Ant West

Westy calls it as he sees it. Good luck to him, he's got obvious talent but no money behind him. Hope he kicks arse on the green machine. Go Westy!!!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Son of Doohan @ Jun 26 2007, 10:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Westy calls it as he sees it. Good luck to him, he's got obvious talent but no money behind him. Hope he kicks arse on the green machine. Go Westy!!!

Yeah...it’s about time that motoGP got back to how it use to be in the old days! Where riders were picked on their riding abilities and NOT there SPONSERSHIP riding MONEY! like some of the riders are going around these days and in the past few years! But I think (correct me if I am wrong) its turning around.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (vale4607 @ Jun 25 2007, 11:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Since were in 2007 and not 1996 i'll say that Gobert is ..... I'm not talking about "when gobert had it", this weekend, right now, dragging up a guy from the past and comparing him to a current rider is pointless. He had it, possibly a world champ, now he doesn't. Thats it.

I'm well aware that RL has tested the 990cc, well if you mean riding the 990 for a few laps a test, than yeah he tested it. Makes no difference considering were talking about 800's. What I'm saying is he should take this ride for what it is, fun!

I quoted superbikeplanet.com and he says he wants it to be a serious effort and isn't happy with "I know I wont win, but I want to go and give it my best effort". He should just go and give it his best effort, he wont ride it for the novelty of it, why not? Does he think he deserves more? Kawi will give him engineers etc but what does he expect from one weekend? Hes not a top line rider, the focus from the media may be on him, but the team will be all about DePuniet and West, as it should be. The whole ride to me is about novelty, media attention for Kawi. Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki and team Roberts have Americans. Kawi needs something to get a bit of attention.

This is an opportunity he may never get again. You make it sound as though GP rides are just waiting for him when he wants them. If the Kawasaki proves to be a competitive bike and stays competitive, they'll attract much better prospects than RL, so yeah I think this may be his only chance. He's 24 with no world experience, the only team crazy enough to hire him full time would be Kawasaki. These guys should only be "mainstays" if they can compete at the front.

My thoughts on Ant West were made in a previous thread. I said that Kawasaki made the best choice from the riders available. Lets take the roger colored glasses off.
Well we've both misunderstood one another. I was calling RLH an ....., not you and I missed the sarcasm, but I guess thats why they came up with these I'm a fan of Ant's, but not to the point of insulting anyone, well not intentionally anyway . I'm not sure he has what it takes at the MotoGP level, wait and see I guess.
Your point on Gobert is well taken I suppose, I don't necessarily see the point of bashing him but that's your opinion.

And as far as RL goes, firstly I don't have Roger colored glasses. The only glasses I wear stateside are those of the Bostroms. Secondly, yeah, you're probably right. It's probably a media stunt for Kawasaki to get some attention in the US. It's still an opportunity for them to see what he's got, the same way West's test in Barcelona was an opportunity.

Obviously his goal is to get to GPs but at the same time, if the situation is right then why go? It's the question every rider outside the series has been asking since the four stroke era began. It's the reason Bayliss left, it's the reason Toseland hasn't gone yet and it's the reason Mladin never went back. So if all that's going to happen is Kawi is going to give him a single ZX-RR and a couple of engineers so he can ride around, wear himself out, lose time on his AMA duties just so Kawasaki can feel apart of the action at the USGP, then why do it?

Don't get me wrong, if it were me I would jump at the chance. Then again, I don't have a Superbike to develop of a Supersport championship to win. There is a lot at stake for RL to put on the line just to ride around. If that turns out to be the case.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Antfan-If Ant didn’t make that mistake he would have been on the podium im sure..

Hi Antfan, well I think you have much to cheer about lately. Despite his previous struggles, it seems you saw something in West that many of us hadn’t seen. “If” of course means nothing in racing, but I get your point here. Despite his off-track excursion (which was totally understandable (keep in mind the man who some consider infallible god went off track too, not to mention Hayden as well). So all things considered (debut, set up time, team pleasantries, etc), I would say he kicked .... Good for you and your boy (sorry, I still don’t care much about him or his horrid hair, but he deserves props).

