Valentino Rossi

thedeal said:

Lets put in perspective,the two most exiting things in Moto gp this year are Bradl and Cal (everybody else is doing what they did last year)but instead of all the effort,media headlines and cash being used to get them on factory kit its being used to get an ex champion back to the top. Again bad investment.

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Actually no, Cal hasn't won a WSBK or Motogp title yet and can't even beat his teammate on sat equipment. And Bradl is still on Satellite Machinery so he's destined to kinda stay where he is, because of Repsol Honda and their Golden Boy Marquez.



The only riders that have beaten Lorenzo to titles currently are Rossi and Stoner, one of them is retiring and is self destructing as we speak. The only hope the series has for competition next season and to avoid a complete Lorenzo whitewash is to have Rossi on competitive machinery-no one else will ruffle Jorges feathers.

Otherwise by 2014, you will have no viewers left to show the new talent off too, simple. I guess to all the doubters and naysayers stating that Rossi had no options left other than Ducati, you've been well and truly sat on your ... now. Of course he has options, whether the haters like it or not Rossi is still the most sort after rider on the grid for many reasons.



The Marlboro stance now is quite detrimental to Ducati really, they are planning on walking away from a company to follow Rossi, I would imagine it would be difficult for Ducati to continue the Motogp program without their major backer.

thedeal said:

No you just completely missed the point.



There is no way trying to put Rossi back at the top is better for the sport in the long term over investing in up and coming riders that have many years ahead of them.



Its a ood job you dont run my buisness.

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Who said anything about long term, I certainly didn't. Perhaps you should go back & read what I said explicitly about my view of the short term.



EDIT: Here ya go

Goatboy said:

The way I see it Dorna are floundering about how to reinvigorate the sport, an attempt to put VR on a potentially winning bike is just buying them time to think something up/make CRT viable.

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You run a business? I'm surprised.

Talpa said:

Actually no, Cal hasn't won a WSBK or Motogp title yet and can't even beat his teammate on sat equipment. And Bradl is still on Satellite Machinery so he's destined to kinda stay where he is, because of Repsol Honda and their Golden Boy Marquez.



The only riders that have beaten Lorenzo to titles currently are Rossi and Stoner, one of them is retiring and is self destructing as we speak. The only hope the series has for competition next season and to avoid a complete Lorenzo whitewash is to have Rossi on competitive machinery-no one else will ruffle Jorges feathers.

Otherwise by 2014, you will have no viewers left to show the new talent off too, simple. I guess to all the doubters and naysayers stating that Rossi had no options left other than Ducati, you've been well and truly sat on your ... now. Of course he has options, whether the haters like it or not Rossi is still the most sort after rider on the grid for many reasons.



The Marlboro stance now is quite detrimental to Ducati really, they are planning on walking away from a company to follow Rossi, I would imagine it would be difficult for Ducati to continue the Motogp program without their major backer.

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Yamaha sure didnt think so. They signed their future and told Rossi he was more than welcome to stay, but not at the expense of pissing off, or running off Lorenzo. Actually, neither did Honda. They had an opportunity to dump Pedro and sign Rossi but didnt

I think this is a bad idea. If this is true & Rossi is taking Marlboro money with him to Honda or Yamaha, where will this leave Ducati. If they have no Rossi, they will struggle to find the funding for a Moto GP capaign. Hell, Yamaha can't even get a title sponsor. If Ducati end up pulling the pin on Moto GP because of this, I fail to see how it will be of benefit to the series.

The cold hard facts are that GP needs sponsor's money, and Marlboro obviously see something mutually beneficial for them and Rossi. They have pumped a hell of a lot of money into Ducati for one title and a .... load of broken carbon fibre, metal and hearts. If they take the cheque book to Yam and Rossi hits the front again it's win win for all concerned. If they keep pumping money into the duck, and it doesn't win any more titles, they could just walk away from the sport, taking cash out, which, like it or not, the sport needs to survive.



Whether we like it or not, it's a business, and money talks. I don't see Rossi having another title in him, but would love to see him back at the pointy end, and as many have said already, he is the rider most likely to take it to Jorge week in week out.

thedeal said:

Lets put in perspective,the two most exiting things in Moto gp this year are Bradl and Cal

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Disagree. Two most exciting things so far are Casey's retirement and the continuing Ducati saga. Cal has been mildly entertaining and Bradl is a story for the future if he can continue his current trajectory.

