Ends any speculation that he's going to Ducati or KTM
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cr...168/1/marc-marquez-signs-honda-until-2024?amp
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cr...168/1/marc-marquez-signs-honda-until-2024?amp
Smart move from Honda. Smart from Marquez as well, yes I think we all agree that the Honda is the hardest bike to ride but they have the money and ability to make whatever he wants really. It wasn’t so long ago that their mid corner speed was rivalling Yamaha’s etc. Honda can give Marquez a completely new bike, not an evolution but a completely new bike and because his ability in conjunction with their resources he can win on it as has been shown.
I think the counter argument to that is that the bike is as unrideable as it is for everyone but Marc because Honda are following his development requests.
e.g. He doesn't really care how well the bike enters the corner as he has ample ability to override it and has more power to make up for it on the exit and straights.
Everyone else either crashes or laps at the back.
If Honda continue in this fashion, they may well end up winning the next 4 titles and then end up struggling for top 10 finished off Marc moves on...
That was part of my point though Honda gives Marc what he needs/wants to win. He is happy to give up some front end feeling for power because he can ride around it while others can’t.
Which is great for Marc of course, and whilst he's there great for Honda.
The question is what does it leave them after the 4 years is up and Marc moves on...
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It’s a good question, they’re probably betting that Marc doesn’t move on and if he does they probably figure that the strong possibility of winning another 4/5 titles is worth the possibility of a couple of seasons in the wilderness after 2024. 4 years is a long time and there is every chance that they could maintain their power and vastly improve handling. For all we know the next chassis Honda bring could solve a heap of their problems.
4 years ago the RCV handled as good or better than the Yamaha but was down on power.
Does any top rider want to be on the same bike as Marquez? Back in the Rossi days everyone wanted to be in a Honda because they believed they could beat him on the same bike. Barros could have been the reason why they believed it.
Lorenzo went to HRC because he thought he was out of options and failed there miserably. There seems to be an understanding that you can’t beat Marquez in the same bike but if you have a better bike than he does then you might be able to beat him.
Joined Aug 2007
11K Posts | 3K+
Pomona NY
IMHO - the HRC bike wasn't especially all that rider friendly even 4 years ago. I think it just took time for people's opinion on that to evolve. I think the HRC bikes from back when Rossi rode them, through till the end of the 2006 season they were the thing you wanted to be on; that in part because top factory riders were getting SNSs custom tailored to the bike and the individual tracks. But starting in 2007 when it became a case of "Honey I Shrank The Bike", dubbed here the Pedrocycle development on it pretty much centered on getting it right for Pedrosa, tho Dovi managed to do pretty well on it during his tenure. That Stoner did well on it wasn't surprising, given his results on the insane Ducati.
The 2009 - 2010 & 2011 880cc Honda was a great bike. 2012 bike was also great but they lost their tires 5 races in.
2013 good and then 2014 they seemed to just drop the ball and make an unrideable bullet, fast but not safe.
A
MM was close to invincible on the 2014 bike. 2015 was when he frequently crashed out.
MM was close to invincible on the 2014 bike. 2015 was when he frequently crashed out.
From 2015 onwards there have been major issues with the bike. How much of that is tyres and/or custom electronics I’m not sure but IMO of the 4 top factories they’re the factory with the biggest issues in the past 5-6 seasons. I know getting the balance right is difficult but for every step or two they take forward they take one backwards.
Sure the Ducati still doesn’t turn great, although I suspect Marquez would make it turn with insane lean angles as he did last year. But by all reports it’s great on the brakes/front end and it’s acceleration has always been a strong point.
Yamaha had an electrics engineer apologise to Vinales and Rossi for some reason. But the M1 has never had complaints like that of Ducati and Honda or required physicality and sublime skills to be ridden fast.
Joined Aug 2007
11K Posts | 3K+
Pomona NY
880 was 800. And that formula was a disaster. Total cluster ..... Made for the worst processional racing ever. Little to no passing in that era. Would like to forget those seasons altogether.
Joined Nov 2015
242 Posts | 144+
Australia
The only real surprise here is the length of the contract. Then again, even with the risk of injury I'm sure there were all the appropriate clauses in place. Honda may have all of their eggs in one basket, but so far with the exception of 2015 it has proved to have worthy returns. I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall during the negotiations.
Thank god the off season is almost over. Only a matter of weeks till the new season kicks off.
Thank god the off season is almost over. Only a matter of weeks till the new season kicks off.
Joined Jun 2007
3K Posts | 309+
UK
The bike was so good because Dani was leading development .. once Marquez was leading development the bike has gone to pot for all but MM. ....
Watch as KTM improves this year with Dani input..
Joined Aug 2007
11K Posts | 3K+
Pomona NY
It's a little disingenuous to blame Marquez directly. IMHO - his part of the "blame" has to do with the way he rides around the Honda's engineering idiosyncrasies. It's like blaming Stoner for the crappy handling of the early Ducati, that nobody else could do well with. Same dynamic with the Honda.
Remember when MM loved the bike and then hated the next season iteration and begged for the previous year's chassis?
Ducati and Honda are both famous having great development riders . . . and ignoring their input. With the advent of Gigi - that has changed at Ducati. At Honda
- not so much.
Joined Aug 2007
11K Posts | 3K+
Pomona NY
Joined Feb 2020
979 Posts | 1K+
Bendigo Vic
Both Lorenzo and Crutchlow have on several occasions expressed a preference for the previous specification of the RC213V, which lacked the straightline speed of the current bike but was easier to ride.
But while Marquez has repeatedly stressed he agrees with their feedback, he has also made it clear he viewed the extra pace as a worthwhile trade-off.
"In some aspects, the 2018 bike's engine was somewhat easier, but the laptimes were two or three tenths slower," Marquez said
"You need to know if you want an easier bike or a faster bike. I don't care if the bike is difficult as long as it's faster.
"I'm the first one who wants to keep the power but at the same time have more traction and a smoother engine, and that's what all the Honda riders are saying. But the Honda engine has been the same since I arrived in 2013, and that's not going to change now."
https://www.motorsport.com/motogp/news/marquez-honda-challenge-crutchlow/4559277/amp/
But while Marquez has repeatedly stressed he agrees with their feedback, he has also made it clear he viewed the extra pace as a worthwhile trade-off.
"In some aspects, the 2018 bike's engine was somewhat easier, but the laptimes were two or three tenths slower," Marquez said
"You need to know if you want an easier bike or a faster bike. I don't care if the bike is difficult as long as it's faster.
"I'm the first one who wants to keep the power but at the same time have more traction and a smoother engine, and that's what all the Honda riders are saying. But the Honda engine has been the same since I arrived in 2013, and that's not going to change now."
https://www.motorsport.com/motogp/news/marquez-honda-challenge-crutchlow/4559277/amp/
