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Spec MotoGP ECU available for 2013

Pigeon

Pigeon

Joined Feb 2007
6K Posts | 58+
Rovrum S,Yorks Eng
Spec MotoGP ECU available for 2013



By Sam Tremayne Wednesday, September 26th 2012, 10:12 GMT



MotoGP SilverstoneMotoGP teams will have the option to use a specification ECU developed by Magneti Marelli from next year.



The series' commercial rights holder Dorna has signed a four-year deal with the Italian company, which will provide, on demand, an engine and chassis control unit with all relevant tuning and data analysis tools.



While the spec ECU will be optional - teams will still be able to use their own custom-designed ECUs at their own discretion - the announcement comes in the wider context of Dorna's push for a single control ECU to be made mandatory within the next few years.



Electronics have come to play an increasingly central role in MotoGP, especially due to the fight to extract the maximum performance from just the 21 litres of fuel permitted for prototype bikes.



Dorna believes a spec ECU would bring down costs and improve the racing, although there remains resistance from the factories.



CEO Carmelo Ezpeleta hailed the deal with Magneti Marelli - which will include assistance at every circuit and continual development across the year - as a significant step for the championship.



"I cannot hide the fact that I am very happy with this new cooperation with Magneti Marelli," he said.



"The agreement reached we have reached with the Italian company merely validates MotoGP as a competition that incorporates and encourages the latest and most innovative technology.



"The experience of this company, which has spent many years at the highest level of competition in motor sport, represents a major step in the premier-class of two-wheel racing."



Robert Dalla, Magnetti Marelli's motorsport managing director, said his chief objective was to reduce the costs of such high-end technology.



"The main aim is to provide top technology at affordable costs, which is Magneti Marelli's mission firstly in racing and also in the field of series production," he said.



"We are very glad to share our know-how and experience in the motorsport field with MotoGP, in order to jointly achieve new objectives in terms of performance and technology development.



"This new initiative with Dorna represents a further strategic opportunity to enhance the development of our technology."



Honda has been one of the staunchest advocates of independent electronics, and has previously said that it could switch focus to the rival World Superbike Championship should spec ECUs become mandatory in MotoGP.



http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/102863



Good / Bad 4 year deal signed Dorna gonna push this forward now
 
It still gives the factory teams an advantage. Essentially by not making it mandatory it changes nothing. Unless their is a forthcoming rule tweak, or a rule tweak I haven't heard about.
 
The biggest problem facing MotoGP is the disparity in technology available between the rich teams and the less well-funded. This puts a top-end ECU within the reach of everyone along with experienced techs to help fine-tune the system.



The biggest performance issue facing the independent teams has been in the area of electronics - this move will help to redress that somewhat. The ART is pretty well-heeled in electronics from a general bike view, but nothing like what is available to the factory teams.



I imagine Marelli are bringing the best technology they have available - developed with Ducati over the last 6 or so years. It will be a step-up from the current crop of off-the-shelf ECUs the non-factory teams have access to.
 
Goatboy said:
It still gives the factory teams an advantage. Essentially by not making it mandatory it changes nothing. Unless their is a forthcoming rule tweak, or a rule tweak I haven't heard about.
Click to expand...



Im sure mandatory is right around the corner, they are just giving the CRT teams kind of a voluntary head start if they desire. Honda will stick with in house as long as they can, maybe using one of the underling teams as test rat for the spec ecu that will become mandatory in either 14 or 15. Question is, will they carry through on threat to walk.
 
povol said:
Im sure mandatory is right around the corner, they are just giving the CRT teams kind of a voluntary head start if they desire. Honda will stick with in house as long as they can, maybe using one of the underling teams as test rat for the spec ecu that will become mandatory in either 14 or 15. Question is, will they carry through on threat to walk.
Click to expand...

If they do walk will they walk to wsbk or just walk? Surely wsbk would be even more problematic, given that there is open bike equalisation by weight penalties etc.
 
“The agreement reached with the Italian company merely validates MotoGP as a competition that incorporates and encourages the latest and most innovative technology.







