Is the electronic era illegitimate

Talpa · May 10, 2012

michaelm said:
You might, perhaps oddly, find yourself in agreement with casey stoner, who was notably unimpressed with the 2006 non-sns michelins.

It is all speculation, but I rather thought honda were fairly neutral on the michelin thing having perhaps a longer view, and dani's defection was puig/repsol driven.

I don't attribute valentino's pre 2007 championships to sns tyres btw, I always took j4rno's and babelfish's point that the major contenders all had them, notwithstanding the seeming catch 22 element, in that to be a major contender you had to have sns tyres.

I continue to object to complaints about stoner having a tyre advantage in 2007 though. If he did, tough.

The number of Riders/Teams who had access to the SNS's remains a little bit of a mystery, the only thing I have to go on is Kropo stating that he knew of 4-5. A lot turned the opportunity down, like Colin, as they felt they couldn't ride them, or didn't want to take the risk.

Bridgestone did have the advantage in 2007, now this is obvious, and it is credit to them, with the aid of the supply reg also. Michelin's financial woes may or may not have contributed to their downfall even without the implementation of this reg, I believe though that if the reg was not implemented, Michelin would still have defeated Bridgestone again.

I'm a little nostalgic over the tyre war years, it would be very nice to see them back, instead of 'Here are three compounds' off you go.......Another supplier in the mix would at least throw up the possibility of possibility.....

kieran · May 10, 2012

chopperman said:
True but there are many who do live in countrys that have races. take barrymachine for example. He once said he doesn't go to races because of the traffic

many proclaim to have been fans for 30-40 years but never been to a race. These people moan and groanabout Dorna and the way the races are going due to economic times ect but dont part with a penny for there sport.

There is a ...... football club down the road from me called Pompey. This club is on the verge of being liquidated and oh how the "so called" fans are crying and finger pointing. Fact is most didn't pay and go to see there club play and this is the result.

Very few Aussie fans here have ever gone to PI to see a race yet they would cry if it were dropped. Oh its too far they say. Bollocks , ive flown the other side of the world to see a race twice. I flew to spain to watch a race then flew straight back home.

Some talk, some do. There is always an excuse if you want one !

Yes there is an excuse. 2011/2012 I went to India and Sri Lanka for 6 months. This year I've just been to Africa for 3 1/2 months. There's a lot more to see in the world besides GP's. I've been to GP's. I haven't been for a number of years and I doubt I'm going again any time soon.. I'd prefer to spend my money seeing other things.

Like Barry said, the tv coverage is excellent. If me not going to races makes me a non fan then so be it. I'll just watch races safe in the knowledge that I'm not a fan. I'll get over it. Like I'll get over being a non fan of cricket, rugby and rugby league which I very rarely go to but still watch on tv.

I'm pretty sure everyone would be crying if PI was dropped as it's arguably the best track in the world.

chopperman · May 10, 2012

Son of Doohan said:
Yes there is an excuse. 2011/2012 I went to India and Sri Lanka for 6 months. This year I've just been to Africa for 3 1/2 months. There's a lot more to see in the world besides GP's. I've been to GP's. I haven't been for a number of years and I doubt I'm going again any time soon.. I'd prefer to spend my money seeing other things.

Like Barry said, the tv coverage is excellent. If me not going to races makes me a non fan then so be it. I'll just watch races safe in the knowledge that I'm not a fan. I'll get over it. Like I'll get over being a non fan of cricket, rugby and rugby league which I very rarely go to but still watch on tv.

I'm pretty sure everyone would be crying if PI was dropped as it's arguably the best track in the world.

Well i hope this way of thinking doesn't become more common. Without bums on seats i can see more tracks going bust in the future and that's not good for the future of our sport.

Gaz · May 10, 2012

chopperman said:
Well i hope this way of thinking doesn't become more common. Without bums on seats i can see more tracks going bust in the future and that's not good for the future of our sport.

