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Nakamoto reads powerslide

mylexicon said:
There is no difference between creating gearing/engine packages for each track, and creating an engine package to accentuate the desired gearing (selected for the track). It's the same thing. You're target fixating just as you are with the Ti pistons.



We all get it. You have an allergic reaction to anyone who mentions Ti and piston in the same sentence, though, you understand that the manufacturers have been using metal matrix composites and ceramics in racing engines since the 1980s. They used those materials (including Ti-based MMCs) for every engine component with varying degrees of success. MMCs and ceramics have been banned to focus on powder metallurgy. They have lightweight aerospace alloys at their disposal for every engine component.



I didn't botch the AMA vs. WSBK rules discussion. Unfortunately, I misinformed Cliche about the material of stock connecting rods and 1198R pistons. After shedding some light on the situation, you've gone psychotic as if these minor details represent a cosmic shift in the difference between AMA and WSBK rules.
Click to expand...



Dum de dum.



You clearly stated that Gearing comes first, then the engine characteristics are tuned around them. Those words in parenthesis? Those are yours. They are also wrong.

Your current attempt at recovery is to conflate two similar ideas, different to your original statement. That won't work, Lex.



Now you're back-peddling away from your Titanium comment and introducing MMCs and Ceramics. And making more mistake with "MMCs and ceramics have been banned to focus on powder metallurgy". Yeah, MMCs are banned, but you have confused a material with a process. Again, won't work, Lex.



And back to the rules discussion:

You didn't just get the material mixed up on a the conrods or 'misremember' piston material, you wrote this:

" If Ducati gets titanium, everyone gets titanium. If the manufacturers cannot agree on titanium kit regulations, then everyone gets prototype titanium internals."

Which is an interesting interpretation.

and

"WSBK basically uses MotoGP-caliber titanium internals. Those parts are difficult to access b/c the factories control them. AMA and BSB increase accessibility to engine parts by using aluminum internals"

Not to mention bizarre techno-babble such as:

"Homologating titanium kits with low static-compression to increase valve clearance without sacrificing much power"



None of which are helpful in answering Cliche's genuine questions. Very helpful in allowing you to spout off and pretend you understand engines and materials and the rules.



"Spare gearing is cheap if it is used in a club racing atmosphere"

Welcome to Lex's bizarro world of club racing.
 
Dr No said:
You clearly stated that Gearing comes first
Click to expand...



It makes no difference. If I had said they pick the gearing, then WSBK selects the appropriate track for the gearbox the teams want to use, maybe you'd have something to complain about.



" If Ducati gets titanium, everyone gets titanium. If the manufacturers cannot agree on titanium kit regulations, then everyone gets prototype titanium internals."
Click to expand...



True statement, but it doesn't apply to the pistons. Ducati build R homologation specials with titanium rods and titanium intake/exhaust valves. If Ducati wants to sell 500 R models, but the Japanese do not want to equip stock titanium rods or exhaust valves, then everyone needs replacement parts for those components.



"WSBK basically uses MotoGP-caliber titanium internals. Those parts are difficult to access b/c the factories control them. AMA and BSB increase accessibility to engine parts by using aluminum internals"
Click to expand...



Also true. They don't use standard production alloys, process, or design for WSBK racing parts. They are prototype in nature, and not available for sale. When Ducati moved to 1200cc, that situation changed for Ducati pistons, but that is only since 2008. Titanium doesn't apply to the WSBK pistons, and aluminum doesn't apply to the AMA connecting rods.



"Homologating titanium kits with low static-compression to increase valve clearance without sacrificing much power"
Click to expand...



Titanium doesn't apply, but you obviously understand the gist. This technique is widespread from Moto2 to touring car racing.
 
Dr No said:
Dum de dum.



You clearly stated that Gearing comes first, then the engine characteristics are tuned around them. Those words in parenthesis? Those are yours. They are also wrong.

Your current attempt at recovery is to conflate two similar ideas, different to your original statement. That won't work, Lex.



Now you're back-peddling away from your Titanium comment and introducing MMCs and Ceramics. And making more mistake with "MMCs and ceramics have been banned to focus on powder metallurgy". Yeah, MMCs are banned, but you have confused a material with a process. Again, won't work, Lex.



And back to the rules discussion:

You didn't just get the material mixed up on a the conrods or 'misremember' piston material, you wrote this:

" If Ducati gets titanium, everyone gets titanium. If the manufacturers cannot agree on titanium kit regulations, then everyone gets prototype titanium internals."

Which is an interesting interpretation.

and

"WSBK basically uses MotoGP-caliber titanium internals. Those parts are difficult to access b/c the factories control them. AMA and BSB increase accessibility to engine parts by using aluminum internals"

Not to mention bizarre techno-babble such as:

"Homologating titanium kits with low static-compression to increase valve clearance without sacrificing much power"



None of which are helpful in answering Cliche's genuine questions. Very helpful in allowing you to spout off and pretend you understand engines and materials and the rules.



