Troy Bayliss to test Ducati GP9

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (J4rn0 @ May 7 2009, 11:36 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Ducati insist these tests were long planned. They were at least semi-planned. It's not like they came out of nowhere. I imagine it was probably already in the works back then.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Hayden Fan @ May 7 2009, 05:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Like I said in another thread, Stoner has exactly 4 times as long with Ducati and the bike than Hayden.

poor excuses... hes not 0.5 off the caseys pace but more than 2 sec. keep trying.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Hayden Fan @ May 7 2009, 03:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Hasn't be been doing this for some time?
Not on subject, but It's good to see that you're coming back out of the closet with Chuck after giving Bruce the flick for a while.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Hayden Fan @ May 7 2009, 09:52 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Like I said in another thread, Stoner has exactly 4 times as long with Ducati and the bike than Hayden. If the bike still needs development work after the time, then Stoner really has some problems as well.

I'm not convinced it need "development" in the classic sense, but I do think Hayden needs to find "settings" that will enable him to go faster. This has nothing to do with Stoner's experience or development of the bike, its a matter of "setting" it up correctly.

This is very different from what was happening at Honda. Even then the riders were very much different too, but the issue was not simply set up disparity, but in that case it was more a "development" issue. Honda all year looked confused about how to get the most power in a peculiar chassis (made for a 98lber). No that was a "development" constrain.

I think the Ducati issue is different in that the package is clearly there, ie Stoner's results. The problem is getting the set up for Hayden that will allow him to repeat the performance (or at least come near it). Something that is an enigma because obviously Hayden is on a list of very good riders that have tried and so far not come up with a solution. My thoughts.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (39flat @ May 7 2009, 01:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Not on subject, but It's good to see that you're coming back out of the closet with Chuck after giving Bruce the flick for a while.

Bruce is fake. Die Hard (the original) was a great movie, as well as Pulp Fiction (yes people I have seen the light on this great movie) and a few others, but Chuck doesn't need bullets to get some ....

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Helix @ May 7 2009, 05:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Your original comment was about Hayden's development abilities, not his results.
Stoner has had a lot more development input into the Ducati than Hayden, therefore following your logic, it's Stoner's poor development abilities that have lead to the Ducatis problems, not Hayden's.

Your second comment about results had nothing to do with your first comment. Clearly you can't even follow a simple debate.
Problem for everyone else, not Stoner.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ May 7 2009, 05:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Really?

Helix, do you really want to "debate" Pinky/#27aus?

He sent me this PM with his new alias (as you can see I keep track of them on my signature):



The clown can't even spell out the place he is from (a bit too long of a word it seems). Are you sure you want to stoop to the level of "debate" (as you call it) that you will get out of Pinky?
Just a conspiracy theory, but does supershinya fall in the same category?????

Hey Jumkie...add 39flat to your list..

I don't know if Bayliss is the right guy to throw on the bike, but hell it's worth a try. Maybe they should throw Mladin on the bike, the engineers would certianly get some feedback from him.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (L8Braker @ May 7 2009, 10:38 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Hey Jumkie...add 39flat to your list..

Don't think so. Notice the capitalization of the sentence, the correct spelling of “conspiracy” and an attempt to use correct punctuation "???". Its really not that hard to distinguish Pinky's aliases, they all have the same theme, and the grammar is all the same.

But I'll keep on eye on him.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (L8Braker @ May 7 2009, 05:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Hey Jumkie...add 39flat to your list..

I don't know if Bayliss is the right guy to throw on the bike, but hell it's worth a try. Maybe they should throw Mladin on the bike, the engineers would certianly get some feedback from him.
troy corser would be a good one to help find settings.

It makes perfect sense, planned or not. Bayliss is a man who clearly has the talent and development ability to make a motorcycle go fast. It also won't hurt any to have another Superbiker's point of view on the matter. I'd expect Nicky's side of the garage will be taking close notes.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ May 7 2009, 10:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I'm not convinced it need "development" in the classic sense, but I do think Hayden needs to find "settings" that will enable him to go faster. This has nothing to do with Stoner's experience or development of the bike, its a matter of "setting" it up correctly.

I think the Ducati issue is different in that the package is clearly there, ie Stoner's results. The problem is getting the set up for Hayden that will allow him to repeat the performance (or at least come near it). Something that is an enigma because obviously Hayden is on a list of very good riders that have tried and so far not come up with a solution. My thoughts.

I think the Duc needs more than springs and valves and offsets adjusted.
IMO, there is something fundamentally unique/weird about the chassis; it could be it's natural frequency, rigidity, inertial moments, etc. or a combination of factors. If you look at Hayden (and Marco), they look stiff and slow going into the corners. You can almost hear them thinking, "WTF is this thing doing??" I think there is something about the bike that is masking or distorting the feedback felt by the rider, leaving them 'driving blind.' Casey has either acclimated to this warped feedback, or is riding it in such a way as to minimize it's emergence.

Everyone says it's the electronics that are messing up Nicky's corner exits. I don't see that. He's getting on the gas as early as anyone and is willing to hang on for dear life far longer than Marco did. If he's slower down the straights, it's only because of his reduced mid-corner speed.

If I was Nicky back in mid '08, negotiating a contract, I'd be telling Livio: "You can keep most of the the money, I've got plenty of Mr. Honda's. Instead, promise to plow what you'd pay me (1, maybe 2M??) into developing a chassis to my liking."

