No show for Stoner at Estoril?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Oct 1 2009, 06:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>My understanding is that you have been rather more than a dilettante in regard to matters gynaecological .

There are actually several mechanisms by which hypotension could be related to psychiatric disturbance, not least the effects of psychiatric medications, but I had thought mdubstylie's clear implication was that any problems casey has had were related to lack of strength of character and a generally effete nature, adriana not withstanding.

Weak minded I guess is the basic principle of what I think his problem is. If by that you mean that everything wrong with him is self induced by his inability to handle pressure. He is giving himself panic attacks before races. He said it himself I feel fine all week before races and then the closer it gets to race time, blaghhh up come the cookies.
How many of you have a job that will allow you to take two months off because their may be something wrong with you? How many of you even would? We are not talking so sick you have to be in bed, we are talking about being irritable and being unable to overachieve anymore, he was still getting podiums mind you. He needed to man up and soldier through his little tantrum, he needs to deal with his issues instead of passing blame.
Yeah he is so sick they sent him to the outback to play with his iphone and go fishing, instead of keeping him at a hospital or at home to rest. The ........ is so deep on so many levels it ridicules. So far they haven't even came up with a ailment that he shouldn't be able to ride with anyway, they are all dietary deficiencies. We all have plenty of those. Maybe it's from all the ...... flavored cooladie y'all have been drinking I am not sure. But its time for the excuses to stop.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Oct 1 2009, 02:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>3 of those missed races in a role and with still doubtable bases, which is the whole problem. What if it was not Stoner, if it was another rider that decided to take a leave without a real sickness proven? Say Vermuelen or Capirossi, would Rizla be happy? Say Pedrosa or Dovisioso, would Repsol be happy? What about tech 3 riders… Edwards or Toseland, would Monster be happy?
This argument continues to be circular, and appears entirely based on the assumption that there is nothing wrong with him, with recent medical information which makes some sense to me dismissed because the doctors concerned are australian, which some might consider to be rather offensive. Whilst marlboro man, apparently a noted medical authority would appear to agree with you, I can't see how you can be sure of this. Apart from anything else, the public relations aspect of all this as has been noted by several posters is so apalling that it speaks of the truth being told, as is casey's wont. You don't have to like him, but what exactly has he lied about in the past? Why is it that you have this apparently desperate need to denigrate him? I have absolutely no problem with acknowledging valentino's brilliance as a rider, and giving him all credit for his many championship wins, of which last years as he himself has said was one of the best.

The guy that marlboro man wanted for for ducati has still not won more races than stoner this year despite stoner's 3 race absence, at this stage has won 4 motogp races to stoner's 8 during his period in motogp despite riding the bike which I agree has been brilliantly developed by valentino, apparently did not want to touch ducati with a barge-pole despite heavy financial inducement, and has put his bike down on several occasions when apparently under pressure, mainly from rossi but on at least one occasion from stoner. I can't see the logic in either marlboro man's or your position, particularly since he is presumably annoyed that a chance of a title has been lost which probably only casey would have had any chance of delivering anyway.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MdubSTYLIE @ Oct 1 2009, 02:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Weak minded I guess is the basic principle of what I think his problem is. If by that you mean that everything wrong with him is self induced by his inability to handle pressure. He is giving himself panic attacks before races. He said it himself I feel fine all week before races and then the closer it gets to race time, blaghhh up come the cookies.
How many of you have a job that will allow you to take two months off because their may be something wrong with you? How many of you even would? We are not talking so sick you have to be in bed, we are talking about being irritable and being unable to overachieve anymore, he was still getting podiums mind you. He needed to man up and soldier through his little tantrum, he needs to deal with his issues instead of passing blame.
Yeah he is so sick they sent him to the outback to play with his iphone and go fishing, instead of keeping him at a hospital or at home to rest. The ........ is so deep on so many levels it ridicules. So far they haven't even came up with a ailment that he shouldn't be able to ride with anyway, they are all dietary deficiencies. We all have plenty of those. Maybe it's from all the ...... flavored cooladie y'all have been drinking I am not sure. But its time for the excuses to stop.
This is getting to be boring and not much of a challenge given that your only tactic appears to be the making of abusive ex cathedra statements rather than presenting any arguments. Do you really think there is no gradation between a physical problem that would confine you to bed and one that might make you tired at the end of a motogp race in which you have tried to stay with valentino rossi? I think everyone gets that you don't like casey stoner.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Oct 1 2009, 10:28 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>This is getting to be boring and not much of a challenge given that your only tactic appears to be the making of abusive ex cathedra statements rather than presenting any arguments. Do you really think there is no gradation between a physical problem that would confine you to bed and one that might make you tired at the end of a motogp race in which you have tried to stay with valentino rossi? I think everyone gets that you don't like casey stoner.
Maybe it's getting boring because I have stuck to the same argument the whole way. Unlike you who as the "smoke screen diagnosis" changes, so does your argument. Do you really think that a physical problem that doesn't confine you to the bed and only makes one tired after a motogp race is a good reason to take a leave of absents? I say hell no, obviously.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Oct 1 2009, 10:16 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>This argument continues to be circular, and appears entirely based on the assumption that there is nothing wrong with him, with recent medical information which makes some sense to me dismissed because the doctors concerned are australian, which some might consider to be rather offensive. Whilst marlboro man, apparently a noted medical authority would appear to agree with you, I can't see how you can be sure of this. Apart from anything else, the public relations aspect of all this as has been noted by several posters is so apalling that it speaks of the truth being told, as is casey's wont. You don't have to like him, but what exactly has he lied about in the past? Why is it that you have this apparently desperate need to denigrate him? I have absolutely no problem with acknowledging valentino's brilliance as a rider, and giving him all credit for his many championship wins, of which last years as he himself has said was one of the best.

