Stoner unhappy with Austria run off

michaelm · Jul 19, 2016

JohnnyKnockdown said:
Judging by reports he would only wildcard at PI or Red Bull.
Why would he only wildcard on tracks he can do well at if he's only a test rider? You cant tell me there's no ego involved in those scenarios

Of course he has an ego. Justifiably so imo, more so than most currently on the grid, many of whom also have considerable egos, including Cal Crutchlow and your new bête noire Jack Miller.

Last year he wanted to wild card for Honda while Pedrosa was injured for whatever tracks that involved, at a time when even MM himself wasn't dominating on the factory Honda; it was said that the fact this would have involved tracks new to him increased the attraction of wildcarding for him which would apply to Austria. What is wrong with him looking to wildcard competitively if he is to do so (I agree with JPS he won't in all likelihood), given he has signed only as a test rider and given no undertaking to race in the first place? I think if he does wildcard it will be at Gigi's request to show the mettle of his bike, and the likelihood of this will increase if the current riders can't win and Lorenzo continues to look to be in a funk.

moto vudu · Jul 19, 2016

Jorge at the Red Bull Ring Museum looking for some inspiration...

michaelm · Jul 19, 2016

JohnnyKnockdown said:
Judging by reports he would only wildcard at PI or Red Bull.
Why would he only wildcard on tracks he can do well at if he's only a test rider? You cant tell me there's no ego involved in those scenarios

Of course he has an ego, justifiably so imo, and more so than many currently on the grid who also have considerable egos, including Cal Crutchlow and your current bête noire Jack Miller.

He wanted to wildcard last year, on whichever tracks were involved during DP's absence, at a time when even MM wasn't dominating on the factory Honda, and that this would have involved a new track for him which would also be the case for Austria was reportedly part of the attraction.

Why shouldn't he wildcard if he is to do so (I am with JPS in still considering it unlikely) where he will be most competitive anyway, given he is signed as a test rider and as far as is known has given no undertaking to race at all? Imo if he does wildcard it will be at Gigi's request and again to show the mettle of Gigi's bike, and is more likely if the current riders remain winless and Lorenzo continues to look to be in a funk.

povol · Jul 19, 2016

Gaz said:
The other aspect with the oft repeated comment that CS 'dodged' MM is that were it not for CS' retirement than MM would not have been on the Repsol factory Honda in 2013 and in all likelihood the rookie rule would not have been removed as it was only removed due to pressure from HRC as the result of CS' retirement and HRC's desire for MM on the factory bike.

One wonders what would have happened if CS was riding for the money and took the offered 20 million to ride in 2013 .............. history may be different in a few aspects

Red Bull ring would be because it is a track he has not ridden - he has made no secret that he would like to ride on tracks that he had not been to previously (COTA 2015 for one)

PI, well it is the home race and the best track in the world so why not.

If ego was involved he would still be racing and lapping up the limelight like so many others but instead he knocked back many millions to now be a part time test rider and ambassador whilst continuing to be the full time recipient of fandom ........ and the bane of so many 'fans', fans who continually say that he is in the past and best forgotten but who cannot forget him or the past

Had Stoner not retired, Dani was history. His retirement extended Dani's career at Honda for 6 years now.

Gaz · Jul 19, 2016

povol said:
Had Stoner not retired, Dani was history. His retirement extended Dani's career at Honda for 6 years now.

Maybe in the longer term but 2013 would not have seen MM on the official HRC factory team as HRC would then not have pushed so hard for the rule to be removed (they only started pushing once it became clear that CS was gone)

So MM would have arrived in 2014 and I reckon DP would still have been there (assuming CS left) as traditionally they will not replace both riders

He may not have lasted the additional 6 years with the new contract but I suspect at least 3 - 4 years

NJIRK · Jul 20, 2016

More livetiming:

https://livetiming.raceresults.nu/redbullring#screen-results

Richy56 · Jul 20, 2016

I like stoner, always have. But who gives a .... about these test times. It's so different on race weekend, the top lads aren't exactly going to go balls out on a test at such a crucial part of the season. The test will flatter stoner a bit.