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Geonerd @ May 7 2009, 08:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>If I was Nicky back in mid '08, negotiating a contract, I'd be telling Livio: "You can keep most of the the money, I've got plenty of Mr. Honda's. Instead, promise to plow what you'd pay me (1, maybe 2M??) into developing a chassis to my liking."
Nicky's clearly not a rocket scientist. It's sad to see him suffer, but maybe he needs a very smart english speaking engineer to compensate?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Geonerd @ May 7 2009, 01:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think the Duc needs more than springs and valves and offsets adjusted.
IMO, there is something fundamentally unique/weird about the chassis; it could be it's natural frequency, rigidity, inertial moments, etc. or a combination of factors. If you look at Hayden (and Marco), they look stiff and slow going into the corners. You can almost hear them thinking, "WTF is this thing doing??" I think there is something about the bike that is masking or distorting the feedback felt by the rider, leaving them 'driving blind.' Casey has either acclimated to this warped feedback, or is riding it in such a way as to minimize it's emergence.

Everyone says it's the electronics that are messing up Nicky's corner exits. I don't see that. He's getting on the gas as early as anyone and is willing to hang on for dear life far longer than Marco did. If he's slower down the straights, it's only because of his reduced mid-corner speed.

Interesting Geo. Actually, Marco mentioned that he felt like he had not grip, as if it was "wet all the time" aboard the bike. Wht does this mean? Can we take something from marco's experience and learn something? Interesting because when you have some odd frequency (as you put it) it makes the rider feel like nothing is under them (in the feedback sense).

Again, that Stoner is making it work makes it hard to argue that its an inferior package (which is most often confused while discussing this topic). But the reality is nobody seems to figure it out how to make it work other than Stoner. Its an enigma. As you say, the problem may be in the chassis. Perhaps, but I feel confident that Ducati is trying to figure it out, day and night! This is the one thing that gives me hope. Something that was not present at Honda (quite the opposite actually). Ducati is a good situation for Nicky, its just not pie in the sky on results ATM. But I'm confident somebody is awake at night trying to figure it out.

A perfect storm has made the first two races a disaster, and not sure how much of that has spilled over onto Jeres, but its reasonable to think it has a bit (right?). The .... is that Ducati loves Qatar and Motegi, both of which were a wash for Hayden. If we would have had a decent result at rounds 1 & 2, we could then speak to the poor Jerez showing with a bit more insight. As of now, its only Jerez that we can really look at, and it was awful.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Geonerd @ May 7 2009, 03:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think the Duc needs more than springs and valves and offsets adjusted.
IMO, there is something fundamentally unique/weird about the chassis; it could be it's natural frequency, rigidity, inertial moments, etc. or a combination of factors. If you look at Hayden (and Marco), they look stiff and slow going into the corners. You can almost hear them thinking, "WTF is this thing doing??" I think there is something about the bike that is masking or distorting the feedback felt by the rider, leaving them 'driving blind.' Casey has either acclimated to this warped feedback, or is riding it in such a way as to minimize it's emergence.

Everyone says it's the electronics that are messing up Nicky's corner exits. I don't see that. He's getting on the gas as early as anyone and is willing to hang on for dear life far longer than Marco did. If he's slower down the straights, it's only because of his reduced mid-corner speed.

If I was Nicky back in mid '08, negotiating a contract, I'd be telling Livio: "You can keep most of the the money, I've got plenty of Mr. Honda's. Instead, promise to plow what you'd pay me (1, maybe 2M??) into developing a chassis to my liking."
Top post. I've only been torrenting races and finding the odd clip here and there so I haven't seen too much footage of Hayden but he looks quite timid on corner entry. As you put it so well, "WTF is this thing doing?" Perhaps the lack of feedback is something that Stoner has acclimated to and Kallio seems used to after his days on the ice. Although, I was quite confident Hayden's dirt track background would help him solve the issue.

hayden couldnt adapt himself on 800 bikes in 2 years time... it's laughable how his fanboys thinks that he will adapt himself on ducati without in season testing and with shortened practice sessions.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#27aus @ May 7 2009, 10:22 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>hayden couldnt adapt himself on 800 bikes in 2 years time... it's laughable how his fanboys thinks that he will adapt himself on ducati without in season testing and with shortened practice sessions.
What is laughable is how all you have to say is nothing but .... against Nicky Hayden. What a Moron for cripes sake.

Nicky has stated what the problem is. He can't get heat in the rear for some reason. Nicky has always liked good feeling with the rear. I think if they figure this out things will change.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ May 7 2009, 06:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Top post. I've only been torrenting races and finding the odd clip here and there so I haven't seen too much footage of Hayden but he looks quite timid on corner entry. As you put it so well, "WTF is this thing doing?" Perhaps the lack of feedback is something that Stoner has acclimated to and Kallio seems used to after his days on the ice. Although, I was quite confident Hayden's dirt track background would help him solve the issue.

I think it shows that the bike is not some freakish over powered machine. It is something that has to be ridden one way, and like you say, Stoner seems to the be only person so far to be able to really understand how to ride it.

The Ducati reminds me of the 1994 Benetton F1 car. You had solid talent in JJ Lehto, Jos Verstappen, and Johnny Herbert behind the wheel of the thing next to Michael Schumacher and they scored only 11 points compared to Schumacher's 92.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ROCKGOD01 @ May 7 2009, 11:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>What is laughable is how all you have to say is nothing but .... against Nicky Hayden. What a Moron for cripes sake.


hayden deserves nothing but .... coz of his performances in 6 seasons + 3 races on honda/ducati factory bikes.