"Spare gearing is cheap if it is used in a club racing atmosphere"

Welcome to Lex's bizarro world of club racing.
Click to expand...

You both obviously know more about all this than most, definitely including me.



This doesn't stop me from never being wrong though
<
.
 
mylexicon said:
It makes no difference. If I had said they pick the gearing, then WSBK selects the appropriate track for the gearbox the teams want to use, maybe you'd have something to complain about.







True statement, but it doesn't apply to the pistons. Ducati build R homologation specials with titanium rods and titanium intake/exhaust valves. If Ducati wants to sell 500 R models, but the Japanese do not want to equip stock titanium rods or exhaust valves, then everyone needs replacement parts for those components.







Also true. They don't use standard production alloys, process, or design for WSBK racing parts. They are prototype in nature, and not available for sale. When Ducati moved to 1200cc, that situation changed for Ducati pistons, but that is only since 2008. Titanium doesn't apply to the WSBK pistons, and aluminum doesn't apply to the AMA connecting rods.







Titanium doesn't apply, but you obviously understand the gist. This technique is widespread from Moto2 to touring car racing.
Click to expand...



Dum de Dum.



Didn't work, Lex. You barely bothered to address your errors, but once again created new realities contradicting your statements and ignored the your obvious mistakes.

It is clear, and made clearer by your continued obfuscatory and confused responses, that you really don't understand race-tech.

The sad bit is that is appears that you understand the extent of your ignorance, but prefer to get on your high horse than to educate yourself.



My plane to Crab Key is leaving soon, I need to slap around some minions with my stupid metal hands, but it's been fun.
 
Dr No said:
My plane to Crab Key is leaving soon, I need to slap around some minions with my stupid metal hands, but it's been fun.
Click to expand...



You have to leave. The only thing you've done since arriving is increase my general knowledge on the subject (however, inadequate you may find it to be). You are beginning to understand that keep at it b/c I gain strength from the discussion, and I want you to reveal more, which is the opposite of your intended outcome. Beta-males generally don't understand the effects of their harassment campaigns.



If you want to continue effective harassment, you must reveal further weaknesses, but you won't get to feel satisfaction from withholding what little power you may have within your grasp. You must wander off, having accomplished nothing. It is in your nature.
 
Wow, I don't even have a full time job yet I don't find enough time to write the essays of ........ some of you do on here!



You both have your own opinions, leave it at that or go meet up in a hotel room and .... each other up the ...
<
 
mylexicon said:
You have to leave. The only thing you've done since arriving is increase my general knowledge on the subject (however, inadequate you may find it to be). You are beginning to understand that keep at it b/c I gain strength from the discussion, and I want you to reveal more, which is the opposite of your intended outcome. Beta-males generally don't understand the effects of their harassment campaigns.



If you want to continue effective harassment, you must reveal further weaknesses, but you won't get to feel satisfaction from withholding what little power you may have within your grasp. You must wander off, having accomplished nothing. It is in your nature.
Click to expand...



Is that your way of conceding a debate?



I was wrong, but really i win because you were mean to me which made me stronger.
 
povol said:
Is that your way of conceding a debate?



I was wrong, but really i win because you were mean to me which made me stronger.
Click to expand...



There was no debate, Povol. It was MigsAngel doing his usual routine. He points out a minor matter of parliament. He uses it to insinuate that you know nothing. You humor him for a week, giving him the benefit of the doubt to see if he actually knows something. In the end, he only knows that he has caught you on a minor parliamentary matter, and he wants to bite your ankles until you bleed to death.
 
mylexicon said:
There was no debate, Povol. It was MigsAngel doing his usual routine. He points out a minor matter of parliament. He uses it to insinuate that you know nothing. You humor him for a week, giving him the benefit of the doubt to see if he actually knows something. In the end, he only knows that he has caught you on a minor parliamentary matter, and he wants to bite your ankles until you bleed to death.
Click to expand...



WOW
 
thedeal said:
WOW
Click to expand...



Allow me to explain, since you don't see what's going on.



After I realize that I've made a mistake, all I have to do is ask him what titanium rod alloys and aluminum piston alloys the teams use in WSBK. Unless he works as a race engineer for one of the major teams or manufacturers, he has no clue. He probably doesn't even know the alloys used for the stock machines. Anytime he brings up my mistake, I remind everyone that he knows nothing important. This is how ad hominem political debate works, and the result is that everyone ends up looking stupid. The ordinary citizen can't possibly vote and maintain a positive self-image without some sort of unreasonable moralistic idealism to reinforce their decisions. Reason dies.



But I didn't pursue that strategy, did I? No. I admitted fault at least a dozen times to coax additional information out of him. Did he ever explain how WSBK and AMA racing work? No, b/c he doesn't know. He is only armed with my faults, and his own personal desire to stop me from discussing the rules with other members.



If he insists on playing who's-stupider by having an ad hominem "debate", I can play that game as well.
 

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