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Tom- he made a mistake trying to ride with them, but thats what its like at the top.

Hey Tom, good to be reading your stuff again. But I disagree here. I’ve noticed you don’t like the guy much, but come on, he gets a ride with the big boys and what, he should not try to ride with them? Uh, then what’s the point? No, I think he did try and like all wet conditions, the guys are on the edge and the smallest lapse of concentration can result in a mistake, as you saw that some did. I think it was great to see him storm up the field and pass riders with clear determination. Somebody thought him good enough to get a factory ride in this race and he reciprocated that faith in him by taking it to the limit.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>CSCVAW- You all have to remember that Ant ONLY HAD 4 hours on the Kawasaki all up on the weekend!!

Yes, which makes it all that more impressive. Oh, and didn’t he podium somewhere with no previous track experience? I think he may do well enough at Laguna, he seems to learn quickly.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>An4rew- He was very stupid to push it like that when Rossi pasted him, it was his first race so he should have just been keeping it nice and tidy.

Uh? Uhm? Do you like racing? Or is your point here in regards to Rossi? Well anyway, it would have been “stupid” if he had NOT passed Rossi knowing that he had a better pace.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Vale4607- WTF else do you think you're gonna do with one round on it ....., he doesn't actually think hes going to be competitive does he?

Hi Vale4607, I have read your posts and they are usually very knowledgeable and accurate. But your opinion here is confusing. Roger Lee is perhaps not the most accomplished rider up to par for your standard, but neither was Hopkins when he moved up to MotoGP. Would you have advised Hopkins the same thing when he was in the AMA? He came runner up only to his brother Tommy, who he just beat on an inferior bike, twice. Oh and this at Miller, what I would call a “real” racetrack. The AMA Superbike is a Suzuki Cup; Tommy is on a Suzuki and little brother Roger Lee just beat him on it (keep in mind there are other very capable riders on Honda and Yamaha who have not been able to nock off a Suzuki). Why do you feel Roger Lee should be so over looked? Perhaps Kawasaki sees something you or I don’t see other than publicity stunt. I think its rather cynical to think they would put this guy on a bike just because they want to put an American on their bike, after all, they are committed and invested in him, and they deserve to examine their young talented rider in what is considered the pinnacle of motorcycle racing.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Austin- The only real opportunity he ever had (prior to his Kawasaki gig) he pissed away at KTM by publicly slagging off the bike.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>The only glasses I wear stateside are those of the Bostroms.

Haha, well its hard to take off those very stylish glasses, eh. They just look great and the lenses seem to just glimmer with grandeur and elegance. Yes, I own a pair myself.

BTW, did you see that horrible off at Miller this weekend by E? Damn, what a dust storm.

But Austin, about KTM, they were not fully committed in my opinion to anything. They dumped West not so much because he called it like it was, but because he was right. Oh, keep in mind they (KTM) has a history of pulling the plug and leaving the rider out in the cold, lets not forget Team Roberts and what they did to the King. So as far as I’m concerned, KTM gets no free pass, so I’m not so sure West had his “real opportunity” with them. I’m not necessarily saying this in support of West (cuz prior to this thread, I couldn’t give one .... about him) but as I mentioned before, the guy didn’t get a fair shake with those turds at KTM.

That and he was interviewed a few times after the KTM had nearly KILLED HIM, the engine seizing at 200kph+ and spitting him into the gravel/wall etc.

As if your not gonna be pissed after that happened! KTM screwed Ant, thats the truth (gave him the bike AFTER halfway through the year then pulled the plug after two or three races.)

Ants getting what he deserves now and i couldnt be happier, as youve pointed out Jumkie.. As long as Ant impresses the people that MATTER (not you Rossi lovers in here) he will continue on the path to displaying the obvious talent he posesses.. Kawasaki have already expressed their happiness with Ants work ethic and team feedback, all he needs now is some regular dry time to sort the bike and he'll be right up there with DePuniet in the sheets..

Peace!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Racejumkie @ Jun 26 2007, 11:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Haha, well its hard to take off those very stylish glasses, eh. They just look great and the lenses seem to just glimmer with grandeur and elegance. Yes, I own a pair myself.

