Hayden's bike

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Helix @ Jul 17 2008, 05:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So you're saying it was Hayden's fault that the bike ran out of gas?
And not the far more logical explanation, that HRC haven't got their act together yet?


And Honda did the right thing and told Nicky they did not have their act together on the Pneumo yet ........ for whatever reason.

Are you saying Honda said "here it is .... its all ready ..... we have no reservations at all" ...?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Jul 17 2008, 05:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Make a list of the people who don't believe this and you will have your answer. Its impossible to convince people who love the taste of sand and flaunt an IQ equal to their shoe size.


Oh very well ...... must we do it this way? .... I mean what with my smal IQ it will be very hard ... but here we go.

The queen of England
My daughter
Nelson Mandela
Valentino Rossi
Bruce Wilson
Garry Scott
Ken Duncan
Bonn Scott ( oh wait he;s dead ..... guess you'll be counting that one ..? )
Harry Butler
Mel Gibson ( no wait .... he actually might believe you!? )
Ernie Dingo
Jay Leno
Harry Potter


..



But really Jum.! does anyone believe it?

Once again Jumkie misses the point just to suit himself.
I am not blaming Nicky for the bike. I am saying that he made the choice against HRCs advice (you know, the guys that actually made the bike and said it wasn't ready) and now he is suffering because of that choice. But is he really suffering? Good qualifying means his pace has improved very well it's just now up to Honda to finish the jigsaw. But hey Jumkie, guess what? Nicky knew that all along. Open your eyes and ears buddy the conspiracy theory is getting stale and boring.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Jul 17 2008, 12:59 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>In case you are not aware, bikes in a one off prototype series are most decidedly always developed "specifically" for their favored rider. Find me where and who is developing a bike for some future mythical rider. They are not making bikes for the mainstream of society, they are making them for their specifically contracted rider to win.

Austin, I'm amazed at your post. You say Hayden might be experiencing more problems? Dude, have you been paying attention the last two years? To use a rider like Dovi as comparison is rather ridiculous. The guy is a type of Pedrosa, hello, of course he would be benefited from a design that was suited for somebody very similar to his style and characteristics. The points you have 'attempted' to make are quite the opposite in logic.
Realistically, Hayden could be having a lot more problems. At least his times with the pneumo appear to be competitive. It could be 2007 again where he was struggling to consistently find the top 10.

That's exactly my point. Honda have made a bike that will suit 250 riders. Smaller, easier to change direction, fast through the corners. Just because Pedrosa is the premier example of this doesn't mean it was designed specifically for him. It was specifically designed for a smaller rider with a 250 style. That pretty much covers the entire 250 grid.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Jul 17 2008, 01:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Have you actually convinced ..... one person ...... its the bike yet Jum?
It is the bike, or at least the motor. It's not complete. It's the same process that every other manufacturer goes through when introducing new engines. Just as Rossi's 2007 pneumo was a piece of ...., just as Suzuki's bike from 2003 to 2005 was a piece of ..... But don't confuse the potential with the reality. The Honda pneumo will eventually come good, just as the Yamaha pneumo did and the Suzuki is creeping towards competitiveness. The Honda will eventually get sorted, but it's likely Hayden will finish the season on a bike that will continually let him down.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rgvneil @ Jul 17 2008, 03:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Once again Jumkie misses the point just to suit himself.
I am not blaming Nicky for the bike. I am saying that he made the choice against HRCs advice (you know, the guys that actually made the bike and said it wasn't ready) and now he is suffering because of that choice. But is he really suffering? Good qualifying means his pace has improved very well it's just now up to Honda to finish the jigsaw. But hey Jumkie, guess what? Nicky knew that all along. Open your eyes and ears buddy the conspiracy theory is getting stale and boring.
Exactly. It's better that he show his speed and DNF while being competitive rather than cruise around hoping for top 10s.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/69209

Happy days for Hayden fans may be ahead.

Hooray!

A few thoughts on HAYDEN's BIKE.

