No show for Stoner at Estoril?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SuperShinya56 @ Sep 30 2009, 06:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>That and reports of Adrianna being spotted inside Rossi's trailer on numerous occassions.


Where are these reports???

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#22 @ Sep 30 2009, 10:39 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Where are these reports???

Didn't you see those spy photos of Adrianna and Rossi in this thread??

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Marijke @ Sep 30 2009, 01:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>thanks for pointing that out


when someone says he has pain somewhere, lets say in his tummy, you'd have to diagnose him, right? when you cant find it, but he still has pain, is he healthy? no

you continue with tests/meds/rest to find it and fix it

if he is indeed just put in the corner to learn him a lesson, its kinda strange that that guy dont remember his name is demanding an apology from stoner towards the team. if its not stoners choice to not race these last few weeks, then why should he apologize?

No, just because someone has a pain in his tummy does not mean he is sick. He could have a bad diet, made up of candy and soda for example. Or nerves, like super SS summed up well for once. Don't over complicate things, sometimes the obvious conclusion is the correct conclusion.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Marijke @ Sep 30 2009, 07:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>just cause they (as in the EXPERTS) cant find a lable to put on the disease doesnt mean someone isnt sick.

Yes indeed. I've defended Stoner, though I’m not a fan in the classical sense; the thing is Casey has also gone to leading physicians in the sport, and all have come up with one thing or another but its been a bit suspect. For example, Dr, Ting (doctor to people like Hayden, Hopkins, Bostrom, to name three) found that Stoner was anemic. Then Casey denied it saying it wasn't that bad. Now we have another doc saying he suffers from low blood pressure and sodium. To most people that would seem rather easy to detect, so why so late in the detection? I don't know. They have been calling it a "mystery illness" because nothing very concrete has been found coupled with the media's bias to make Stoner look silly (I have my theory why he's not like, but that is another thread).

I do know that he appeared very sick in a couple of post race interview, something that would be hard to fake. I also know that al the riders have strict diets and training regiments, and perhaps he over trained and under dieted (two things that would be hard to diagnose as an identifiable "illness" but nonetheless would through your body out of whack).

Roger has mentioned several times that perhaps not everything has been made public and there is more to this story than is reported. Perhaps Casey is a disgruntled employee. Perhaps like Mdub & V. say, he's just a guy who caved into pressure (though I don't subscribe to this theory since the man withstood tremendous pressure and still dominated the entire season in 07, so I don't see how his mental toughness is in question). But then again, we are all built different, and perhaps the constant jeering and rubbishing of his accomplishment by the 'cult dynamic' of the sport making him the villain finally broke his spirit.

I read somewhere that Hayden said the hardest thing for him to deal with so far in his career was the let down after his 06 title. The constant accusations that it was not legit coupled with his inability to answer the critics with a follow up performance have been the mentally draining and emotionally taxing. Perhaps this is why he felt compelled to put on his leather "the numbers don't lie". The same 'cult dynamic' among fans is equally represented in the media (as anybody can see in a media center the familiar t-shirt or hat of a particular rider) and so it’s no enigma why Stoner would have had to deal with the same criticism as Hayden. The difference being that Hayden, at very least has a respectable work ethic and redeeming personality that have kept the pinky's of the world to a manageable level. But Casey has had no such refuge. His dominant performance was summarily chalked up to his machine, and his personality has been on blast since day one. So who knows, this is speculation, but perhaps it finally got to him.

We are all built differently, obviously physically but intangibly in its complexity, mentally . Hell, we don’t know what other riders might be like if they had to deal with such issues like being constantly criticized. I’m always tickled when a rider like Rossi doesn’t get his way in one minor issue only to read the media blitz in favor of his “victimization” with the choirs of the ‘cult dynamic” in unison. So I can only imagine what might have been his reaction if perhaps he was the butt of everybody’s criticism, media and fans alike, how might his “happy-go-lucky” personality possibly been affected? Look how it affected Sete Gibernau & Max Biaggi, vilified to the hilt, one finally banished and the other retired only to comeback and in a failed and ill-fated attempt at making his career whole. I suspect only the reasonable fans of the sport will admit my last points here, but these guy’s careers have been affected by the post 2000 theme of Rossi vs. X. Perhaps Casey is another casualty. Does that make him a .....? Maybe, maybe not, perhaps it just makes him human too.

