Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (frosty58 @ Aug 13 2009, 03:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2009/Aug/09081334ondmg.htm
schwantz weighs in......... scathing
No sugar coating there! He is right, Mladin is right, Spies is right, Hacking is right. How many big names in this sport has to tell DMG that they are fools before they listen. You could tell Schwantz was disgusted with them when he walked out of the press conference a month or so ago.DMG.either on purpose,or ineptitude, has alienated the people in the sport they could least afford to alienate. The fans,the OEM's, the current riders , legends of the sport and the media. Did i leave anyone out. I guess it was worth the gamble to draw that bike week crowd, huh guys! Some blew off Mladin as Matt being Matt,Hacking a hothead, OEM's a bunch of spoiled babies that wont play if they cant make the rules,Dean Adams a hack,Spies just backing his old buddies. Then Henny Ray and Kevin Cameron started asking pointed questions and got the Nascar cold shoulder. Now you have one of the most mild mannered legends of the sport just lambast your sorry ..., how are you going to respond. With the same old lip service and ........ double talk or can you admit you mistakes and take a different approach. Should be an interesting off season.
schwantz weighs in......... scathing
No sugar coating there! He is right, Mladin is right, Spies is right, Hacking is right. How many big names in this sport has to tell DMG that they are fools before they listen. You could tell Schwantz was disgusted with them when he walked out of the press conference a month or so ago.DMG.either on purpose,or ineptitude, has alienated the people in the sport they could least afford to alienate. The fans,the OEM's, the current riders , legends of the sport and the media. Did i leave anyone out. I guess it was worth the gamble to draw that bike week crowd, huh guys! Some blew off Mladin as Matt being Matt,Hacking a hothead, OEM's a bunch of spoiled babies that wont play if they cant make the rules,Dean Adams a hack,Spies just backing his old buddies. Then Henny Ray and Kevin Cameron started asking pointed questions and got the Nascar cold shoulder. Now you have one of the most mild mannered legends of the sport just lambast your sorry ..., how are you going to respond. With the same old lip service and ........ double talk or can you admit you mistakes and take a different approach. Should be an interesting off season.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DRILL @ Aug 13 2009, 03:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Someone should listen to Kevin,he knows the score........<span style="font-size:18pt;line-height:100%but they won`t will they.
sadly i think not... this is roger edmondson & bill france were talkin about here. they don't give a rats ... about bike race fans cause their plans never included us. the whole idea is to turn it into nasbike & attract a crowd they'll never be able to attract...... cause they just wanna watch things go in a circle & crash alot!
sadly i think not... this is roger edmondson & bill france were talkin about here. they don't give a rats ... about bike race fans cause their plans never included us. the whole idea is to turn it into nasbike & attract a crowd they'll never be able to attract...... cause they just wanna watch things go in a circle & crash alot!
Joined Mar 2005
7K Posts | 20+
Woody Creek
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Aug 13 2009, 03:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Now you have one of the most mild mannered legends of the sport just lambast your sorry ..., how are you going to respond. With the same old lip service and ........ double talk or can you admit you mistakes and take a different approach. Should be an interesting off season.
The sad thing is RE has admitted making mistakes but went on to say, and I'm paraphrasing, that the decisions had to ultimately be made by him. Essentially saying that he doesn't care what the fans, riders or manufacturers (well, outside of Harley Davidson) think.
The sad thing is RE has admitted making mistakes but went on to say, and I'm paraphrasing, that the decisions had to ultimately be made by him. Essentially saying that he doesn't care what the fans, riders or manufacturers (well, outside of Harley Davidson) think.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Aug 13 2009, 10:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Frost, Drill, they wont listen to Mr. Schwantz. Why would they, they dont know who he is.
Exactly
Exactly
Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
I find it rather weird that RRW didnt see this as news worthy.A legendary rider shares his thoughts on the state of bike racing in America and one of most well known publications totally ignores it. Then the owner of that publication chimes in on a club racing board and says this
Hey I know a lot of riders, and have worked with a lot of riders over the years. It is my opinion based on dealing with them that being a factory star does not always lead to somebody having a solid handle on what makes racing better or worse. What they really want, is whatever they need to win, even if it kills competition.
True enough statement if Schwantz was still racing but it kind of hit me as a politically correct version of RE's infamous "just because your fast doesnt mean your smart" statement. Schwantz is saying what the fans are saying,they want fire breathing factory bikes with badass factory riders on them. Ulrich basically says Schwantz is wrong and the fans want to see close racing. I am with Schwantz on this as is about 90% of the fans. Ulrichs statements are a tad bit self serving.
Hey I know a lot of riders, and have worked with a lot of riders over the years. It is my opinion based on dealing with them that being a factory star does not always lead to somebody having a solid handle on what makes racing better or worse. What they really want, is whatever they need to win, even if it kills competition.