Rog, to be fair PI is one of the poorest attended races anyway in terms of real and total crown numbers (remove Qatar of course) as it genuinely only attracts around 30000 or so (from reports) and actually makes a loss on the weekends of MGP and WSBK (so it has been reported). I strongly doubt that many circuits on the calendar make a profit anyway with their respective races (no proof - just suspicion) and really DORNA do not care about the ciircuits either as they get their money from TV rights and only care about the marketing.

In Oz, to get to Phillip Island is an extremely costly exercise whether that be people flying, driving, riding or whatever method is used as PI is at virtually the extent of the mainland. For Perth people this means a 4000km one way trip, for Queenslanders 2000km plus (not sure what these equal in miles) and at the end they are often harrassed by local law enforcement or charged an arm, leg, kidney and first born for accomodation or facilities (foods etc). And this is before they get into the circuit or circuit camp grounds where often over zealous security guards on hitler trips ruin any fun.

Add to this of course is the PI weather which as we know has led to much discussion and all up, for many Aussies PI is simply an 'undoable' trip in terms of logistics as well as practicality, particularly in the present economic climate.

But, all that said you will find that many who do not make the trip will still support their local race clubs either as racers, officials or simple spectators and will attned the local meets held within their regions to get their 'up close and personal race fix'.

To say or to inisunuate that people who do not attend MGP are any less of a fan than those that stay at home is untrue as for many people they may well be an extreme fan, but for any number of reasons choose to enjoy the race from the comfort of home.

sewarion · May 10, 2012

Talpa said:
I'm a little nostalgic over the tyre war years, it would be very nice to see them back, instead of 'Here are three compounds' off you go.......Another supplier in the mix would at least throw up the possibility of possibility.....

It would be interesting to see how 'bad' the BS really are/have become since they are the sole supplier. Maybe one could put some WSBK Pirellis on a 2011 Suzuki.. just being curious.

chopperman · May 10, 2012

Gaz said:
Rog, to be fair PI is one of the poorest attended races anyway in terms of real and total crown numbers (remove Qatar of course) as it genuinely only attracts around 30000 or so (from reports) and actually makes a loss on the weekends of MGP and WSBK (so it has been reported). I strongly doubt that many circuits on the calendar make a profit anyway with their respective races (no proof - just suspicion) and really DORNA do not care about the ciircuits either as they get their money from TV rights and only care about the marketing.

In Oz, to get to Phillip Island is an extremely costly exercise whether that be people flying, driving, riding or whatever method is used as PI is at virtually the extent of the mainland. For Perth people this means a 4000km one way trip, for Queenslanders 2000km plus (not sure what these equal in miles) and at the end they are often harrassed by local law enforcement or charged an arm, leg, kidney and first born for accomodation or facilities (foods etc). And this is before they get into the circuit or circuit camp grounds where often over zealous security guards on hitler trips ruin any fun.

Add to this of course is the PI weather which as we know has led to much discussion and all up, for many Aussies PI is simply an 'undoable' trip in terms of logistics as well as practicality, particularly in the present economic climate.

But, all that said you will find that many who do not make the trip will still support their local race clubs either as racers, officials or simple spectators and will attned the local meets held within their regions to get their 'up close and personal race fix'.

To say or to inisunuate that people who do not attend MGP are any less of a fan than those that stay at home is untrue as for many people they may well be an extreme fan, but for any number of reasons choose to enjoy the race from the comfort of home.

You make some good points Gaz but dont talk to me about the ....... weather !

Maybe implying peeps who don't go as lesser fans is a tad unfair but the sport and tracks don't operate for free. It just irritates me when people moan about the state of things yet part with no money towards the up-keep.

lil red rocket pilot · May 10, 2012

chopperman said:
You make some good points Gaz but dont talk to me about the ....... weather !

Maybe implying peeps who don't go as lesser fans is a tad unfair but the sport and tracks don't operate for free. It just irritates me when people moan about the state of things yet part with no money towards the up-keep.

Could not agree more!

Last year at Silverstone Jumks Levi and Gator.

Strangers in a strange land!

