Michelin tires topic

Every blessed thread in this forum begins with one interesting topic and invariably ends up (or should we say ends down) as a pro-Rossi/damn-Rossi thread. Seriously, this is boring.

Speaking of Michelin, they seem to have sorted out most of their initial probems. In the last two races there were no tire failures nor special complains. The tires are different from Bridgestones, of course, but not worse now. Lap times are good.

All riders seem to have adapted and we see duels again. They complain about other things -- like acceleration in Marquez' case. Both Honda and Yamaha have tested new finalized frames and swingarms, a sign that the tires are now stable.

michaelm said:

but I, as does Jumkie, also believe Rossi himself has used his fanbase and media influence to make life uncomfortable for his rivals.

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Charisma is part of your personality, mediatic charisma is mostly something others choose to attach to your image. Rossi has (had) both, thanks to a combination of talent - on track -, wit and chance, in a part of his career and in a time of the history of the sport where this allowed him to grow an unmatched (number wise), large group of fans that ended up expanding viewing and following of MotoGP as a whole.

The fact that, in a way, people, especially self appointed pure "connoisseurs of the sport", are currently and retrospectively blaming Valentino because Dorna - surprise surprise - enjoyed and appreciated the $$$ and the expansion that the 46 brand and image gave to the sport, only prooves these connoisseurs extremely naive. Yeah, maybe it's true Vale has been Dorna's money box. But 1) this is something that in the long term has benefited and will only keep benefiting the sport as a whole, which if anything now looks more like a much too spanish congregation than a Valentino-based mafia; 2) to think this didn't have a lot of negatives for Valentino as opposed to "only positives" is delusional; and to think he didn't have to fight for good and on equal terms for his own achievements is pure delusion as well and a lame excuse to sound "alternative" for the sake of it while talking about a naturally money-based sport, just like any popular sport nowadays; 3) especially people who claim to know THE SPORT and not the ........ surrounding it should be able to separate Vale's public image from what truely matters, which is his talent and his racecraft, no matter if you love him or hate him and no matter how highely you rank him; 4) to seriously think a single man has direct power over a mass of people is dumb. The same way historians who claim it was Hitler's charisma on its own who deceived german people - as opposed to a whole bunch of socio-economics circumstances - are dumb. Men can be smart enough to ride history's waves, they cannot decide themselves all alone in which direction they will go. Valentino, like it or not, is no more and no less "a rider, just a rider" than what seems to be a vodoo doll for many people here, i.e. Casey. He's damn good, and forever will be remembered as such.

Every blessed thread in this forum begins with one interesting topic and invariably ends up (or should we say ends down) as a pro-Rossi/damn-Rossi thread. Seriously, this is boring.

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As much as I've just been caught guilty of the crime myself: THIS, THIS!

Richy56 said:

im suggesting he has his preferred tyres, which is why he is faster this year.

You don't watch warm ups anyway cos your a bopper. Tyres are allocated on a Thursday, but if you thinks that's the end of it you have not been in a race paddock.

Marquez is a better man, can you accept that cos you like responding to the things only you like to respond too.

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And your a bopper of the antiboppers ...... lol.
Regular attendee of race paddocks too, early to mid 90's, assisting my mate, mostly in bemsee events in various tracks up and down the country, some national championship races too fyi. And yes I used to go to the tyre stall and buy new tyres anytime during the weekend.
Doesn't happen in GP anymore.

CharlieParker said:

Charisma is part of your personality, mediatic charisma is mostly something others choose to attach to your image. Rossi has (had) both, thanks to a combination of talent - on track -, wit and chance, in a part of his career and in a time of the history of the sport where this allowed him to grow an unmatched (number wise), large group of fans that ended up expanding viewing and following of MotoGP as a whole.