It has widely been know that Honda built the bike for power and not for fuel conservation (Nicky ran out of fuel at Assen). Where as all the competitors built the bike for fuel conservation and now are working on how to squeeze out the power. Some say that Honda have built the best bike on the grid however the regulations fuel regulations arn't allowing its true potential. IMO the bike isn't built for either right at the moment or Hayden can't ride it like it was built to be ridden. Please correct me if I'm wrong here but there is no fuel regulations on practice and Qulaifying?? Obviously during practice they are working on race setup so if fuel is a problem the bike should be tuned to ride as if in a race circumstance. However, during qualifying which Nicky has been amazing at doing (do you disagree?) they need to tweak the bike for the greatest potential so that he can get the best position posible. This throws out all fuel regulations and limits on the bike. So it could be a number of things. Either Nicky can't ride. The bike isn't as good as they make it out to be. The bike needs a lot more testing to bring out its true potential. All of these are not good for Nicky unless he, his crew and Honda can make up leaps and bound over the next month or so.

I'm happy to hear he's in talks with Ducati. It'll either make Honda wise up or he'll find a bike he can be more competitive on. I will LAUGH MY ... OFF if Hayden on a Ducati beats Pedrosa on a Honda.....karma.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Doc 79 @ Jul 18 2008, 05:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>... I will LAUGH MY ... OFF if Hayden on a Ducati beats Pedrosa on a Honda.....karma.
I don't think HRC wants this to happen, especially with the Duc 848 priced so so soooo nicely (can you tell I'm getting one!?). Nicky is too polite, IMO. He keeps giving HRC a chance at gradualism in any offer/negotiations. Things will getty pretty crazy after Laguna!

According to the 'Soup (so take it with a grain of salt), rumors coming from Laguna are that Nicky is in bed with Ducati. The rumors range from a contract has been signed, Hayden has the contract but has not found time to sign it to Hayden is finalizing contract details. Not much more to the story, other than the usual 'Soup 'HRC never loved Nicky' dribble. Except a line that says something along the lines of 'those who know him, say Hayden will never ride for anyone but Honda'. But if you feel it necessary to check my work, you can read the "article" here.

Face it, Vale left because Honda management spent so much time chewing their own pyjamas and drinking their own bathwater chuffed in the ability of their bike.

After Vale left the arrogance persisted, but they haven't won ten races since then and Nicki won a championship with two wins in the season.

Even now the attitude persists

Honda needs to go back to the drawing board with it's HR stuff because they might end up a team that develops riders for other factories who treat them with some dignity.

Vale left as a winner, Nicki needs to leave and join Ducati to become a winner again.

---
I agree with Austin's remarks about HRC developing a bike that does actually suit any good 250 rider fairly well--that's a fact, still it's no proof that they didn't design it with a specific 250 rider in mind, more than others.

Actually, one could even say they designed a whole formula to suit 250 riders--the new 800cc--not just a bike!

About Nicky wanting the pneumo engine, I can think of only one reason for him to insist so much--he wanted to make his remaining races at HRC useful, training with something more similar to a desmo!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andy Roo @ Jul 20 2008, 11:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Face it, Vale left because Honda management spent so much time chewing their own pyjamas and drinking their own bathwater chuffed in the ability of their bike.

After Vale left the arrogance persisted, but they haven't won ten races since then and Nicki won a championship with two wins in the season.

Even now the attitude persists

Honda needs to go back to the drawing board with it's HR stuff because they might end up a team that develops riders for other factories who treat them with some dignity.

Vale left as a winner, Nicki needs to leave and join Ducati to become a winner again.

Hear hear, couldn't agree more, when Rossi was riding for HRC, they said he was a mere component of the bike, not the reason it was winning. There is no reason to believe that their attitude has changed since then, they have put all their eggs in one basket with Dani and I think the only chance
Nicky has of getting a good bike to ride is by changing teams.

Good luck to him!

I follow MX/SX quite closely as I do MotoGP. Hondas attitude can be clearly seen there also. Take Ricky Carmichael for example. Won several championships for Honda and instead of resigning him and doing a few things to the bike that he suggested they let him go to Suzuki. The rest is history. Honda hasn't won a MX or SX championship in AMA racing since he left. Don't look like their going to for a while either. It's the bike not the rider mentality runs the whole factory gamut.