........, what if someones technology is better than the one you are incorporating.
 
povol said:
Im sure mandatory is right around the corner, they are just giving the CRT teams kind of a voluntary head start if they desire. Honda will stick with in house as long as they can, maybe using one of the underling teams as test rat for the spec ecu that will become mandatory in either 14 or 15. Question is, will they carry through on threat to walk.
Click to expand...
Totally.
 
ngads

pov

goat



sounds more like another nail in the coffin of World Championship Motorcycle Racing



and plenty of public / behind the scene .... flinging



nowt new here
 
Zootalaws said:
The biggest problem facing MotoGP is the disparity in technology available between the rich teams and the less well-funded. This puts a top-end ECU within the reach of everyone along with experienced techs to help fine-tune the system.



The biggest performance issue facing the independent teams has been in the area of electronics - this move will help to redress that somewhat. The ART is pretty well-heeled in electronics from a general bike view, but nothing like what is available to the factory teams.



I imagine Marelli are bringing the best technology they have available - developed with Ducati over the last 6 or so years. It will be a step-up from the current crop of off-the-shelf ECUs the non-factory teams have access to.
Click to expand...



Name me a racing serious of any sort any where in the world at any level (Club to World Championship) where what you have stated is not the case? The only ones you will find are spec racing where they hand the machine back at the end of the race.



So what are we barracking for? MotoGP as a spec racing sport? Turn up on Thursday and get issued your bike from Dorna then hand it back on Sunday arvo?



Essentially what Dorna have done is create a monopoly in motorcycle electronics that will filter down to all production bikes. In 5 years time there will be almost no differentiation in what is getting installed in production bikes because manufacturers will have no where to develop their own stuff. MM's stuff will get better and better and the competition won't be able to keep up. End result, consumer gets screwed as is always the case when a monopoly is created.
 
michaelm said:
If they do walk will they walk to wsbk or just walk? Surely wsbk would be even more problematic, given that there is open bike equalisation by weight penalties etc.
Click to expand...



MotoGP with horsepower limits -- $50M



WSBK with horsepower limits -- $15M



I don't see a dilemma from a business standpoint. The anoraks will be disgusted to lose free prototyping, but it's a no-brainer for board members and administrators. Imo, uncertainty is the only thing stopping HRC from bailing if a spec ECU is implemented. Can the weight of HRC increase the market value and viewership of WSBK? Will WSBK rules remain stable? or do they have capacity change in the future? If SBK has a capacity change, the value of Honda's SBK racing efforts could be undermined by 1000cc GP replicas.
 
Zootalaws said:
The biggest problem facing MotoGP is the disparity in technology available between the rich teams and the less well-funded.
Click to expand...



No it isn't. The problem (in almost all racing series) is that the manufacturers change the rulebook until their technological advantage creates the performance advantage they desire. Ultimately, the series crumbles as lesser teams, like Suzuki, withdraw b/c MotoGP creates the appearance that they can't build a bike to occupy the same space as Honda and Yamaha. Honda and Yamaha have no one to defeat so they mull withdrawal. Fans find someone other than the MSMA to blame.
 
mylexicon said:
No it isn't. The problem (in almost all racing series) is that the manufacturers change the rulebook until their technological advantage creates the performance advantage they desire. Ultimately, the series crumbles as lesser teams, like Suzuki, withdraw b/c MotoGP creates the appearance that they can't build a bike to occupy the same space as Honda and Yamaha. Honda and Yamaha have no one to defeat so they mull withdrawal. Fans find someone other than the MSMA to blame.
Click to expand...

Suzuki were their own worst enemy according to Gary Taylor. They even quit SBK while Haslam was leading the championship. They dont care.
 
mylexicon said:
MotoGP with horsepower limits -- $50M



WSBK with horsepower limits -- $15M



I don't see a dilemma from a business standpoint. The anoraks will be disgusted to lose free prototyping, but it's a no-brainer for board members and administrators. Imo, uncertainty is the only thing stopping HRC from bailing if a spec ECU is implemented. Can the weight of HRC increase the market value and viewership of WSBK? Will WSBK rules remain stable? or do they have capacity change in the future? If SBK has a capacity change, the value of Honda's SBK racing efforts could be undermined by 1000cc GP replicas.
Click to expand...

