An interesting observation about Lorenzo leading Rossi

And if Pedrosa didnt have that weird dnf....hmmmm....I dont know who would win it...but i know that Lorenzo would be my last favorite. I dont know why

Problem here is that were the tracks the same as Rossi goes better at some, Stoner goes better at others, same for Lorenzo & Pedrosa so difficult to say for sure as i havent looked.



............oh sorry Dorna seem to like moving the bloody races around every season for some reason??

RCV600RR said:

I keep hearing the assertion that Lorenzo was leading Rossi after the third round(before Rossi got injured in the fourth round's practice at Mugello), and that this means Jorge would have outridden Valentino all season without the injury of the famous number 46. I'm not sure that this is a sound argument.



I checked previous seasons, and it seems that this trend has been consistent throughout the entire time Vale and Jorge have been teammates; Jorge has started the first two or three rounds better than Vale for all the three years that they have been teammates.



In 2008, Jorge finished: Second, Third and First in the first three rounds. Valentino finished Fifth, Second and Third,



In 2009, Jorge finished Third and First in the opening two races, compared to Valentino's two consecutive Second Places.



In other words, Jorge has traditionally started the season comparatively stronger over the first two or three rounds, whereas Valentino started to produce better results after this initial stage of the season.



The point of this argument, of course, is that the fact that Jorge was ahead after three rounds is not of itself proof that Jorge would have beaten Valentino, had Valentino not been injured.

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How about the added point that had Rossi won the four races he still would not have beaten Lorenzo

RCV600RR said:

I keep hearing the assertion that Lorenzo was leading Rossi after the third round(before Rossi got injured in the fourth round's practice at Mugello), and that this means Jorge would have outridden Valentino all season without the injury of the famous number 46. I'm not sure that this is a sound argument.



I checked previous seasons, and it seems that this trend has been consistent throughout the entire time Vale and Jorge have been teammates; Jorge has started the first two or three rounds better than Vale for all the three years that they have been teammates.



In 2008, Jorge finished: Second, Third and First in the first three rounds. Valentino finished Fifth, Second and Third,



In 2009, Jorge finished Third and First in the opening two races, compared to Valentino's two consecutive Second Places.



In other words, Jorge has traditionally started the season comparatively stronger over the first two or three rounds, whereas Valentino started to produce better results after this initial stage of the season.



The point of this argument, of course, is that the fact that Jorge was ahead after three rounds is not of itself proof that Jorge would have beaten Valentino, had Valentino not been injured.

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why are you so desperate to come up with something that makes people think lorenzos is somehow unworthy of being champ?and yes this means you think hes unworthy of being champ,all this talk about how rossi would have or should have implies that



2010 world champion : Jorge Lorenzo. by a considerable(!!) margin. try to accept it

Watched Eurosport's coverage of the opening of 'Motorcycle Live' at the NEC.

Tony Carter asked Lorenzo what he thought about people saying his title was a hollow victory because Rossi was injured.

He said that the people who were saying that "maybe do not like Lorenzo"



Perceptive guy

From Soup:

Spies' 2010 teammate, American Colin Edwards II was asked if Lorenzo being the first MotoGP champion who didn't previously ride a 990 MotoGP bike before winning the title was a big part of the Lorenzo's story. Lorenzo has only known MotoGP bikes to be weird 800cc machines. Edwards II dismissed that as a pertinent fact.



"Dude, he'd have won the title if he were riding a Hayabusa," Edwards said.

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Kropotkin said:

From Soup:

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I've always liked Edwards for his direct if not some times colerful quotes....I think that pretty much sums it up.

All this "Rossi could have beaten Lorenzo is pure garbage, fact is that

pedrosa was the only other possible contender, and Rossi could not have even beaten him.

BarryMachine said:

All this "Rossi could have beaten Lorenzo is pure garbage, fact is that

pedrosa was the only other possible contender, and Rossi could not have even beaten him.

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How is that observation in any way a FACT?

SprogTheDog said:

How is that observation in any way a FACT?

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its fact in Retardoland

SprogTheDog said:

How is that observation in any way a FACT?

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Read what I said

I did read it barry. Hense my question

BarryMachine said:

How about the added point that had Rossi won the four races he still would not have beaten Lorenzo

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I dont know why they feel they have to fantasize about what ifs between Rossi and Lorenzo, when the what ifs should be between Rossi and Pedrosa. They both had 4 no points races, and Pedrosa finished ahead in points. Lorenzo finished 6 races worth of points on Rossi, thats not fantasy land, thats reality. I guess dreaming of second just doesnt work in the land of yellow, ignore that position and maybe everyone will just forget that there was another rider that Rossi did not beat in 2010

L8Braker said:

I've always liked Edwards for his direct if not some times colerful quotes....I think that pretty much sums it up.

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The hayabusa quote in particular is both pithy and wry.

povol said:

ignore that position and maybe everyone will just forget that there was another rider that Rossi did not beat in 2010

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Well yes, its rarely mentioned that Dani beat Rossi to 2nd in 07. Not even the top Michelin rider

This is why i dont know why some people still see Rossi as an ubeatable god of 2 wheels - He aint & he never was either.



Over the course of his career he has made many mistakes just like every other rider in history not just on the GP grid.



He has however to go the other way won more titles in GP racing since the introduction of 4 strokes than anyone else by a country mile, fastest laps, lap records & enough BMW's from the M award to open his own dealership!



He is ...... magic but face it fans he is human just like the rest of us, i would of thought seeing the pics of him in agnoy in the gravel trap at Mugello would of put that one to bed.



Its the same as what i have also said of Stoner, Barry & others seem to think he is some sort of god on a bike - He is not!!



I said he has only won 1 title as that is all he has won - SO FAR. I dont buy the Ducati holding him back bollocks, too much detriment to thier own brand for that to happen me thinks although what do i know. He does deserve more credit than usual as he has done it on a difficult bike to ride, especially fast but thats it only once, even if he did embarras the rest of the grid at the same time!



Oh & while we are speaking of Ducati - Rossi has had all of a couple of hours at a track he doesnt particulaly like & has only won at once in his what seems his forever lasting career so give him a break (not Leg!), & just wait & see - Assumption is the muther of all .... ups!!

johnnyvvc said:

Rossi has had all of a couple of hours at a track he doesnt particulaly like & has only won at once

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is this supposed to be some kind of joke?winning a grand prix just once? to win on any track you need to be able to master it ,no matter whether you like it or not

RCV600RR said:

I keep hearing the assertion that Lorenzo was leading Rossi after the third round...



The point of this argument, of course, is that the fact that Jorge was ahead after three rounds is not of itself proof that Jorge would have beaten Valentino, had Valentino not been injured.

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It is an interesting point, as you say, but I'm not so sure its as significant as you assert.





BTW, RCV600, I don't particularly remember you being of a 'particular bias' around here, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and read its as not trolling. As I said, it is an interesting point, but it has very little to no bearing on the championship outcome for infinite reasons.

Hi Cliche



It was a rant against all the people who seem to think they know how things are gonna turn out in 2011 after 1 test.