The fact that, in a way, people, especially self appointed pure "connoisseurs of the sport", are currently and retrospectively blaming Valentino because Dorna - surprise surprise - enjoyed and appreciated the $$$ and the expansion that the 46 brand and image gave to the sport, only prooves these connoisseurs extremely naive. Yeah, maybe it's true Vale has been Dorna's money box. But 1) this is something that in the long term has benefited and will only keep benefiting the sport as a whole, which if anything now looks more like a much too spanish congregation than a Valentino-based mafia; 2) to think this didn't have a lot of negatives for Valentino as opposed to "only positives" is delusional; and to think he didn't have to fight for good and on equal terms for his own achievements is pure delusion as well and a lame excuse to sound "alternative" for the sake of it while talking about a naturally money-based sport, just like any popular sport nowadays; 3) especially people who claim to know THE SPORT and not the ........ surrounding it should be able to separate Vale's public image from what truely matters, which is his talent and his racecraft, no matter if you love him or hate him and no matter how highely you rank him; 4) to seriously think a single man has direct power over a mass of people is dumb. The same way historians who claim it was Hitler's charisma on its own who deceived german people - as opposed to a whole bunch of socio-economics circumstances - are dumb. Men can be smart enough to ride history's waves, they cannot decide themselves all alone in which direction they will go. Valentino, like it or not, is no more and no less "a rider, just a rider" than what seems to be a vodoo doll for many people here, i.e. Casey. He's damn good, and forever will be remembered as such.

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I agree with Mick D's post in the last week that any machinations regarding tyres or whatever which may have hindered riders such as Stoner were by Dorna and not Rossi; as I said at the time and have said since I had no objections to him getting the Bridgestones in 2008, just that Ducati/Stoner ended up from the sequelae of him going with Bridgestone not being able to procure a tyre which suited their bike.

He can also have as many fans as he likes, stupid or otherwise, with no complaints from me.

What I have objected to and continue to object to is the vilification of other riders, even multiple world champions, by a significant element among his fans, including booing them on the podium, which is largely a phenomenon of the Rossi era as far as I am concerned, which can't imo be justified however exceptional a rider he is, in which also imo he is complicit as evidenced by the events of late season 2015. You don't seem to grasp that this is the major gripe against Rossi, in my case at least, rather than resentment of his success, with which I was quite comfortable before all the vilification of Stoner and to a lesser extent Hayden. It is actually amusing that you guys get so upset by a few anti-Rossi posters on here when in the overall scheme of things those pro-Rossi and anti-JL, MM, Stoner or whomever else vastly outnumber us.

MM, of whom I am increasingly becoming a fan despite strongly disapproving of his recklessness in the past, himself has publicly said something along much the same lines, prompted by the booing I think, that they should all be the same once on the track and racing regardless of who has the most fans.
{EDIT Read your post more closely and still disagree. He is not Hitler (you raised him, not me, so Godwin's law doesn't apply, to me at least) of course, and I have argued since becoming at all acquainted with history in my childhood that the treaty of Versailles was responsible for the rise of Hitler. Having previously only blamed a fanatical element among his fans, I am however convinced by Rossi's pronouncements pre-Sepang 2015 and subsequent public statements that he knows exactly what he is doing and does deliberately incite his fans and use them as a weapon. He is certainly capable of calling them off, as he did with Iannone. I also don't recall his rivals making public accusations of the kind he made last year, particularly completely unproven and unprovable accusations as those made in that Sepang press conference were}.

Daniboy said:

And your a bopper of the antiboppers ...... lol.
Regular attendee of race paddocks too, early to mid 90's, assisting my mate, mostly in bemsee events in various tracks up and down the country, some national championship races too fyi. And yes I used to go to the tyre stall and buy new tyres anytime during the weekend.
Doesn't happen in GP anymore.

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Well done, then you will know that club racing is squeaky clean.

Richy56 said:

Well done, then you will know that club racing is squeaky clean.

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Yes, so clean that my mate could enter races he had no chance of coming anywhere but 1st , due in no small part to a mega expensive blueprint and tuning job on his zxr motor.

Yeah that helps!