Sure, no business dilemma, and as you have argued at some level the board members, corporate management etc must have business motives, but the motives of hrc themselves have always seemed rather more obscure. The question is not whether it is reasonable for them to walk, but whether they will.



If you take them at their word the question is whether they can develop technology as effectively as in motogp, perhaps they can. Rules instability would certainly seem to be a problem for them as you say, they have been complaining about it in motogo this year.



My point was more that I don't think the current bike equalisation rules in wsbk where they can change the weight mid season etc would be something they would be keen on, building a completely new engine to take advantage of the then current rules as they did when previously competing in WSBK is more the way they like to do things. There does seem to be evidence that teams can still have technological advantages in wsbk though.
 
michaelm said:
It would seem unlikely that their motives are purely business though., since they are actually threatening to leave because of a cost cutting measure like the spec ecu in the first place. If you take them at their word I guess the question is whether they can develop technology as effectively as in motogp, perhaps they can. If their problem is no longer being able to dominate by having or developing superior technology, wsbk would not seem to be the place for them.
Click to expand...



I used to think that Honda was a tech company as well, but events since 2006 have basically dispelled that notion in my mind. I think the company is almost purely marketing-oriented. Competitors want a challenge and they want to have people to beat. Honda are paranoid that simplifying the rules structure will allow small companies to profit from HRC's brand/competitive-greatness. Like most Japanese companies, they seem to obsess over marketshare more than anything else. Growing a market is a foreign concept. Slighting your competitors is the definition of executive competence.



I really think the decision for HRC is about as simple as I outlined above. If MotoGP is rev-limited, and the goal is fierce racing with parity, why not pay 50% less to race in WSBK. WSBK also has a direct sales motive.
 
birdman said:
Suzuki were their own worst enemy according to Gary Taylor. They even quit SBK while Haslam was leading the championship. They dont care.
Click to expand...



By all reports Suzuki is a company with internal management woes, but I don't think their deficiencies preclude them from competing under a respectable rulebook. Furthermore, the Haslam reports were largely ignorant of the competitive environment in WSBK. The GSX-R1000 is outgunned even after the parity rules in WSBK, and the situation grows worse with each passing year. Haslam was basically demanding updates that wouldn't have changed anything b/c the bike was already wound to the popping point (as witnessed at Imola). Short of bore-stroke modifications, little was going to improve Suzuki's situation. They would have required an entirely new production engine during a recession.



Suzuki care, but it is difficult to show commitment when they are always on the back foot and behind the eight ball. They can't use vision to shape the future b/c they don't have the lobbying power that Yamaha and Honda have. Like Kawaski, they can only react to the hegemony of the two big MSMA hitters.
 
mylexicon said:
I used to think that Honda was a tech company as well, but events since 2006 have basically dispelled that notion in my mind. I think the company is almost purely marketing-oriented. Competitors want a challenge and they want to have people to beat. Honda are paranoid that simplifying the rules structure will allow small companies to profit from HRC's brand/competitive-greatness. Like most Japanese companies, they seem to obsess over marketshare more than anything else. Growing a market is a foreign concept. Slighting your competitors is the definition of executive competence.



I really think the decision for HRC is about as simple as I outlined above. If MotoGP is rev-limited, and the goal is fierce racing with parity, why not pay 50% less to race in WSBK. WSBK also has a direct sales motive.
Click to expand...



Surely competition is about beating your competitors. How do you beat your competitors? You out think, out train, out innovate them. This is all Honda has done. They have constantly tried to out innovate their competitors. They do more testing/training. They try to employ the best people. All this is done to win, to be competitive. How can this be deemed to be immoral? I would say that the likes of Suzuki were in it for simply marketing because they NEVER tried to implement the strategies that they needed to to win. The just participated.



The alternative to competition is entertainment. Just look at the crap reality TV. That is entertainment packaged up to look like competition. But anyone with more than just a couple of brain cells understands that and either just watches it for the entertainment or doesn't watch because of the lack of true competition.



What do you want for MotoGP? Competition or entertainment? One has to be the dominant ideology. In my opinion, Dorna have made the decision that Entertainment is their dominant ideology.
 

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