True enough statement if Schwantz was still racing but it kind of hit me as a politically correct version of RE's infamous "just because your fast doesnt mean your smart" statement. Schwantz is saying what the fans are saying,they want fire breathing factory bikes with badass factory riders on them. Ulrich basically says Schwantz is wrong and the fans want to see close racing. I am with Schwantz on this as is about 90% of the fans. Ulrichs statements are a tad bit self serving.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Aug 14 2009, 10:41 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I find it rather weird that RRW didnt see this as news worthy.A legendary rider shares his thoughts on the state of bike racing in America and one of most well known publications totally ignores it. Then the owner of that publication chimes in on a club racing board and says this
Hey I know a lot of riders, and have worked with a lot of riders over the years. It is my opinion based on dealing with them that being a factory star does not always lead to somebody having a solid handle on what makes racing better or worse. What they really want, is whatever they need to win, even if it kills competition.
True enough statement if Schwantz was still racing but it kind of hit me as a politically correct version of RE's infamous "just because your fast doesnt mean your smart" statement. Schwantz is saying what the fans are saying,they want fire breathing factory bikes with badass factory riders on them. Ulrich basically says Schwantz is wrong and the fans want to see close racing. I am with Schwantz on this as is about 90% of the fans. Ulrichs statements are a tad bit self serving.
Im on the racing side. Spies and Mladin checking out was aweful for racing. You want badass bikes, go check out MOTOGP. I don't go to races to see the latest greatest traction control and $70k suspension along with the new slick tires. I go to see the best America has to offer race. Do i want to see them on mopeds, hell no.
Hey I know a lot of riders, and have worked with a lot of riders over the years. It is my opinion based on dealing with them that being a factory star does not always lead to somebody having a solid handle on what makes racing better or worse. What they really want, is whatever they need to win, even if it kills competition.
True enough statement if Schwantz was still racing but it kind of hit me as a politically correct version of RE's infamous "just because your fast doesnt mean your smart" statement. Schwantz is saying what the fans are saying,they want fire breathing factory bikes with badass factory riders on them. Ulrich basically says Schwantz is wrong and the fans want to see close racing. I am with Schwantz on this as is about 90% of the fans. Ulrichs statements are a tad bit self serving.
Im on the racing side. Spies and Mladin checking out was aweful for racing. You want badass bikes, go check out MOTOGP. I don't go to races to see the latest greatest traction control and $70k suspension along with the new slick tires. I go to see the best America has to offer race. Do i want to see them on mopeds, hell no.
Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SackWack @ Aug 14 2009, 01:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Im on the racing side. Spies and Mladin checking out was aweful for racing. You want badass bikes, go check out MOTOGP. I don't go to races to see the latest greatest traction control and $70k suspension along with the new slick tires. I go to see the best America has to offer race. Do i want to see them on mopeds, hell no.
Which comes full circle to the same old debate, was something wrong with AMA, or was Mladin and Spies just to damn good. I have always said it was that they were to damn good and things would take care of themselves once they were gone. When Mladin is interested, he still beats the field like a borrowed mule,when he is not,we get a closer win. When he is totally disinterested,someone else wins . He is more than likely going to end up with 13-14 wins on the season, how much better is the racing this year. I guess if they had used their heads and just beat the field by 2-3 seconds the last 4 years,everything would be rosy and we would still have real Superbikes.
Which comes full circle to the same old debate, was something wrong with AMA, or was Mladin and Spies just to damn good. I have always said it was that they were to damn good and things would take care of themselves once they were gone. When Mladin is interested, he still beats the field like a borrowed mule,when he is not,we get a closer win. When he is totally disinterested,someone else wins . He is more than likely going to end up with 13-14 wins on the season, how much better is the racing this year. I guess if they had used their heads and just beat the field by 2-3 seconds the last 4 years,everything would be rosy and we would still have real Superbikes.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Aug 14 2009, 10:41 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Schwantz is saying what the fans are saying,they want fire breathing factory bikes with badass factory riders on them. Ulrich basically says Schwantz is wrong and the fans want to see close racing. I am with Schwantz on this as is about 90% of the fans. Ulrichs statements are a tad bit self serving.
This is the portion that I disagreed with.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Aug 14 2009, 11:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Which comes full circle to the same old debate, was something wrong with AMA, or was Mladin and Spies just to damn good. I have always said it was that they were to damn good and things would take care of themselves once they were gone. When Mladin is interested, he still beats the field like a borrowed mule,when he is not,we get a closer win. When he is totally disinterested,someone else wins . He is more than likely going to end up with 13-14 wins on the season, how much better is the racing this year. I guess if they had used their heads and just beat the field by 2-3 seconds the last 4 years,everything would be rosy and we would still have real Superbikes.