BTW, did you see that horrible off at Miller this weekend by E? Damn, what a dust storm.

But Austin, about KTM, they were not fully committed in my opinion to anything. They dumped West not so much because he called it like it was, but because he was right. Oh, keep in mind they (KTM) has a history of pulling the plug and leaving the rider out in the cold, lets not forget Team Roberts and what they did to the King. So as far as I’m concerned, KTM gets no free pass, so I’m not so sure West had his “real opportunity” with them. I’m not necessarily saying this in support of West (cuz prior to this thread, I couldn’t give one .... about him) but as I mentioned before, the guy didn’t get a fair shake with those turds at KTM.
Have I mentioned before that the Bostroms are the coolest riders in motorcycle racing today? Including Valentino himself. Just something to ponder if you have some spare time.

But back to Westy. I can't blame the guy for criticizing KTM and I think their track record is a bit sketch. However, despite what happened to him I think the right move may have been to stay away from the media. As I recall it was his public criticism of the 250 project that got him canned. By no means am I saying he should have sat there quietly, he should have let his opinion be known. Just not to the general public.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Jun 27 2007, 07:51 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Your point on Gobert is well taken I suppose, I don't necessarily see the point of bashing him but that's your opinion.

And as far as RL goes, firstly I don't have Roger colored glasses. The only glasses I wear stateside are those of the Bostroms. Secondly, yeah, you're probably right. It's probably a media stunt for Kawasaki to get some attention in the US. It's still an opportunity for them to see what he's got, the same way West's test in Barcelona was an opportunity.

Obviously his goal is to get to GPs but at the same time, if the situation is right then why go? It's the question every rider outside the series has been asking since the four stroke era began. It's the reason Bayliss left, it's the reason Toseland hasn't gone yet and it's the reason Mladin never went back. So if all that's going to happen is Kawi is going to give him a single ZX-RR and a couple of engineers so he can ride around, wear himself out, lose time on his AMA duties just so Kawasaki can feel apart of the action at the USGP, then why do it?

Don't get me wrong, if it were me I would jump at the chance. Then again, I don't have a Superbike to develop of a Supersport championship to win. There is a lot at stake for RL to put on the line just to ride around. If that turns out to be the case.

My problem with RL is he wants a 'serious effort' from Kawasaki. My impression is that a GP offer isn't enough, does he think they are going to give him instructions on assembly and make him change his own tyres? The fact that Kawasaki are willing to give RL a shot is enough. How much money are they sinking into giving him this run? Extra engineers, staff, promotions all for one guy. This is a serious effort any comment to the contrary is insulting to Kawasaki.

I honestly don't think the situation could be any better and I think he knows it, thats why hes taken the chance at Laguna. It might be a tough weekend setting up three bikes, but you have to take your chances when you can get them. Home track, no one tests there, couldn't be a better opportunity. The most likely outcome is he gets handily beaten, so why not enjoy the experience, push a bit, but take it and enjoy it, learn something, but don't tie yourself up in knots trying to figure the machine out. He could wait and maybe pick up a wildcard at Valencia, not the smartest choice. How often does a wildcard get a factory machine at his home round? He doing the right thing, just don't crash it!!!

Also the riders you mentioned were, are champions at a national or international level. They've ridden, competed and beaten the best in the world. RL hasn't done that so thats why this opportunity should be and has been taken with both gloves.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Racejumkie @ Jun 27 2007, 07:51 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Hi Vale4607, I have read your posts and they are usually very knowledgeable and accurate. But your opinion here is confusing. Roger Lee is perhaps not the most accomplished rider up to par for your standard, but neither was Hopkins when he moved up to MotoGP. Would you have advised Hopkins the same thing when he was in the AMA? He came runner up only to his brother Tommy, who he just beat on an inferior bike, twice. Oh and this at Miller, what I would call a “real” racetrack. The AMA Superbike is a Suzuki Cup; Tommy is on a Suzuki and little brother Roger Lee just beat him on it (keep in mind there are other very capable riders on Honda and Yamaha who have not been able to nock off a Suzuki). Why do you feel Roger Lee should be so over looked? Perhaps Kawasaki sees something you or I don’t see other than publicity stunt. I think its rather cynical to think they would put this guy on a bike just because they want to put an American on their bike, after all, they are committed and invested in him, and they deserve to examine their young talented rider in what is considered the pinnacle of motorcycle racing.