Could have sat in Arrab's warm front room and watched the GP in comfort!

Did they!?

Did they Fcuk! They paid a small fortune, came to a GP, enjoyed a GP (despite been pissed on repeatedly)

And still had the graciousness to thank us for it!

Personally last year 5gp's in 4 different countries and got wet at every one!

Does it put me off?

Does it fcuk

Gaz · May 10, 2012

lil red rocket pilot said:
Could not agree more!

Last year at Silverstone Jumks Levi and Gator.

Strangers in a strange land!

Could have sat in Arrab's warm front room and watched the GP in comfort!

Did they!?

Did they Fcuk! They paid a small fortune, came to a GP, enjoyed a GP (despite been pissed on repeatedly)

And still had the graciousness to thank us for it!

Personally last year 5gp's in 4 different countries and got wet at every one!

Does it put me off?

Does it fcuk

You need to stop going to GP's FFS Red.

We have had enough wet races and weekends already

chopperman · May 10, 2012

Gaz said:
You need to stop going to GP's FFS Red.

We have had enough wet races and weekends already

The rain does tend to follow the english around like a witches curse. I was in Vegas in the middle of the summer. was told it hadn't rained for 3 years as i was stood on the pavement being soaked by a monsoon.

lil red rocket pilot · May 10, 2012

Gaz said:
You need to stop going to GP's FFS Red.

We have had enough wet races and weekends already

I know. I KNOW!

But I'm addicted!

BTW how many of you guys got a tent for me to kip in at your home venue?

I will bring my own sleeping bag.

FWIW I'm providing accomdation in my tents to total strangers at various venues and meetings around the uk this year through Powerslide and through friends that I've met previous to becoming a member on here.

Me casa you casa n all that?

Gaz · May 10, 2012

chopperman said:
The rain does tend to follow the english around like a witches curse. I was in Vegas in the middle of the summer. was told it hadn't rained for 3 years as i was stood on the pavement being soaked by a monsoon.

We have had a very wet summer over her and just when they tip more rain, in comes the dry spell

lil red rocket pilot · May 10, 2012

chopperman said:
The rain does tend to follow the english around like a witches curse. I was in Vegas in the middle of the summer. was told it hadn't rained for 3 years as i was stood on the pavement being soaked by a monsoon.

FFS you and me at the same venue!

I'll bring the yatch!

michaelm · May 10, 2012

Talpa said:
I'm a little nostalgic over the tyre war years, it would be very nice to see them back, instead of 'Here are three compounds' off you go.......Another supplier in the mix would at least throw up the possibility of possibility.....

I totally agree about more possibilities. Whatever advantage ducati may or may not have had and however rider dependent any advantage if it did exist may have been, there were still tracks where being on michelins was better, and there is little doubt of course that their qualifiers remained superior, and this definitely threw something more into the mix. I actually still think in view of this michelin may have been able to re-group eventually even without the sns rule.

Michelin going from being the long term dominant tyre supplier and a rusted on supporter of the sport to out of the sport completely after just one year of not being completely dominant was a very bad thing imo, and something for which I blame dorna and not the msma. If it was all posturing and they could no longer afford to compete financially as roger thinks then it is different.

Gaz · May 10, 2012

lil red rocket pilot said:
FFS you and me at the same venue!

I'll bring the yatch!

Dani can captain

lil red rocket pilot · May 10, 2012

Gaz said:
Dani can captain

.... that! I got my license!

Gaz · May 10, 2012

lil red rocket pilot said:
.... that! I got my license!

The truth is revealed

Hiya Alberto

xx CURVE xx · May 10, 2012

i think...

computer assist launch control,

cpu asst traction cntrl,

cpu asst brakes,

cpu asst wheelie cntrl,

cpu asst corner/hp/lean/power cntrl,

cpu asst engine mapping to track cntrl

cpu asst lower hp if tyre starts to wear out cntrl,

cpu asst just ....... pull the the ....... trigger i got this .... cntl.

is a bit much..