Swantz says nothing about close racing in his interview as far as I can remember. yeah Spies and Mladin were that good and that was the difference IMO. I don't blame them for the demise of the AMA though and Spies may never have been noticed had the powers that control the AMA handicapped him in the name of closer racing, Mladin too for that matter.
For motorcyle racing to be huge in America it has to be a "good show" that a majority of casual people can take interest. I know, it's sad to say. If you want to gear the racing towards motorcycle enthusiasts then you are targeting a very small market IMO. This isn't going to progress the sport or clean up and establish premium motorcycle tracks. It sucks, but the die hard race fans can't carry the sport to the level that it has to be in order to fund the events and tracks. Somehow the casual fan has to be marketed without destroying the integrity of the sport. Something that RE is having a hell of a time doing.
This is the portion that I disagreed with.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Aug 14 2009, 11:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Which comes full circle to the same old debate, was something wrong with AMA, or was Mladin and Spies just to damn good. I have always said it was that they were to damn good and things would take care of themselves once they were gone. When Mladin is interested, he still beats the field like a borrowed mule,when he is not,we get a closer win. When he is totally disinterested,someone else wins . He is more than likely going to end up with 13-14 wins on the season, how much better is the racing this year. I guess if they had used their heads and just beat the field by 2-3 seconds the last 4 years,everything would be rosy and we would still have real Superbikes.
Swantz says nothing about close racing in his interview as far as I can remember. yeah Spies and Mladin were that good and that was the difference IMO. I don't blame them for the demise of the AMA though and Spies may never have been noticed had the powers that control the AMA handicapped him in the name of closer racing, Mladin too for that matter.
For motorcyle racing to be huge in America it has to be a "good show" that a majority of casual people can take interest. I know, it's sad to say. If you want to gear the racing towards motorcycle enthusiasts then you are targeting a very small market IMO. This isn't going to progress the sport or clean up and establish premium motorcycle tracks. It sucks, but the die hard race fans can't carry the sport to the level that it has to be in order to fund the events and tracks. Somehow the casual fan has to be marketed without destroying the integrity of the sport. Something that RE is having a hell of a time doing.
Joined Mar 2006
1K Posts | 71+
US
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Aug 14 2009, 12:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I find it rather weird that RRW didnt see this as news worthy.A legendary rider shares his thoughts on the state of bike racing in America and one of most well known publications totally ignores it. Then the owner of that publication chimes in on a club racing board and says this
Hey I know a lot of riders, and have worked with a lot of riders over the years. It is my opinion based on dealing with them that being a factory star does not always lead to somebody having a solid handle on what makes racing better or worse. What they really want, is whatever they need to win, even if it kills competition.
True enough statement if Schwantz was still racing but it kind of hit me as a politically correct version of RE's infamous "just because your fast doesnt mean your smart" statement. Schwantz is saying what the fans are saying,they want fire breathing factory bikes with badass factory riders on them. Ulrich basically says Schwantz is wrong and the fans want to see close racing. I am with Schwantz on this as is about 90% of the fans. Ulrichs statements are a tad bit self serving.
The factory riders speak for their own interests as well. Nothing wrong with Ulrich, being a satellite, sharing his views.
Hey I know a lot of riders, and have worked with a lot of riders over the years. It is my opinion based on dealing with them that being a factory star does not always lead to somebody having a solid handle on what makes racing better or worse. What they really want, is whatever they need to win, even if it kills competition.
True enough statement if Schwantz was still racing but it kind of hit me as a politically correct version of RE's infamous "just because your fast doesnt mean your smart" statement. Schwantz is saying what the fans are saying,they want fire breathing factory bikes with badass factory riders on them. Ulrich basically says Schwantz is wrong and the fans want to see close racing. I am with Schwantz on this as is about 90% of the fans. Ulrichs statements are a tad bit self serving.
The factory riders speak for their own interests as well. Nothing wrong with Ulrich, being a satellite, sharing his views.
Joined Mar 2006
1K Posts | 71+
US
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SackWack @ Aug 14 2009, 02:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>For motorcyle racing to be huge in America it has to be a "good show" that a majority of casual people can take interest. I know, it's sad to say. If you want to gear the racing towards motorcycle enthusiasts then you are targeting a very small market IMO. This isn't going to progress the sport or clean up and establish premium motorcycle tracks. It sucks, but the die hard race fans can't carry the sport to the level that it has to be in order to fund the events and tracks. Somehow the casual fan has to be marketed without destroying the integrity of the sport. Something that RE is having a hell of a time doing.
This is a good point. Who thought DMG paid for the rights to simply continue the pro-am dealer show format? Of course they're going to have a vision that deviates from the previous formula. However, the factories need to have some of their needs met as well, if they are going to support the sport financially. They can't be ignored.