I never stated he should be overlooked for the Kawasaki ride. I had a problem with the statement of a 'serious effort', which I addressed above. Kawasaki have every right to examine their future talent and they've chosen RL and I have no problem with that. Its also publicity for Kawasaki, huge publicity, 2 haydens in MotoGP, the press scrambling to cover RL's first race, not to mention the director will be shining his light on Kawasaki whenever he can during the race weekend. I don't think we can underestimate the value of the Laguna round to Kawasaki in the US. Next thing you'll be telling me there isn't any politics in racing.

Sorry ANTFAN for hijacking this thread

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Racejumkie @ Jun 27 2007, 12:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Hey Tom, good to be reading your stuff again. But I disagree here. I’ve noticed you don’t like the guy much, but come on, he gets a ride with the big boys and what, he should not try to ride with them? Uh, then what’s the point? No, I think he did try and like all wet conditions, the guys are on the edge and the smallest lapse of concentration can result in a mistake, as you saw that some did. I think it was great to see him storm up the field and pass riders with clear determination. Somebody thought him good enough to get a factory ride in this race and he reciprocated that faith in him by taking it to the limit.

I don't see how you disagree with me, i too was entertained by West's efforts but am unsure ifhis approach is completely ideal for someone looking to learn and build a motogp career. My point was simply that he found people who can run like him in the wet and had to ride at a new level, he found that it is currently slightly beyond him. Perhaps he could have ridden a slightly more mature measured race, but then remember who spent most of 2006 crashing trying to run with the quick guys.

He didnt silence me thats for sure! he fell off and looked like a amatuer dirt bike rider in that sand pit! Everyone who finished that race in Doningtion is a winner i reckon. Honestly, who wants to ride a motorbike in the wet? Ant! He is a great wet rider but come dry he is just going to struggle.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Morgo @ Jun 28 2007, 12:11 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>He didnt silence me thats for sure! he fell off and looked like a amatuer dirt bike rider in that sand pit! Everyone who finished that race in Doningtion is a winner i reckon. Honestly, who wants to ride a motorbike in the wet? Ant! He is a great wet rider but come dry he is just going to struggle.

Ant looked great until that slight “run off” incident in the mud and even there I thought and he said also that he tried really hard to ride on and save it, but that surface as all of us know specially on slicks is just impossible to ride on at any speed specially when you’re doing 200 clicks and come on to that...yes the fall looked bad...but I bet yah if Ant would have come 2 or even 4 everybody would be kissing his arse...for gods sake he came 11th...I am not particularly worried about his dry riding as the man will get better with every race and I am sure he will prove his critics wrong but that is if Kawasaki pulls there finger out and don’t stuff him around with additional riders and rumours of Melandri or whoever joining the team for next year. That must be a put off for any rider.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (vale4607 @ Jun 26 2007, 10:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>My problem with RL is he wants a 'serious effort' from Kawasaki.

I had a problem with the statement of a 'serious effort', which I addressed above.
Ok. I think we just read his statement differently I guess. I feel like his comments were fair and not demanding. He is working on a championship at the moment and I think with his statement he was just assuring his team's effort and saying in effect, that he will concentrate on his professional commitments at the moment and will not be riding the wild card just as a dog and pony show, but rather take the ride as the professional he is. And so I think its a fair comment. It sounded like you felt he should do it and take the chance regardless of the degree he will be supported on that wild card or do it just for the “fun” of it--which to a certain extent I agree. Oh and about his worthiness, well Hopkins never won a Superbike title, and he’s doing pretty well. I agree with you that Roger Lee may not set the grid on fire on paper, but hey, you never know until you get the chance. I’m happy for him at any rate, and I do believe he will eventually get a title. Unfortunately at the moment (and I think I have read you concede this point on another thread) that if your not on a Suzuki in the AMA big bore classes, then you probably don’t have a realistic chance at a title. Unfortunately (or fortunately at the moment considering his wild card offer) being on a Kawasaki in the Superbike class is a major disadvantage. Look at Eric Bostrom (by no means a sloth) struggling to keep up with the Suzukis on his Yamaha.

