up to fight for the win instead of consolidating points... Ernie went on to say that the new points system may increase passing/overtaking stunts that are lacking in F1.. With that said, MotoGP is not short of the great and close battles that we all enjoy so much..

But if I were to come up with a new points system, I will not award points to the first 15 riders out of a 19 bike field... hell, all you gotta do is stay on the bike while others crash and you get some points.. this is a little stupid. I think roger_m points for pole is a little much.. 1 point is enough...

This is how I would do it.
1st: 25
2nd: 15
3rd: 10
4th: 6
5th: 4
6th: 3
7th: 2
8th: 1

pole: 1
fast lap: 1

I think there will be more crazy riding with this point system at the beginning of the year, but with someone like Rossi on board but with a Hayden mentality will cause someone who wins consistently at the first half of the season to slow down in the 2nd half


Giving points to 15 out of 19 riders is a bit ridiculous because when there are races like Catalunya last year any finishers get a good points score.

However reducing it to the top 8 is a bit excessive i think because then the teams such as Kawasaki, Tech 3, D'Antin, Team Roberts will score very few points across the season meaning they will get very little prize money and therefore they may not be able to balance the funds.

Top 10 scoring points is more reasonable as with only a couple of retirements these lower teams will be able to score points and get money.

However, if more teams join the grid (e.g. Ilmor return, new Suzuki team and possibly Ten Kate Honda) giving the the top 15 points would be ok coz with up to 25 bikes on the grid, the teams at the back of the pack would need to do quite well to get the points as apposed to riding around waiting for up to 10 others to fall off.

A point for pole position would put more significance on qualifying although so far this years new rules have worked fine but should the fastest rider be rewarded with more than P1 on the grid and a watch, i'm not sure.

A point for fastest lap would mean that even riders who have been nudged off the track and lost a lot of time would have something to ride for when at the back of the pack.

yea... I see how you guys can see how cruel I am... hehe... so maybe we do need to give the pramacs or kwaks a break... so..
4th:7
5th:6
6th:5
7th:4
8th:3
9th:2
10th:1

this means.. riders will definitely want to fight for podium.. the current point system works well for the 125 and 250 classes as 125 can have up to 40 riders and 250 have over 30 riders... but unless motogp have over 25 riders, giving the top 15 riders points is a little silly.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Apr 3 2007, 01:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>funny how the topic is purly about weather people think the point system is fit for purpose or not and all the haydonetts come running in with the rossi vs hayden argument. geeeez it you guys that need to get over it. my only reason for giving more race points to the winner is to give an insentive for closer racing. not once have i said im talking about it in a 06 senario more for the future.
That’s because you poised it as one buddy. Now you backpedal trying to extract the debate out of it that you injected into it.

You have a valid question. And I think most would have been inclined to answer fairly objectively, but you infused a Hayden shot into your premise, just like Capirex did on another thread.

Yes, I think it was a fair question, but don't qualify it then go crying foul when people response to your shot.

Anyway, here is my take pal. Leave well enough alone.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Apr 3 2007, 05:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>1.since nicky hayden won the world championship i have read countless debates on weather or not he deserved it because he only won 2 races ect,

1. This is called infusing the debate.

Yes you go on to say you are asking an honest question, but look at the context you put it in.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Apr 4 2007, 10:21 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>sorry dude,not really sure what your going on about.
you have a very vivid imagination mate,its just a pitty its so narrow.
Narrow? Rj sees EVERYTHING between them blinders, doesn't even have to turn his head ...... it's like he uses the force or sumthin.

SS

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bikergirl @ Apr 3 2007, 06:51 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>does anyone have the patience to work out what last year's final points would have been on that system?
Come on Rog...your idea...
Rather interesting the result that you pulled out Rog.

This is why your intent is questionable.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Apr 3 2007, 01:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>all the haydonetts come running in with the rossi vs hayden argument.
But if there was any doubt, you erased it here.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Apr 4 2007, 08:21 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>sorry dude,not really sure what your going on about.
you have a very vivid imagination mate,its just a pitty its so narrow.
Likewise. (Or have you forgot what side you have stood on the issue.)


So once again, assuming your question was <u>all</u> fair intentioned, then here is my fair intentioned answer: Leave well enough alone.

Good honest racing fans are screwed no matter what. I've been reading this thread laughing my ... of and cringing at the same time. Give Rossi the 2006 title it'll shut them up. If Rossi wins this year we're screwed cos it'll be rammed down our throats. If he loses like he did last year then the fall-out and 'what if's' and 'he deserved it's' will be too much to stomach. Why should I care if Rossi's gay anyway? Priceless.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ChemiKaze @ Apr 4 2007, 04:59 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>This is how I would do it.
1st: 25
2nd: 15
3rd: 10
4th: 7
5th: 6
6th: 5
7th: 4
8th: 3
9th: 2
10th: 1

pole: 1
fast lap: 1Based on ChemiKaze's system but paying points to 10th as suggested by others the 06 top 5 would've been:

Vale = 249
Loris = 180
Nicky = 179
Marco = 162
Dani = 148

Pehaps a lil' lop sided as the winner and the awarded champion both stood on the podium the same number of times.

Maybe:
1st: 25
2nd: 17
3rd: 11
4th: 8
5th: 7
6th: 5
7th: 4
8th: 3
9th: 2
10th: 1

pole: 1
fast lap: 1


Would work better ......

SS