33 Coupe said:

I think this is a bad idea. If this is true & Rossi is taking Marlbro money with him to Honda or Yamaha, where will this leave Ducati. If they have no Rossi, they will struggle to find the funding for a Moto GP capaign. Hell, Yamaha can't even get a title sponsor. If Ducati end up pulling the pin on Moto GP because of this, I fail to see how it will be of benefit to the series.

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You assume Audi the new owners A. want tobacco money B. can't afford to fund it themselves C. cant procure a new sponsor.

How can Marlboro taking there money to an existing operation or one extra bike, which could result in Ducati folding & removing 4 prototypes from the series be considered win/win? If Rossi were to go the Coke sponsorship as rumoured earlier & Marlboro were to stay at Ducati, then i definitely agree with you. That would be bringing extra money into the series.

chopperman said:

You assume Audi the new owners A. want tobacco money B. can't afford to fund it themselves C. cant procure a new sponsor.

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Yes I am.



A As they have an association with .... through Playboy sponsoring a car in the DTM (I think), tobacco money shouldn't be a problem.



B They probably can.



C As Yamaha haven't been able to ink a sponsor when they are champs with a spanish rider, I think Ducati may struggle with no Rossi.

33 Coupe said:

How can Marlboro taking there money to an existing operation or one extra bike, which could result in Ducati folding & removing 4 prototypes from the series be considered win/win? If Rossi were to go the Coke sponsorship as rumoured earlier & Marlboro were to stay at Ducati, then i definitely agree with you. That would be bringing extra money into the series.

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What makes you think they want to stay with Ducati, We're half a season in and the Duc has received a swingarm that didn't work, electronics update, and they are just getting around to moving the fuel to centralize the mass of the bike. The promised updates haven't materialized and it took Rossi complaining to the media to even hear anything from Ducati in regards to a devlopment path. Yesterday's test was by all accounts another failure. Ducati may even have problems getting anyone to lease their customer bikes without making big cuts in the lease price.

hawkdriver said:

What makes you think they want to stay with Ducati, We're half a season in and the Duc has received a swingarm that didn't work, electronics update, and they are just getting around to moving the fuel to centralize the mass of the bike. The promised updates haven't materialized and it took Rossi complaining to the media to even hear anything from Ducati in regards to a devlopment path. Yesterday's test was by all accounts another failure. Ducati may even have problems getting anyone to lease their customer bikes without making big cuts in the lease price.

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Because they have associated their Brand with Ducati, not the riders. If they were likely to end their sponsorship agreement, they would have done it when Stoner was on sabatical & Melandri was at the back of the field.

33 Coupe said:

Because they have associated their Brand with Ducati, not the riders. If they were likely to end their sponsorship agreement, they would have done it when Stoner was on sabatical & Melandri was at the back of the field.

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Besides all that though would you personally want to spend your money on their under performing GP effort. I wouldn't under estimate what any company associates it's self with, Yamaha is a winner and can't get sponsorship. No matter what we all think of Rossi he gets a lot of publicity and that's ultimately what marketing is about.

I don't deny any of what you are saying. I just think it will be detrimental to the sport if Marlboro takes it's money & follows Rossi & Ducati end up pulling out due to lack of funding. Ideally, Ducati find a new major sponsor if they loose Marlboro & we have an extra bike in the form of a Rossi/Marlboro partnership.

33 Coupe said:

I don't deny any of what you are saying. I just think it will be detrimental to the sport if Marlboro takes it's money & follows Rossi & Ducati end up pulling out due to lack of funding. Ideally, Ducati find a new major sponsor if they loose Marlboro & we have an extra bike in the form of a Rossi/Marlboro partnership.

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I agree with you on that, it would be a major blow to Ducati and it could hurt the sport if Duc leave. I wonder if all parties involved understand what's going on and I hope they can do what it takes to secure Rossi and more importantly improve the bike by the end of this year just in case he does leave. I'd like to give Rossi the benefit of the doubt that he's going to give them more time before he decides to leave and he isn't just shopping sponsors to give him negotiating room for a better bike.

hawkdriver said:

I agree with you on that, it would be a major blow to Ducati and it could hurt the sport if Duc leave. I wonder if all parties involved understand what's going on and I hope they can do what it takes to secure Rossi and more importantly improve the bike by the end of this year just in case he does leave. I'd like to give Rossi the benefit of the doubt that he's going to give them more time before he decides to leave and he isn't just shopping sponsors to give him negotiating room for a better bike.