The guy that marlboro man wanted for for ducati has still not won more races than stoner this year despite stoner's 3 race absence, at this stage has won 4 motogp races to stoner's 8 during his period in motogp despite riding the bike which I agree has been brilliantly developed by valentino, apparently did not want to touch ducati with a barge-pole despite heavy financial inducement, and has put his bike down on several occasions when apparently under pressure, mainly from rossi but on at least one occasion from stoner. I can't see the logic in either marlboro man's or your position, particularly since he is presumably annoyed that a chance of a title has been lost which probably only casey would have had any chance of delivering anyway.

Not all the doctors where aussies, and besides why would anyone be offended by aussie doctors anyway? That .... doesn't make any sense. Now british dentist's on the other hand, very offensive. Your whole post is stupid. Nevermind I reread its not that stupid just the top part.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Sep 30 2009, 09:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>What do you expect from hayden and stoner fans? We still think nicky won the 2006 world championship and casey the 2007 title, and hence are clearly collectively delusional .
Brilliant.

(Now this is the michaelm I like, not that diplomatic fence rider that sometimes comes out to play.)

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Sep 30 2009, 09:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I just think it is intriguing what pressure can do!

Correct! Just look at how Rossi has reacted to the "pressure" of having a competitive teammate. (A terrible thing; apparently).

1. Yamaha, the bad guys for resigning Lorenzo (factory showing no respect?)
2. Threats, of leaving Yamaha (I guess Honda isn't the evil empire after all, eh, god know he Ducati/Suzuki are not options)
3. Hey, F1 doesn't sound so bad (maybe four wheels is the answer)
3. Leave the sport... (sounds worse than taking a few races off, afterall it worked to get his way the last time he threaten such catastrophe.)

Ah "pressure", its a mothafuka!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Oct 1 2009, 11:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Correct! Just look at how Rossi has reacted to the "pressure" of having a competitive teammate. (A terrible thing; apparently).

1. Yamaha, the bad guys for resigning Lorenzo (factory showing no respect?)
2. Threats, of leaving Yamaha (I guess Honda isn't the evil empire after all, eh, god know he Ducati/Suzuki are not options)
3. Hey, F1 doesn't sound so bad (maybe four wheels is the answer)
3. Leave the sport... (sounds worse than taking a few races off, afterall it worked to get his way the last time he threaten such catastrophe.)

Ah "pressure", its a mothafuka!
always pissin yellow.... aren't ya!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Oct 1 2009, 07:16 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>This argument continues to be circular, and appears entirely based on the assumption that there is nothing wrong with him, with recent medical information which makes some sense to me dismissed because the doctors concerned are australian, which some might consider to be rather offensive. Whilst marlboro man, apparently a noted medical authority would appear to agree with you, I can't see how you can be sure of this. Apart from anything else, the public relations aspect of all this as has been noted by several posters is so apalling that it speaks of the truth being told, as is casey's wont. You don't have to like him, but what exactly has he lied about in the past? Why is it that you have this apparently desperate need to denigrate him?

