Catalunya FP

Talpa said:

Don't you mean, 'he will no longer have to beat Rossi'

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Not something that is exactly presenting him with great difficulties currently.

michaelm said:

So rossi hasn't trash talked both honda and yamaha on his departure, and then proceeded to throw ducati under the bus as well? They do not perhaps constitute the whole of motogp, but leaving them aside only the crt teams remain , whom he has not had much time to denigrate thus far.



Rossi saying motogp is boring/no good is obviously different than stoner saying it, because well, he's valentino. My strong suspicion is that his problem is the same as that of his fans, that he is no longer winning.



You may remember that old skyhooks song, "Why don't you all get ......?"; I had thought stoner was too young to be familiar with it, but perhaps not. It seems to me to pertain fairly directly to stoner's situation and was not directed at their fans, as casey's comments were not directed at his own fans. You guys have been saying for years that if he doesn't like it he should stop taking the money and quit (along with calling him a one hit wonder who only beat rossi due to an extreme bike advantage in 2007 and would never repeat that championship, that one didn't really work out, did it). You have got your wish and you have been told. If you don't like it, tough.



When it comes to ass kicking, currency is all. There is also ass kicking, and their is ass kicking; 10 wins to zero is more substantial than 9 wins to 6, or 6 wins to 4 by most arithmetic.

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I bit touchy on this one I see......



Actually your getting the wrong idea, personally I'm very happy he's retiring, it's obviously what he wants-so be it. I'm in full support of his decision, I just don't like his attitude and never have, and the way in which he retired just confirmed my opinion, and its just that-an opinion. I was only referencing your little slight on the twitter comment, which you seemed to infer had some sort of weight in regards to Stoner's retirement rant, which I'm sorry-they can't be compared. You will find that the Rossi departure from Yamaha was actually probably as good as a rider changing teams could be, with only the Jorge Salary/development Issue that springs to mind for me. Hardly trash talking there, and somewhat justified given the nature of the incident. And Honda well, thats a different story.......Stoner did it with Ducati too-but I wasn't commenting on this-moreso the detractions of everything Motogp in his speech.....



Im sorry, but 2008-Rossi kicked his ass......2009 Rossi kicked his ass even more.....2010 Lorenzo kicked his ass even more-as did Rossi-even missing 4 rounds. No buts about it, how about 2006-Rossi kicked his ass then too-if you want to get pedantic-which you obviously do. And yes 2011 Stoner kicked Rossi's ass.

michaelm said:

Not something that is exactly presenting him with great difficulties currently.

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Well actually on current form, he failed to beat him last round, so yes very difficult when wet anyway

Talpa said:

Well actually on current form, he failed to beat him last round, so yes very difficult when wet anyway

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I would suggest looking at stoner's record against rossi in the wet, including on the ducati, would not be a fruitful line of enquiry for you.



I seem to recall high dudgeon from rossi against yamaha for their sin of wanting to give the world champion equal status and the same very substantial salary.



Stoner has never criticised any of his teams while under contract to them; this is known as professionalism I believe. He has directed any criticism of ducati subsequently not at the motogp team but at the senior management of ducati, and by implication the marlboro country man, and if rossi's was correct in railing against yamaha's ingratitude then stoner was correct in spades about ducati, as subsequent events at ducati with valentino's involvement have surely proven.



I am not necessarily saying anything valentino has said is wrong btw, just pointing out the usual double standard applied to him for similar or more excessive behaviour than stoner's.



And I agree rossi on a factory yamaha with extra virgin michelins did kick stoner's ass/arse (seeing we are both australian) in his rookie year on the lowliest satellite bike on the grid on 3rd rate/non-sns michelins, and would have done so on a 2006 factory ducati with the bridgestones suited to it. Since then it is not so good for your side of the argument; stoner 23 on a factory ducati v rossi 21 on a factory bike for a leading japanese manufacturer , stoner 12 on a factory bike for a leading japanese manufacturer against rossi 0 on a factory ducati.