^^^ is there nothing us dastardly rossi rans cant get the blame for

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chopperman @ Sep 30 2009, 11:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>^^^ is there nothing us dastardly rossi rans cant get the blame for
Very little.

I have to say, lack of sodium & over training make it sound pretty much self-inlicted.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SuperShinya56 @ Sep 30 2009, 06:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Didn't you see those spy photos of Adrianna and Rossi in this thread??

And by your definition thats 'numerous reports'?!


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 30 2009, 07:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'> Yes indeed. I've defended Stoner, though I’m not a fan in the classical sense; the thing is Casey has also gone to leading physicians in the sport, and all have come up with one thing or another but its been a bit suspect. For example, Dr, Ting (doctor to people like Hayden, Hopkins, Bostrom, to name three) found that Stoner was anemic. Then Casey denied it saying it wasn't that bad. Now we have another doc saying he suffers from low blood pressure and sodium. To most people that would seem rather easy to detect, so why so late in the detection? I don't know. They have been calling it a "mystery illness" because nothing very concrete has been found coupled with the media's bias to make Stoner look silly (I have my theory why he's not like, but that is another thread).

I do know that he appeared very sick in a couple of post race interview, something that would be hard to fake. I also know that al the riders have strict diets and training regiments, and perhaps he over trained and under dieted (two things that would be hard to diagnose as an identifiable "illness" but nonetheless would through your body out of whack).

Roger has mentioned several times that perhaps not everything has been made public and there is more to this story than is reported. Perhaps Casey is a disgruntled employee. Perhaps like Mdub & V. say, he's just a guy who caved into pressure (though I don't subscribe to this theory since the man withstood tremendous pressure and still dominated the entire season in 07, so I don't see how his mental toughness is in question). But then again, we are all built different, and perhaps the constant jeering and rubbishing of his accomplishment by the 'cult dynamic' of the sport making him the villain finally broke his spirit.

I read somewhere that Hayden said the hardest thing for him to deal with so far in his career was the let down after his 06 title. The constant accusations that it was not legit coupled with his inability to answer the critics with a follow up performance have been the mentally draining and emotionally taxing. Perhaps this is why he felt compelled to put on his leather "the numbers don't lie". The same 'cult dynamic' among fans is equally represented in the media (as anybody can see in a media center the familiar t-shirt or hat of a particular rider) and so it’s no enigma why Stoner would have had to deal with the same criticism as Hayden. The difference being that Hayden, at very least has a respectable work ethic and redeeming personality that have kept the pinky's of the world to a manageable level. But Casey has had no such refuge. His dominant performance was summarily chalked up to his machine, and his personality has been on blast since day one. So who knows, this is speculation, but perhaps it finally got to him.

We are all built differently, obviously physically but intangibly in its complexity, mentally . Hell, we don’t know what other riders might be like if they had to deal with such issues like being constantly criticized. I’m always tickled when a rider like Rossi doesn’t get his way in one minor issue only to read the media blitz in favor of his “victimization” with the choirs of the ‘cult dynamic” in unison. So I can only imagine what might have been his reaction if perhaps he was the butt of everybody’s criticism, media and fans alike, how might his “happy-go-lucky” personality possibly been affected? Look how it affected Sete Gibernau & Max Biaggi, vilified to the hilt, one finally banished and the other retired only to comeback and in a failed and ill-fated attempt at making his career whole. I suspect only the reasonable fans of the sport will admit my last points here, but these guy’s careers have been affected by the post 2000 theme of Rossi vs. X. Perhaps Casey is another casualty. Does that make him a .....? Maybe, maybe not, perhaps it just makes him human too.


Excellent post Jum, just about sums up the whole thread topic in one

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Oct 1 2009, 04:39 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'> Yes indeed. I've defended Stoner, though I’m not a fan in the classical sense; the thing is Casey has also gone to leading physicians in the sport, and all have come up with one thing or another but its been a bit suspect. For example, Dr, Ting (doctor to people like Hayden, Hopkins, Bostrom, to name three) found that Stoner was anemic. Then Casey denied it saying it wasn't that bad. Now we have another doc saying he suffers from low blood pressure and sodium. To most people that would seem rather easy to detect, so why so late in the detection? I don't know. They have been calling it a "mystery illness" because nothing very concrete has been found coupled with the media's bias to make Stoner look silly (I have my theory why he's not like, but that is another thread).