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i think 2 years was plenty of time for Ducati to pull their finger.

xx CURVE xx said:

i think 2 years was plenty of time for Ducati to pull their finger.

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I know and I really wanted to see them turn things around maybe they'll start moving for real now that things are looking so bad. There's always WSBK or they can do like lambo and just race themselves.

basspete said:

The cold hard facts are that GP needs sponsor's money, and Marlboro obviously see something mutually beneficial for them and Rossi. They have pumped a hell of a lot of money into Ducati for one title and a .... load of broken carbon fibre, metal and hearts. If they take the cheque book to Yam and Rossi hits the front again it's win win for all concerned. If they keep pumping money into the duck, and it doesn't win any more titles, they could just walk away from the sport, taking cash out, which, like it or not, the sport needs to survive.



Whether we like it or not, it's a business, and money talks. I don't see Rossi having another title in him, but would love to see him back at the pointy end, and as many have said already, he is the rider most likely to take it to Jorge week in week out.

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Spot on Mate

DORNA structuring the series around one 'superstar' rider, to attract his fanatical fan base, is a recipie for disaster. Rossi has proven again, he is the most powerful player in the entire MotoGP paddock. He is looking after himself, regardless of the outcome, and DORNA are blindly supporting him.



Name one other rider who would be arrogant enough to meet privately with the head of his teams major sponsor, to try to coerse them in leaving Ducati, and to support Rossi on his own bike. I agree it's good for the series to see Rossi back at the front (altho I am not convinced he still has the ability), but I would have a lot more respect if he developed the Ducati to the point it was competitive. That would be better for the sport, better for Ducati, and probably better for Rossi too in the long run.



Duc has paid Rossi Euro 14.0 a year, and I believe they have made every effort to accommodate his wishes within the limitations of their ability. Rossi (the famed development god) has put in a half assed effort, and achieved .... all in two years, with the bike no faster (relative to Yam / Hon) than it was when he started - (although Hayden has made gains in qual setup). Rossi is now struggling to beat the old spec satelite Ducati's with lowly rated riders.

Now Rossi decides he wants back on a Yamaha so is trying to take the Marlboro man with him to fund his new project. Ducati must be seriouly pissed (wonder if suddenly Rossi's bike might be less competitive against Nicky) !!!



There are probably a lot of younger riders and up and coming riders who have similar raw ability as Rossi. What hope have they got against someone with this level of power, and series organisers who are completely focused on accommodating one rider, for their own financial gain.



And PS, before the Rossi fanboys unload on me, I don't blame Rossi, and its not his fault. Its the fault of Scientology, and the Martians manipulating his actions for their own evil gain !!!

But I do blame Ezzy and DORNA for their total mismanagement of the series on so many different levels.

http://www.oddpic.com/data/520/medium/........-superman.jpg

BarryMachine said:

I beg to differ.



Coriolis forces can be massive.



Wrong use of VSG's in talking of the sensors. Scale it up a bt.



It does not give anything back on the return stroke ........ please think about that again!! Think wave forms which you are accustomed too, think a flywheel partially spinning then back the other way. In any case at any moment in time is what we are talking of here, not a medium/average ........ by you reckoning a guitar string does not vibrate

Oscillating pistons do affect the bikes ability to turn, thats what this debate is about ........ just because you do not understand it does not mean it does not happen.

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This has nothing to do with flywheels, Barry, and they use your magic word, vibrating structure Gyroscope, only because the device can be used to measure yaw. That does not imply that a vsg produces large motion-resisting forces.



Imagine the bike yawing about a point somewhere near its center of mass, some distance behind those evil horizontally oriented pistons. As a given piston descends toward the crank, its distance the to center of rotation will DECREASE, and it will give back it's angular momentum to the bike, in the same way as the classic twirling skater speeds up by withdrawing his/her arms. Conversely, a piston traveling forward will rob rotational energy from the chassis. The piston gives and takes as it goes about its business, and there are no doubt some residual forces that do resist the yawing, but they are very ....... small.



If your pet theory was true, an inline, vertical 4 cylinder bike would be damn near incapable of simply rolling onto a turn. The rider could counter-steer, hang off, whatever, and the bike would remain bold upright and promptly run off track. This is obviously not the case....