BTW, I think they lost Nicky and Ricky the same year. Boy that was a real mistake.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Blue Cielo @ Jul 17 2008, 02:20 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Anything you say mate.. but this kind of statement is just BS... If you have a real proof then speak out rather than a cheap rumors around.
This is from a Speed.com 2006 article by Noyes- "America's Nicky Hayden won the 2006 World Championship with Honda but the Japanese manufacturer has admitted that the RC212V was built with a rider of Pedrosa's diminutive stature in mind. This admission shocked the MotoGP paddock since over the years Honda has traditionally built their machines to the specifications of their top rider? and Hayden is the first Honda rider to actually carry the number 1 plate in the premier class since Alex Crivill頩n 2000.

Honda, however, did not build their program around Crivill頡fter he stepped up to win the title after five times 500 World Champion Mick Doohan suffered a career-ending crash at Jerez in free practice for the third race of the 1999 season.

Honda instead set up a second team built around Valentino Rossi, and Rossi, after finishing second in his first 500cc season, then won for Honda in 2001 but chose to run his personal number 46. Rossi went onto to win two consecutive titles for Honda when the 500 class morphed into the 990cc MotoGP four stroke class.

Hayden joined Honda as Rossi's teammate in 2003 and continued in 2004 and 2005 as notional 'second rider' behind Alex Barros in 2004 and Max Biaggi in 2005.

In 2006 Hayden was joined by Pedrosa and won the title on the final day of the season when he finished third at Valencia and then points leader Rossi crashed early in the race and was only able to finish 13th. Honda insiders have told SpeedTV.com that former HRC President Suguru Kanazawa had picked Pedrosa as the rider of the future and intended to build the racing program around the Spaniard just as they had done with Rossi. "

There is also this tidbit from a different article by Noyes. -------- "In 2005 a Spanish paper published a article in which Suguru Kanazawa, president of HRC and the ultimate racing boss, was quoted saying, "We believe of all the riders at this moment Dani Pedrosa is the only one capable of beating Rossi."

I thought that was an extraordinary thing to say, even if it was true, because at the time his riders were Max Baiggi and Nicky Hayden. I suspected that it might be a false or a doctored quote, so I translated it into English and officially asked Honda if they would confirm or deny it. They wouldn't confirm or deny it. "--------
Noyes is a respected journalist in motorsports IMHO but there is other stuff out there if you want to read more. It really isn't an X-FILES. Hopefully Hayden goes to Ducati, it will make for more drama and hopefully great racing.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (J4rn0 @ Jul 20 2008, 11:54 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>---
I agree with Austin's remarks about HRC developing a bike that does actually suit any good 250 rider fairly well--that's a fact, still it's no proof that they didn't design it with a specific 250 rider in mind, more than others.

Actually, one could even say they designed a whole formula to suit 250 riders--the new 800cc--not just a bike!

About Nicky wanting the pneumo engine, I can think of only one reason for him to insist so much--he wanted to make his remaining races at HRC useful, training with something more similar to a desmo!
he does own a d16rr desmosedici street bike.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ROCKGOD01 @ Jul 21 2008, 10:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>he does own a d16rr desmosedici street bike.

Very interesting, where have you heard this? I watched his show on MTV but they didn't show that, just his stable of ex-championship bikes. (he puts it in the contract that if he wins the championship, he keeps the bike)

How come Hayden got beaten by Dovi on his HOME track? Especially when Dovi has never raced on the track before plus he is on old equipment and the same tires as Hayden? Something wrong with Hayden's bike? I don't think so. He posted the fastest Michelin shod time.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kawzx7R @ Jul 21 2008, 05:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Very interesting, where have you heard this? I watched his show on MTV but they didn't show that, just his stable of ex-championship bikes. (he puts it in the contract that if he wins the championship, he keeps the bike)
YEah I would have to look it up again but I think it was somewhere on crash.net. I read that he got one. Not sure if he purchased it or someone hooked him up with it.