The guy that marlboro man wanted for for ducati has still not won more races than stoner this year despite stoner's 3 race absence, at this stage has won 4 motogp races to stoner's 8 during his period in motogp despite riding the bike which I agree has been brilliantly developed by valentino, apparently did not want to touch ducati with a barge-pole despite heavy financial inducement, and has put his bike down on several occasions when apparently under pressure, mainly from rossi but on at least one occasion from stoner. I can't see the logic in either marlboro man's or your position, particularly since he is presumably annoyed that a chance of a title has been lost which probably only casey would have had any chance of delivering anyway.

Bang, the smack down continues! Its good to see Stoner getting a fair defense on this one, come on V! Don't let Mdub have all the fun with his hilarious quips and brilliantly scathing Stoner insults.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MdubSTYLIE @ Oct 1 2009, 08:16 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Not all the doctors where aussies, and besides why would anyone be offended by aussie doctors anyway? ... Now british dentist's on the other hand, very offensive.
Why have you brought up visions of Roger's teeth to my already mushy brain?



What you talkin bout Frost? ....me

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Gaz @ Oct 1 2009, 12:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Babel,

Read back through this and other numerous threads and you will see that Stoner's alleged poor work ethic has been mentioned numerous times, so yes I am sure that people are fcriticising it. But I don't agree and this why I mentioned the two riders different approaches as to me, nobody at the top level succeeds without having an optimum work ethic.

But,on the other hand if I have misunderstood your post, no problems but it has been a while since we disagreed and we need to fire up a bit.

I disagree.

Good article in the Times sport section about Casey today, and the topic of prematurely burnt out sports stars (Capriati style).

I'm relatively pro-Stoner, but the said article did remind me of a very poignant event last season when Jorge was being wheeled around the paddock in a wheelchair and Casey accused him through official channels (and not off the record) as publicly faking it. Never ceases to amaze me how karma comes around kick you in the knacker sack!!


Stone

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Babelfish @ Oct 1 2009, 11:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I disagree.
I agree (with Gaz)

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Oct 1 2009, 05:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Correct! Just look at how Rossi has reacted to the "pressure" of having a competitive teammate. (A terrible thing; apparently).

1. Yamaha, the bad guys for resigning Lorenzo (factory showing no respect?)
2. Threats, of leaving Yamaha (I guess Honda isn't the evil empire after all, eh, god know he Ducati/Suzuki are not options)
3. Hey, F1 doesn't sound so bad (maybe four wheels is the answer)
3. Leave the sport... (sounds worse than taking a few races off, afterall it worked to get his way the last time he threaten such catastrophe.)

Ah "pressure", its a mothafuka!
and you dont think thats just another mind game by the master ? come on jumkie. youve followed the sport long enough to see how the boy rolls

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Tennis is another sport in which they often start and end young. Andrea Jaeger became the youngest player to be seeded at Wimbledon in 1980 but was a teenager when she retired and is now an Anglican Dominican nun.



<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chopperman @ Oct 1 2009, 04:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>and you dont think thats just another mind game by the master ? come on jumkie. youve followed the sport long enough to see how the boy rolls
Ah, well maybe Casey is playing mind games too...

Or he's planning on becoming a Franciscan monk.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Oct 1 2009, 07:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>


Ah, well maybe Casey is playing mind games too...

Or he's planning on becoming a Franciscan monk.

Finally! You agree with me on this! Hooray!


Oh no wait, you were joking. My bad I am an ......

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Sincerely,
SuperShit4brains56

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Oct 1 2009, 09:16 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>This argument continues to be circular, and appears entirely based on the assumption that there is nothing wrong with him, with recent medical information which makes some sense to me dismissed because the doctors concerned are australian, which some might consider to be rather offensive. Whilst marlboro man, apparently a noted medical authority would appear to agree with you, I can't see how you can be sure of this. Apart from anything else, the public relations aspect of all this as has been noted by several posters is so apalling that it speaks of the truth being told, as is casey's wont. You don't have to like him, but what exactly has he lied about in the past? Why is it that you have this apparently desperate need to denigrate him? I have absolutely no problem with acknowledging valentino's brilliance as a rider, and giving him all credit for his many championship wins, of which last years as he himself has said was one of the best.