I live about 3 hours west of Barcelona, and our weather is usually theirs latter on in the day.



Well, it started storming yesterday evening and has been all night. I predict a lot of wet at Montmelo!

Warm up - wet. Not raining but track is wet.

great saves by barbera and rossi in warm-up, front slipping.

Red Flag. Ellison's bike leaking fuel after crash and marshals couldn't extract it.

michaelm said:

I would suggest looking at stoner's record against rossi in the wet, including on the ducati, would not be a fruitful line of enquiry for you.



I seem to recall high dudgeon from rossi against yamaha for their sin of wanting to give the world champion equal status and the same very substantial salary.



Stoner has never criticised any of his teams while under contract to them; this is known as professionalism I believe. He has directed any criticism of ducati subsequently not at the motogp team but at the senior management of ducati, and by implication the marlboro country man, and if rossi's was correct in railing against yamaha's ingratitude then stoner was correct in spades about ducati, as subsequent events at ducati with valentino's involvement have surely proven.



I am not necessarily saying anything valentino has said is wrong btw, just pointing out the usual double standard applied to him for similar or more excessive behaviour than stoner's.



And I agree rossi on a factory yamaha with extra virgin michelins did kick stoner's ass/arse (seeing we are both australian) in his rookie year on the lowliest satellite bike on the grid on 3rd rate/non-sns michelins, and would have done so on a 2006 factory ducati with the bridgestones suited to it. Since then it is not so good for your side of the argument; stoner 23 on a factory ducati v rossi 21 on a factory bike for a leading japanese manufacturer , stoner 12 on a factory bike for a leading japanese manufacturer against rossi 0 on a factory ducati.

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Your only as good as your last performance, they say?



Your recollection is correct on the Yamaha thing in 2010, however the story more correctly told is that Yamaha cried poor to Rossi, and wanted a substantial part of his salary for extra development and resources-Rossi agreed, then Yamaha went and gave that money to Jorge-who at the time had not won a world title and Rossi had won the triple tuning fork 4 premier class world titles, on top of his other 3, with his much younger more inexperienced and far less successful teammate demanding equal pay/status. I would say fair reason for parting ways-of course at the time. The record still also shows that Yamaha chose Jorge, and failed to retain the title that they had converted for three years previous, and failed to retain a title sponsor, I'm sure someone there is really praying Jorge makes good this year and justifies the 2010 decision-which at present is looking likely.



Critique is critique IMO, if it wasn't for upper management and enormous sponsors signing the cheques, Stoner would not be there-nor would any of them-IMO the guys signing the cheques are far more important than the guy bolting on the fairing......and certainly far more difficult to replace. Not saying that these points of contention weren't justified for Stoner in 2009-10, but for some-this is just as excessive, even moreso considering the parties involved than what Rossi has perpetrated in the past-all depends on your POV



I would say the gap between the 2011 Honda to the 2011 Ducati was pretty similar to the gap between the 2006 M1 and the LCR RC211V-maybe worse even, but it still was an RC211V-widely acclaimed as the greatest racing motorcycle ever built. Only that Stoner was a hungry rookie back then and Rossi in 2011 was a 9 time world champion at the other end of his massive and incomparable career.........and around 12 years age difference.



Seeing as we are comparing, would you like me to bring up the 990 era as a whole? And the relative comparison between the two riders in their 125cc-250cc days? Maybe a rather fruitful line of inquiry for you........but as we know is also extremely susceptible to subjectivity.



And if we are to compare relative dummy spits and so on, I'd say you also can't compare Rossi's 15+ year dedication to the sport which has given him and many others all of the riches in the world, to the rider who has prematurely retired due mainly to issues with the media and the sports governing body. I'd say the identity of the rider who has had to deal with more relative negative consequences of so many reg changes in the past 11 years is unquestionable-and he isn't retiring-rather working harder than ever to try to get back on top with inferior equipment-all the while nearing his mid-thirties......this at least, is quite reflective of traits that a certain nation holds dear.