Gaz · Jul 20, 2016

The times are showing a different story though Richy ............ some of the big names do indeed seem to be going balls out at the moment (as this is typed) with reality setting in elsewhere at the moment

Richy56 · Jul 20, 2016

Gaz said:
The times are showing a different story though Richy ............ some of the big names do indeed seem to be going balls out at the moment (as this is typed) with reality setting in elsewhere at the moment

Yeah see Lorenzo and Rossi have picked up a bit. They will be focusing on race set up, not a one lapper which others might do under the circumstances. I.e stoner

Gaz · Jul 20, 2016

Richy56 said:
Yeah see Lorenzo and Rossi have picked up a bit. They will be focusing on race set up, not a one lapper which others might do under the circumstances. I.e stoner

CS has only done 10 laps so hard to tell but from what I saw he certainly was not doing race simulations as in reality, it is not for him to do race sims but rather lap times

Richy56 · Jul 20, 2016

Gaz said:
CS has only done 10 laps so hard to tell but from what I saw he certainly was not doing race simulations as in reality, it is not for him to do race sims but rather lap times

Exactly

MdubSTYLIE · Jul 20, 2016

Gaz said:
CS has only done 10 laps so hard to tell but from what I saw he certainly was not doing race simulations as in reality, it is not for him to do race sims but rather lap times

If Casey is doing race simulation at the test, it would be the first time in his career that he has done so in any practice section. Maybe Lorenzo should be his coach.

Gaz · Jul 20, 2016

MdubSTYLIE said:
If Casey is doing race simulation at the test, it would be the first time in his career that he has done so in any practice section. Maybe Lorenzo should be his coach.

In all seriousness dubs, I do recall him doing 8 lap stints around 2010/2011 but they were rare.

Although that said, very few of these riders will do more than 8 - 10 laps as it simply is not worth it given their job is to find the best setup, thus they do a few laps, come in, get something adjusted and out again.

The only true race simulation is to race

MdubSTYLIE · Jul 20, 2016

Gaz said:
In all seriousness dubs, I do recall him doing 8 lap stints around 2010/2011 but they were rare.

Although that said, very few of these riders will do more than 8 - 10 laps as it simply is not worth it given their job is to find the best setup, thus they do a few laps, come in, get something adjusted and out again.

The only true race simulation is to race

It worked for him. I can remember old man simpson sitting in his pit box arms crossed waiting for someone to beat his time. As soon as they do the camera would cut to him stomping toward his bike to save the day so he could sit back down again.

Richy56 · Jul 20, 2016

Gaz said:
In all seriousness dubs, I do recall him doing 8 lap stints around 2010/2011 but they were rare.

Although that said, very few of these riders will do more than 8 - 10 laps as it simply is not worth it given their job is to find the best setup, thus they do a few laps, come in, get something adjusted and out again.

The only true race simulation is to race

Race simulation is important at this test to find out what type of Michelin there is going to be for the race. bad, worse or terrible.

JPSLotus · Jul 20, 2016

No better way to wake up than when I make my protein shake with 2 scoops of whey protein, almond milk, ice, liquid egg whites, and 2 scoops of 5% Nutrition Real Food. Even better is when I am sipping it, then I sit down in front of my PC, and see Dub whining about Stoner like usual. The saltiness is real. I could do nothing else for the rest of the day now, but still feel satisfied knowing Stoner is still pissing off people here.

Gaz · Jul 20, 2016

MdubSTYLIE said:
It worked for him. I can remember old man simpson sitting in his pit box arms crossed waiting for someone to beat his time. As soon as they do the camera would cut to him stomping toward his bike to save the day so he could sit back down again.