The guy that marlboro man wanted for for ducati has still not won more races than stoner this year despite stoner's 3 race absence, at this stage has won 4 motogp races to stoner's 8 during his period in motogp despite riding the bike which I agree has been brilliantly developed by valentino, apparently did not want to touch ducati with a barge-pole despite heavy financial inducement, and has put his bike down on several occasions when apparently under pressure, mainly from rossi but on at least one occasion from stoner. I can't see the logic in either marlboro man's or your position, particularly since he is presumably annoyed that a chance of a title has been lost which probably only casey would have had any chance of delivering anyway.

Because it is hard for me to believe that it all comes down to nutrition or so. I really (my own opinion and deduction) believe it is all about pressure, which has been plied up inside of Stoner. Different sources of pressure if you may, but to me it all indicates that pressure got to him. So Stoner has not lied at all, simply no one can find an illness which affects him so badly he needed 2 months off, barely after the one for summer break. Or a least not an illness that could not have been spotted since the beginning of the problem.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Oct 1 2009, 11:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Correct! Just look at how Rossi has reacted to the "pressure" of having a competitive teammate. (A terrible thing; apparently).

1. Yamaha, the bad guys for resigning Lorenzo (factory showing no respect?)
2. Threats, of leaving Yamaha (I guess Honda isn't the evil empire after all, eh, god know he Ducati/Suzuki are not options)
3. Hey, F1 doesn't sound so bad (maybe four wheels is the answer)
3. Leave the sport... (sounds worse than taking a few races off, afterall it worked to get his way the last time he threaten such catastrophe.)

Ah "pressure", its a mothafuka!

Yeah… Rossi (and Burgess) are applying pressure to Yamaha, aren’t they?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Oct 1 2009, 12:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Bang, the smack down continues! Its good to see Stoner getting a fair defense on this one, come on V! Don't let Mdub have all the fun with his hilarious quips and brilliantly scathing Stoner insults

Don’t worry mate… In between Mdub and my jokes we kind of agree! Still no real bases! From nowhere! Not enough to convince us skeptical ‘donkeys’ anyway!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Arrabbiata1 @ Oct 1 2009, 05:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Good article in the Times sport section about Casey today, and the topic of prematurely burnt out sports stars (Capriati style).

I'm relatively pro-Stoner, but the said article did remind me of a very poignant event last season when Jorge was being wheeled around the paddock in a wheelchair and Casey accused him through official channels (and not off the record) as publicly faking it. Never ceases to amaze me how karma comes around kick you in the knacker sack!!


Wow!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MdubSTYLIE @ Oct 1 2009, 06:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Finally! You agree with me on this! Hooray!

I do too Mdub!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Oct 1 2009, 08:36 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>What if it was not Stoner, if it was another rider that decided to take a leave without a real 'bad' sickness proven? Say Vermuelen or Capirossi, would Rizla be happy? Say Pedrosa or Dovisioso, would Repsol be happy? What about tech 3 riders… Edwards or Toseland, would Monster be happy?

This is like calling my home a leaving a message to myself, feels awful to quote myself in this case… But what if?

Note: that word 'bad' was missing originally.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Oct 2 2009, 05:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Yeah… Rossi (and Burgess) are applying pressure to Yamaha, aren’t they?

Depends on your view I expect.

One could argue that they are reacting to the pressure applied to them by Yamaha who have not given into their demands and instead signed Lorenzo and agreed to Lorenzo getting an equal level of equipment.

Alternately, it could be argued that they are reacting to the threat and pressure applied by Lorenzo who has successfully competed against Rossi this year and has now signed a new cintract with Yamah that guarantees him equal machinery.




Gaz

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Oct 2 2009, 05:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Wow!
Even I would agree that particular statement was unnecessary and an invitation to bad karma.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Oct 2 2009, 12:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>


Ah, well maybe Casey is playing mind games too...

Or he's planning on becoming a Franciscan monk.
i was commenting on you referal to rossi/lorenzo in house fun and games. until casey comes back and scores i really dont think im going to take him that seriously at all.