I do know that he appeared very sick in a couple of post race interview, something that would be hard to fake. I also know that al the riders have strict diets and training regiments, and perhaps he over trained and under dieted (two things that would be hard to diagnose as an identifiable "illness" but nonetheless would through your body out of whack).

Roger has mentioned several times that perhaps not everything has been made public and there is more to this story than is reported. Perhaps Casey is a disgruntled employee. Perhaps like Mdub & V. say, he's just a guy who caved into pressure (though I don't subscribe to this theory since the man withstood tremendous pressure and still dominated the entire season in 07, so I don't see how his mental toughness is in question). But then again, we are all built different, and perhaps the constant jeering and rubbishing of his accomplishment by the 'cult dynamic' of the sport making him the villain finally broke his spirit.

I read somewhere that Hayden said the hardest thing for him to deal with so far in his career was the let down after his 06 title. The constant accusations that it was not legit coupled with his inability to answer the critics with a follow up performance have been the mentally draining and emotionally taxing. Perhaps this is why he felt compelled to put on his leather "the numbers don't lie". The same 'cult dynamic' among fans is equally represented in the media (as anybody can see in a media center the familiar t-shirt or hat of a particular rider) and so it’s no enigma why Stoner would have had to deal with the same criticism as Hayden. The difference being that Hayden, at very least has a respectable work ethic and redeeming personality that have kept the pinky's of the world to a manageable level. But Casey has had no such refuge. His dominant performance was summarily chalked up to his machine, and his personality has been on blast since day one. So who knows, this is speculation, but perhaps it finally got to him.

We are all built differently, obviously physically but intangibly in its complexity, mentally . Hell, we don’t know what other riders might be like if they had to deal with such issues like being constantly criticized. I’m always tickled when a rider like Rossi doesn’t get his way in one minor issue only to read the media blitz in favor of his “victimization” with the choirs of the ‘cult dynamic” in unison. So I can only imagine what might have been his reaction if perhaps he was the butt of everybody’s criticism, media and fans alike, how might his “happy-go-lucky” personality possibly been affected? Look how it affected Sete Gibernau & Max Biaggi, vilified to the hilt, one finally banished and the other retired only to comeback and in a failed and ill-fated attempt at making his career whole. I suspect only the reasonable fans of the sport will admit my last points here, but these guy’s careers have been affected by the post 2000 theme of Rossi vs. X. Perhaps Casey is another casualty. Does that make him a .....? Maybe, maybe not, perhaps it just makes him human too.

Excellent post. After all he is at least part human as are all the aliens!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 30 2009, 08:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'> Yes indeed. I've defended Stoner, though I’m not a fan in the classical sense; the thing is Casey has also gone to leading physicians in the sport, and all have come up with one thing or another but its been a bit suspect. For example, Dr, Ting (doctor to people like Hayden, Hopkins, Bostrom, to name three) found that Stoner was anemic. Then Casey denied it saying it wasn't that bad. Now we have another doc saying he suffers from low blood pressure and sodium. To most people that would seem rather easy to detect, so why so late in the detection? I don't know. They have been calling it a "mystery illness" because nothing very concrete has been found coupled with the media's bias to make Stoner look silly (I have my theory why he's not like, but that is another thread).

I do know that he appeared very sick in a couple of post race interview, something that would be hard to fake. I also know that al the riders have strict diets and training regiments, and perhaps he over trained and under dieted (two things that would be hard to diagnose as an identifiable "illness" but nonetheless would through your body out of whack).

Roger has mentioned several times that perhaps not everything has been made public and there is more to this story than is reported. Perhaps Casey is a disgruntled employee. Perhaps like Mdub & V. say, he's just a guy who caved into pressure (though I don't subscribe to this theory since the man withstood tremendous pressure and still dominated the entire season in 07, so I don't see how his mental toughness is in question). But then again, we are all built different, and perhaps the constant jeering and rubbishing of his accomplishment by the 'cult dynamic' of the sport making him the villain finally broke his spirit.