As for the SBK rules, which would be more professional? Eight factory bikes and invisible grid-filler? Or a deep grid of privateers with factory support, perhaps a system where the factories offer up race bikes for sale to anyone willing to pay?
Sadly, at the end of the day, DMG has just stumbled all year, throwing non-existant weight around with take-it-or-leave-it leadership.
This is a good point. Who thought DMG paid for the rights to simply continue the pro-am dealer show format? Of course they're going to have a vision that deviates from the previous formula. However, the factories need to have some of their needs met as well, if they are going to support the sport financially. They can't be ignored.
As for the SBK rules, which would be more professional? Eight factory bikes and invisible grid-filler? Or a deep grid of privateers with factory support, perhaps a system where the factories offer up race bikes for sale to anyone willing to pay?
Sadly, at the end of the day, DMG has just stumbled all year, throwing non-existant weight around with take-it-or-leave-it leadership.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mr. Shupe @ Aug 14 2009, 05:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Sadly, at the end of the day, DMG has just stumbled all year, throwing non-existant weight around with take-it-or-leave-it leadership.
Is that it. Take it or leave it. Who will fund the sport if DMG does not. Will we even have something at all(honest question)? This year has definitely been a rocky road for DMG, although they are stubborn I feel like they will continue to work on the rules and try to mend ties that need to be mended. Let them get their teething out and see if they can come up with something better. I really think that they will reflect on this season as a learning year. ...., maybe they will fail completely nothing stopping anyone from starting thier own league.
Is that it. Take it or leave it. Who will fund the sport if DMG does not. Will we even have something at all(honest question)? This year has definitely been a rocky road for DMG, although they are stubborn I feel like they will continue to work on the rules and try to mend ties that need to be mended. Let them get their teething out and see if they can come up with something better. I really think that they will reflect on this season as a learning year. ...., maybe they will fail completely nothing stopping anyone from starting thier own league.
What is stopping the AMA from racing fire breathing dragons?
The tracks.
Who has the money and the influence to modify runoff and venue owners to make modifications?
DMG and the big 4 manufacturers. So far DMG have done there part by trying to get upgrades at facilities, but the manufacturers have not. Even though their budgets have been yanked, the manufacturers still can't get away from racing in the middle of nowhere (half the time) and paying SpeedTV to televise their live advertisements.
If the tracks are made safer, and the manufacturers can work with DMG to get venues nearer to major population areas, why would DMG care if the big 4 had a class with high technical sophistication and low parity?
This isn't car racing. NASCAR can't run Indy-like cars b/c the IRL already have that market cornered. DMG already tried to improve sports car racing and they are mired in an ambiguous battle with ALMS. Motorcycling doesn't have those problems, the AMA is one sanctioning body for pro racing (more or less). If DMG want to run close parity superbike races they can still allow the manufacturers to horse around in a technical class that is designed to advertise and boost riders into WSBK.
"Real" superbikes can't return until the big 4 quit crying, Schwantz too. What good are his comments doing for the sport? As much as I like him, he's just another person who's embarrassed by the jam we've worked ourselves into.
Welcome to the club Kevin, I'm embarrassed it took you this long to realize the AMA was ruined!
The tracks.
Who has the money and the influence to modify runoff and venue owners to make modifications?
DMG and the big 4 manufacturers. So far DMG have done there part by trying to get upgrades at facilities, but the manufacturers have not. Even though their budgets have been yanked, the manufacturers still can't get away from racing in the middle of nowhere (half the time) and paying SpeedTV to televise their live advertisements.
If the tracks are made safer, and the manufacturers can work with DMG to get venues nearer to major population areas, why would DMG care if the big 4 had a class with high technical sophistication and low parity?
This isn't car racing. NASCAR can't run Indy-like cars b/c the IRL already have that market cornered. DMG already tried to improve sports car racing and they are mired in an ambiguous battle with ALMS. Motorcycling doesn't have those problems, the AMA is one sanctioning body for pro racing (more or less). If DMG want to run close parity superbike races they can still allow the manufacturers to horse around in a technical class that is designed to advertise and boost riders into WSBK.
"Real" superbikes can't return until the big 4 quit crying, Schwantz too. What good are his comments doing for the sport? As much as I like him, he's just another person who's embarrassed by the jam we've worked ourselves into.
Welcome to the club Kevin, I'm embarrassed it took you this long to realize the AMA was ruined!
Joined Oct 2006
25K Posts | 4K+
Your Mom's House
From crash interview. Asked if he (Mr. Schwantz) might be interested in running a team for AMA. His reply:
"No way at all, any chance, no direction, no chance, no way, no how would I do anything AMA."
Don't hold back Mr. Schwantz, tell us what you really think of DMG.
"No way at all, any chance, no direction, no chance, no way, no how would I do anything AMA."
Don't hold back Mr. Schwantz, tell us what you really think of DMG.
