Noyes Article on Speed

Jumkie · Mar 8, 2011

Talpa said:
Interesting, at least 06 to 0.9 per lap from the box........that makes everyone else's test times look very competitive, and as many reasonable viewpoints have suggested, Honda has just raised the bar significantly.

There you go little buddy, 'excuse in a box'.

In order to win though, one must first finish. I'd prefer not to doomsday the season yet.

A cliche we've never heard. How many times you gonna remind us that Stoner crashed without qualifying it? I'll remind you when your boy has his first front end crash.

Maybe VR is the lucky Alien by not piloting a Japanese machine, if what Kropo says is true and their cultural attitudes may be affecting the competition this year........one can only hope though that this is not only not true but not possible.....

I agree with you there. It'd seem this would make all our conspiracy theories pale in comparison, wouldn't it?

Jumkie · Mar 8, 2011

Sarita said:
It's not hindsight, it is perhaps complacence (which thankfully Rossi does not possess). There will not have been a new gear box technology at all had Vale remained with Honda. He may have won many years with them, and losing a year or two will not have driven them to take this big innovative leaps. I could be wrong, but this is a desperate measure by Honda to win this last 800cc crown on a war footing. Look at the space race, we'd never have made it to the moon had it not been for the stifling competition by the Soviet Union that made politically astute leaders take drastic steps in scientific innovation. Now, I wonder if we will even go beyond earth orbit ever again - I'd love to be proven wrong though

.

With all due respect Sari, I think this "innovative leap" is just a natural consequence of technological advancement.

mylexicon · Mar 8, 2011

Shows how pathetic MotoGP has become, imo. In the past teams were building new high performance engines, and designing new bikes around them. The sport has become so stagnant due to the 21L rule and the tightening engine regulations that teams believe the key to winning is gearboxes and electronics.

This is exactly what the manufacturers wanted. Stagnation (they call it "stability") and development spending on "sporting" technology like partial throttle fuel efficiency, lean burn air-fuel mixtures, engine temperature control, and instant shift gearboxes. The Japanese motorcycle executives are quite possibly the least intelligent human beings in the developed world.

BHarvey · Mar 8, 2011

Yes, stability, lower costs, easy to work on machines sans TC,WC,LC and whatever other C they have now.

Sounds a lot like they should have stayed with the 500's........

A GP bike, much like an F1 car, should NOT be easy to operate.

Don't get me wrong as I am not saying I could but remember when Edwards asked his team to turn all the rider aids off.

He said it was totally unrideable.

Talpa · Mar 8, 2011

Jumkie said:
A cliche we've never heard. How many times you gonna remind us that Stoner crashed without qualifying it? I'll remind you when your boy has his first front end crash.

How many times are you and the Boners going to tell us how he going to wipe the field before a wheel has turned in competition, when his record is there for all to see. Sounds very much like what others are accused of........

Jumkie said:
I agree with you there. It'd seem this would make all our conspiracy theories pale in comparison, wouldn't it?

Yes indeed, it would have to go down as a serious sport killer if true.

sarita · Mar 8, 2011

Jumkie said:
With all due respect Sari, I think this "innovative leap" is just a natural consequence of technological advancement.

I quite agree, but why does technological advancement only happen at Rossi-nemesis teams, with Rossi, JB and co always playing catch up? Except for marginal superiority in Rossi's early Honda years and the 2009/2010 Yamaha, primarily in engine reliability rather than niche technological superiority, it is always the nemesis coming up with ground-breaking innovation. I like the dichotomy, but just wish we see both new technology and a level-playing field; and for both ends to thrive, there is always someone playing catch-up on the grid which inevitably happens to be Rossi and now Jorge to some degree and the saga continues..

I do give ample credit to Stoner, who amidst all this and beating all odds, manages to pull off a fast lap on almost anything. I however admire Rossi's calculated ways at the end of the day albeit

.

Jumkie · Mar 8, 2011

Sarita said:
I quite agree, but why does technological advancement only happen at Rossi-nemesis teams...

Well some innovations may sound nifty, but sometimes didn't turn out so great and took time to develop. Take the pneumatic valves for example, this was too keep up with Ducati's desmodronics, not Rossi. Then lets take a look at the M1 the last three season, most other manufactures were trying to find the code for its great handling. So I don't think Yamaha was playing catch up, an for the last few years was actually leading the bunch.

Tom · Mar 9, 2011

mylexicon said:
Shows how pathetic MotoGP has become, imo. In the past teams were building new high performance engines, and designing new bikes around them. The sport has become so stagnant due to the 21L rule and the tightening engine regulations that teams believe the key to winning is gearboxes and electronics.

What? You are complaining that the manufacturers are developing technology to make their bikes faster because it represents stagnation. As for teams in the past building new high performance engines and developing new bikes around them, the 800cc engines have lasted the same 5 years as the 990 engines before them. Before that most of the teams were using fundamentally the same engine for considerably longer.

Sarita said:
Except for marginal superiority in Rossi's early Honda years and the 2009/2010 Yamaha

Marginal??

sarita · Mar 9, 2011

Tom said:
Marginal??

Yes, I reckon that the Honda was simply more robust and better performing only due to great reliability, but nothing very different in design from the rest to make news like the carbon fibre saga at Ducati or this new gearbox thing by Honda.

Tom · Mar 9, 2011

Sarita said:
Yes, I reckon that the Honda was simply more robust and better performing only due to great reliability, but nothing very different in design from the rest to make news like the carbon fibre saga at Ducati or this new gearbox thing by Honda.

Well i disagree, from my memory the V5 Honda was considerably superior in 02 and 03 with other bikes bareley getting a look in.

Jumkie · Mar 9, 2011

Tom said:
Well i disagree, from my memory the V5 Honda was considerably superior in 02 and 03 with other bikes bareley getting a look in.

Sometimes we forget things with time. Like how the Ducati is complete crap.

LINK LINK2

mylexicon · Mar 9, 2011

Tom said:
What? You are complaining that the manufacturers are developing technology to make their bikes faster because it represents stagnation. As for teams in the past building new high performance engines and developing new bikes around them, the 800cc engines have lasted the same 5 years as the 990 engines before them. Before that most of the teams were using fundamentally the same engine for considerably longer.

Tom, they already have technologies to make the bikes much faster at 21L. Those technologies are banned whether it's electric hybrid technology, supercharging technologies, or even high pressure fuel injection. Those technologies are extremely production relevant, yet they want nothing to do with them. I'm actually happy they aren't using those technologies b/c I don't want to pay for them on my production bike, but my point is that MotoGP is not about technological development. MotoGP is high performance, but that shouldn't be confused with technological innovation.

Don't buy the lie b/c it feels good. The MSMA are only innovative insofar as it keeps people out.

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