Thing is Dubs, the fact that he could do that shows just how good he actually was as he did not need time to build up to what was chart topping pace, not many can say that and not many can achieve what he was able to do in practice (in terms of how fast he got fast)

I remember reading a quote from (I think it was) either Gabbarini or Suppo who were asked about CS' preponderence to leave the pits, cut a fast lap and return as the question pointed or insinuated that CS could not be providing the team with useful data. The question was answered along the lines of 'we practice for pace and the fact that he can get up to speed so fast means that he finds the problem far faster than most riders, so why ride with the problem so he comes in to fix it'.

It may seem stupid to say it, but many of these guys just wish that they could get that fast as quickly as that way they could spend less time risking themselves by trying to find limits in practice and save it for the races.

Richy56 said:
Race simulation is important at this test to find out what type of Michelin there is going to be for the race. bad, worse or terrible.

True but race simulation traditionally is not 20+ laps but rather stints of between 7 - 12 run across a couple of times where they check the tyre after it has done the number of race laps.

This way they stress and then give the tyre a chance to recover before they stress again and so forth as that also gives a hell of a good impression of tyre wear as stress/chill/stress/chill sectors will work the tyre differently to stress/chill and pit

MdubSTYLIE · Jul 20, 2016

Gaz said:
Thing is Dubs, the fact that he could do that shows just how good he actually was as he did not need time to build up to what was chart topping pace, not many can say that and not many can achieve what he was able to do in practice (in terms of how fast he got fast)

I remember reading a quote from (I think it was) either Gabbarini or Suppo who were asked about CS' preponderence to leave the pits, cut a fast lap and return as the question pointed or insinuated that CS could not be providing the team with useful data. The question was answered along the lines of 'we practice for pace and the fact that he can get up to speed so fast means that he finds the problem far faster than most riders, so why ride with the problem so he comes in to fix it'.

It may seem stupid to say it, but many of these guys just wish that they could get that fast as quickly as that way they could spend less time risking themselves by trying to find limits in practice and save it for the races.

True but race simulation traditionally is not 20+ laps but rather stints of between 7 - 12 run across a couple of times where they check the tyre after it has done the number of race laps.

This way they stress and then give the tyre a chance to recover before they stress again and so forth as that also gives a hell of a good impression of tyre wear as stress/chill/stress/chill sectors will work the tyre differently to stress/chill and pit

Yes yes. I understand that he was so good that he didn't need to run enough laps to understand the bike late in the race. But imagine how good he could have been if he did? No way would it have made him worse to run longer stints.

MdubSTYLIE · Jul 20, 2016

JPSLotus said:
No better way to wake up than when I make my protein shake with 2 scoops of whey protein, almond milk, ice, liquid egg whites, and 2 scoops of 5% Nutrition Real Food. Even better is when I am sipping it, then I sit down in front of my PC, and see Dub whining about Stoner like usual. The saltiness is real. I could do nothing else for the rest of the day now, but still feel satisfied knowing Stoner is still pissing off people here.

You yoked bro, yet bro? Get do some squats and get back to me. Lets makes this an anti rossi all stoner day. Ill do my part by getting high all day.

Gaz · Jul 20, 2016

MdubSTYLIE said:
Yes yes. I understand that he was so good that he didn't need to run enough laps to understand the bike late in the race. But imagine how good he could have been if he did? No way would it have made him worse to run longer stints.

Actually yes it could.

He has a serious back/neck injury from hitting hay bales neck first after a fall in the 125cc class from memory so the more time spent on the bike the more that injury could crop up (and did from time to time but was laughed off as another excuse).

Plus, some people do not need oodles of practice to be at the top of their sport, they just need a fitness level that allows them to sustain their sport.

There are many stories of top class athletes who do not do as much training at their chosen sport but will turn up each week and maintain their excellence based on their fitness to compete which as you would know does not necessarily mean riding a bike as once you have the skills they do not go away to easily, but lose fitness and that is harder to regain.

Besides which, if he can go out hard and find the limit in two laps, his job is done so why should he go out and ride simply to circulate and waste the time of the team, himself and the equipment when they could instead be working towards the next step forward

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