I read somewhere that Hayden said the hardest thing for him to deal with so far in his career was the let down after his 06 title. The constant accusations that it was not legit coupled with his inability to answer the critics with a follow up performance have been the mentally draining and emotionally taxing. Perhaps this is why he felt compelled to put on his leather "the numbers don't lie". The same 'cult dynamic' among fans is equally represented in the media (as anybody can see in a media center the familiar t-shirt or hat of a particular rider) and so it’s no enigma why Stoner would have had to deal with the same criticism as Hayden. The difference being that Hayden, at very least has a respectable work ethic and redeeming personality that have kept the pinky's of the world to a manageable level. But Casey has had no such refuge. His dominant performance was summarily chalked up to his machine, and his personality has been on blast since day one. So who knows, this is speculation, but perhaps it finally got to him.

We are all built differently, obviously physically but intangibly in its complexity, mentally . Hell, we don’t know what other riders might be like if they had to deal with such issues like being constantly criticized. I’m always tickled when a rider like Rossi doesn’t get his way in one minor issue only to read the media blitz in favor of his “victimization” with the choirs of the ‘cult dynamic” in unison. So I can only imagine what might have been his reaction if perhaps he was the butt of everybody’s criticism, media and fans alike, how might his “happy-go-lucky” personality possibly been affected? Look how it affected Sete Gibernau & Max Biaggi, vilified to the hilt, one finally banished and the other retired only to comeback and in a failed and ill-fated attempt at making his career whole. I suspect only the reasonable fans of the sport will admit my last points here, but these guy’s careers have been affected by the post 2000 theme of Rossi vs. X. Perhaps Casey is another casualty. Does that make him a .....? Maybe, maybe not, perhaps it just makes him human too.
its good to be back!! I missed these essays of you

dont agree with everything you say tho. maybe Im weird like this, but I think like this: maybe casey has something NO ONE in the world has ever had, maybe the best doctors in the world are puzzled by it. every disease has puzzled doctors once, like cholera, but they did find a cure after a while. I know its far fetched but its a possiblity. so just cause the docs cant lable it, doesnt mean your complaints are imaginary or that you arent ill. science is a continuum of ever gathering knowledge, we dont even know 5% of all the knowledge we could possibly have

I also dont agree with the hayden/stoner analysis. you say hayden had a better way with dealing the period after his championship. difference is the work ethic and the personality, and that it finally got to him since he lacks personality+work ethic?

stoner has a good work ethic imo, how often do we see him enter the pits shaking his head, while he is like 1.5 seconds faster than the number 2?? he pushes his bike to the limit, the bike that only he seems to be able to ride on. that said I dont think his bike won the championship for him, he is like one of the few riders who can race and trust all the electronics to just work ok. Ive read he is one of the few who dares to open the throttle wide open while exiting a corner, cause he has that much trust in his bike to balance out the power.
Yeah I too noticed him not getting out of his pitbox the last few races he attended. this can be due to his 'illness', which has nothing to do with his work ethic.
Stoners personality should not be of any influence. what do we know about someones personality, only based on how he races and how he moves around in the motogp world? hayden is more likeable, stoner isnt. in the end its down to results, being more or less likeable doesnt help you get better results and therefor imo its quite irrelevant in this case. its like stoner sees racing as his 9 to 5 job, and hayden sees racing as a passion turned into a job. stoner might be and Im sure he is a very kind warm cheerfull guy, outside of motogp we think we know these people, but do we really? what do we know of him that we can say this is how he is????

I do agree tho that I dont think the issue is due to mentally breaking down under pressure. the guy showed his mental strenght in 07 with battling with rossi and co. maybe it is all just under dieet and over trained yeah... Im sure we dont even know half of the things thats been going on

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MdubSTYLIE @ Sep 30 2009, 02:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>More ........ from camp .... for brains. This would be way to easy to spot. Why don't the get a doctor to come up with some this ......... maybe he could have came up with something believable. Sounds like the boy needed some tatorchips in between snicker bars.
.... it, why don't we just make up a new illness that has no cause, no diagnosis, no symptoms(he was a whiney ..... before), and unfortunately no known cure. And we shall call it KCisalilpussitis. YOUR NOT REALLY SICK YOU ......, STOP WITH THE FAKE DIAGNOSIS'S!!!!