Talpa · May 10, 2012

Gaz said:
Rog, to be fair PI is one of the poorest attended races anyway in terms of real and total crown numbers (remove Qatar of course) as it genuinely only attracts around 30000 or so (from reports) and actually makes a loss on the weekends of MGP and WSBK (so it has been reported). I strongly doubt that many circuits on the calendar make a profit anyway with their respective races (no proof - just suspicion) and really DORNA do not care about the ciircuits either as they get their money from TV rights and only care about the marketing.

In Oz, to get to Phillip Island is an extremely costly exercise whether that be people flying, driving, riding or whatever method is used as PI is at virtually the extent of the mainland. For Perth people this means a 4000km one way trip, for Queenslanders 2000km plus (not sure what these equal in miles) and at the end they are often harrassed by local law enforcement or charged an arm, leg, kidney and first born for accomodation or facilities (foods etc). And this is before they get into the circuit or circuit camp grounds where often over zealous security guards on hitler trips ruin any fun.

Add to this of course is the PI weather which as we know has led to much discussion and all up, for many Aussies PI is simply an 'undoable' trip in terms of logistics as well as practicality, particularly in the present economic climate.

But, all that said you will find that many who do not make the trip will still support their local race clubs either as racers, officials or simple spectators and will attned the local meets held within their regions to get their 'up close and personal race fix'.

To say or to inisunuate that people who do not attend MGP are any less of a fan than those that stay at home is untrue as for many people they may well be an extreme fan, but for any number of reasons choose to enjoy the race from the comfort of home.

I have to agree Gaz, PI certainly is one of the most spectacular and best circuits in the world, probably only Mugello and Brno are in the same league. However it is at the end of the world, it is very expensive to get to, and be at, and there is not much to do outside of the track. I've made the pilgrimage a few times, and whilst retaining great memories, I would certainly be there every year if it wasn't so pricey, and closer to civilization.

IMO they could double those numbers if the GP was held in SE QLD (if they built a decent facility)......of course a lot of the new additions would also be fair-weather party fans, but hey-they pay the same as everyone else.......and no doubt a lot of the Spanish and Italians at Valencia and Mugello are not hardcore-so to speak.

Gaz · May 10, 2012

Talpa said:
I have to agree Gaz, PI certainly is one of the most spectacular and best circuits in the world, probably only Mugello and Brno are in the same league. However it is at the end of the world, it is very expensive to get to, and be at, and there is not much to do outside of the track. I've made the pilgrimage a few times, and whilst retaining great memories, I would certainly be there every year if it wasn't so pricey, and closer to civilization.

IMO they could double those numbers if the GP was held in SE QLD (if they built a decent facility)......of course a lot of the new additions would also be fair-weather party fans, but hey-they pay the same as everyone else.......and no doubt a lot of the Spanish and Italians at Valencia and Mugello are not hardcore-so to speak.

Agree Talps that if the race was held in a different location it would likely attract far more people but sadly that would mean the demise of the spectacular place that is PI.

That said, they have recently spent money on Eastern Creek and added some short distance so one wonders if the NSW gubbermint may make a play for the race to return (it has been rumoured) but the track in the old and new formats would not conform, to many walls and to close (I have already won a bet on these walls and effects to bike riders - teh very first weekend they were in play - sad).

frizzle · May 10, 2012

I'm at Philip Island just about every motorsport weekend, not just Motogp or WSBK.

The weather changes just about every 10 minutes, .... happens. Deal with it.

I'm the lucky guy being trackside, not the guy sitting on his couch, regardless of weather, there is nowhere I'd rather be.

It help that I'm a photographic nut as well I guess.

Search

Search

Is the electronic era illegitimate

Talpa

kieran

chopperman

Gaz

sewarion

chopperman

lil red rocket pilot

Gaz

chopperman

lil red rocket pilot

Gaz

lil red rocket pilot

michaelm

Gaz

lil red rocket pilot

Gaz

xx CURVE xx

Talpa

Gaz

frizzle

Similar threads

Recent Discussions