I hope the homefield will be an advantage for him and he will be able to overcome the hype and lack of race support as a wildcard that event.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jun 27 2007, 03:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Perhaps he could have ridden a slightly more mature measured race
Yeah, I see your point Tom, but I thought he did ride a "mature" race, if by "mature" you mean willing to accept the faith that those have put on his ability to run with the big boys and tapping his wet race ability to maneuver up the grid. If you mean "mature" as in ‘taking it easy and getting a finish out of it’, well he did get a finish. Let me put it this way, had he not gone down and finished 11th, I still would have said it was a "respectable" and "mature" position to finish in. So that he did finish in 11th, with an off track excursion to boot, makes it even more impressive that he managed this position.

Oh, keep in mind it was his first MotoGP ride. So at the end of the day, there are guys that have been running consistently 11th-16th who have been riding in MotoGP for the last 8 rounds, therefore for West to have finish in 11th in his debut, is by itself impressive, that he did it with a visit to the gravel, well, to me that makes it remarkable.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Jun 26 2007, 09:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Have I mentioned before that the Bostroms are the coolest riders in motorcycle racing today? Including Valentino himself. Just something to ponder if you have some spare time.
I was with you all the way until you mentioned V. Haha. Nah man, V is certainly more accomplished, but the Bostrom’s trump his "coolness". If you see Rossi you think, wow, I just saw the most famous racer or something like that, but you see Ben Boz and you think, wow I just saw a rock star--and rock stars are way more "cool."

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Racejumkie @ Jun 28 2007, 11:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I was with you all the way until you mentioned V. Haha. Nah man, V is certainly more accomplished, but the Bostrom’s trump his "coolness". If you see Rossi you think, wow, I just saw the most famous racer or something like that, but you see Ben Boz and you think, wow I just saw a rock star--and rock stars are way more "cool."
Not saying Boz is more accomplished than Valentino, not by a mile. But even though Vale graces the covers of Italian Rolling Stone and GQ, Boz is still cooler. One hundred percent no doubt in my mind.

I don't think the Bostroms are that cool really. They are cooler than many other american racers, but there are coler guys out there for sure.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jun 29 2007, 01:24 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I don't think the Bostroms are that cool really. They are cooler than many other american racers, but there are coler guys out there for sure.
You have no idea what you are talking about. Every now and then you stick your foot in your mouth there buddy and show how little you know about a remark. Have you ever met them? Have you ever talked to them? Please, stick to stuff you actually know a little about. Saying the Bozation are not that cool is like saying Elvis had no style. .... stars think the Boz bros are "cool."

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Racejumkie @ Jun 29 2007, 10:34 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You have no idea what you are talking about. Every now and then you stick your foot in your mouth there buddy and show how little you know about a remark. Have you ever met them? Have you ever talked to them? Please, stick to stuff you actually know a little about. Saying the Bozation are not that cool is like saying Elvis had no style. .... stars think the Boz bros are "cool."

alright mate calm down, we clearly have different views of cool, thats not such a bad thing really. .... stars can think what they want, as can you and I (i think the new yamaha paint job is cool). I didn't say the Bostroms were not cool because they are, but in the greater scheme of things i think there are cooler riders out ther.

Have .... stars really got brains to think with?? You coulda fooled me, but hey I only watch for the ... and skip their obviously way too intelligent conversations.

Good Read Here.

Aptly describes Ant's struggles through his life and career, give it gas Ant!!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Son of Doohan @ Jun 29 2007, 12:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Have .... stars really got brains to think with?? You coulda fooled me, but hey I only watch for the ... and skip their obviously way too intelligent conversations.

Yes i think ".... stars think he's cool" is not a great way of convincing me about someone. Its not like these "actors" command much respect.

Awesome ride Westy!! Hopefully that may knock a few detractors! Hmmmm....where did de Puniet finish??