Y'all know he is going to fail miserably this weekend right?
You would seem to have problems with reading as well as with constructing arguments. Having low blood pressure at the end of the races is actually fairly consistent with events, particularly with near syncope/collapse when he got off the bike and tried to stand up, and probably also somewhat difficult to overcome with mental strength.

Whether hypotension is a sign of deep moral/character flaws perhaps enters the realm of philosophy, but doubtless if he was more like valentino rossi he would at least have had something more glamorous and exciting wrong with him.

Addressing his diet, and concerning which you were partially correct his training regime, has apparently been done and would seem to be a good idea.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Marijke @ Sep 30 2009, 02:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>its good to be back!! I missed these essays of you dont agree with everything you say ...I also dont agree with the hayden/stoner analysis

Thanx.

I think we agree more than you think, but perhaps I wasn't clear. Yes, I agree, Stoner's work ethic is respectable. I just think that Hayden has a reputation of hammering out problems by sheer laps and long hours. Stoner perhaps doesn't have to do this since he is able to work through issue more quickly.

As far as the personality difference, I just think more people like the Hayden's country bumpkin smile and laid back California style over the strict no nonsense Stoner personality. I'm not saying one is better, but I am saying one has more affinity with fans.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>we think we know these people, but do we really? what do we know of him that we can say this is how he is????

True, we all are very distant speculators of what is what, and yes whatever we say is subject to "grain of salt" test; hasn't stopped anybody from giving opinions, eh. All we got are the reports and interview, so its fair game to talk about that I guess.

Wow I haven't been on in a while but reading this topic makes it look like Casey's return has the Rossibot's nervous as hell. The free ride is just about over.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Oct 1 2009, 08:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Wow I haven't been on in a while but reading this topic makes it look like Casey's return has the Rossibot's nervous as hell. The free ride is just about over.

Let's hope so!

And as an Aussie who will shortly be returning to this forum if Casey has any success to speak of I might even restart the old Rossi/Uccio gay rumors - sure I have no proof whatsoever and it would be a complete fabrication and distortion of the facts on my part, but hey that doesn't seem to stop MdubSTYLIE with his ........ posts - he sounds so authoritative too like he really believes what he is saying which is hilarious

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Pigeon @ Sep 30 2009, 07:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Casey Stoner can't wait to get back in the saddle in his return from a three-week forced absence at the Portuguese MotoGP this weekend.

The Australian has undergone a series of tests over the last month for a mystery illness that was the main cause of physical problems that has interrupted the 2009 season for the Ducati rider.

The results of the tests excluded pathological anomalies of cardiovascular, respiratory or neurological origins but also failed to show up any kind of virus or infection.

However, it's been revealed that Stoner suffered from low blood pressure levels and a lack of sodium.

?? whats that actually cause then.? i'm googleing

low blood pressure.??? did'nt anyone take that when hes first got ill.uh??

Edit: thought it rang a bell mum had probs with sodium.diuretics potassium etc & low blood pressure.it was piss easy to diagnose...i picked her meds up many times things like.
burinex Frusemide etc

who is casey/ducatis doc. Dr Dolittle. ......... alert again.
You are still upset stoner beat valentino in 2007, aren't you?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Sep 30 2009, 08:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Wow I haven't been on in a while but reading this topic makes it look like Casey's return has the Rossibot's nervous as hell. The free ride is just about over.
No, really it's just brought the cs manginas back. Welcome back boys or should I say ladies!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Sep 30 2009, 08:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Wow I haven't been on in a while but reading this topic makes it look like Casey's return has the Rossibot's nervous as hell. The free ride is just about over.
No, really it's just brought the cs manginas back. Welcome back boys or should I say ladies!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Sep 30 2009, 08:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Wow I haven't been on in a while but reading this topic makes it look like Casey's return has the Rossibot's nervous as hell. The free ride is just about over.
No, really it's just brought the cs manginas back. Welcome back boys or should I say ladies!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chopperman @ Sep 30 2009, 07:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>^^^ is there nothing us dastardly rossi rans cant get the blame for


Buy more yellow 46 product, sole this bloody world economic crapola will ya.






Gaz

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MdubSTYLIE @ Oct 1 2009, 02:22 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>No, really it's just brought the cs manginas back. Welcome back boys or should I say ladies!

Fark me, trying to get your post cout up are we?




Gaz