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Louis Salom passed away in crash

about a foot of sand on that run off area would help.
With the machine above, I had this area done in about an hour. ONE HOUR!

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3500sq ft. We were hard packing it because we laid down new asphalt, however, the pulverizer leaves the type of gravel that you would normally put under asphalt, which is basically the same gravel you find in impact zones at the track.
 
Jums,

Whilst the entry point will be the same, the action coming into the corner should be less as rather than accelerating and driving through the old turn, they will be harder on the brakes for the sharper right and so in essence, the speeds should be slower.

That said, it opens up a different type of accident (such as a highside) with the sharp change of direction with slower entry but exiting harder on the gas and thus risking a rear slide

Hate to say it, but this does seem like a knee jerk reaction of sorts (understandable that they wish to do something, and almost an admission of design implications) and I just hope that we are not out of the frying pan and into the fire with it.


about a foot of sand on that run off area would help.

Short term, they could also throw more air fence at it as from my experience you can double and triple pack airfence in some circumstances (serious rhetorical question - did Luis hit airfence or wall?)
 
Jums,

Whilst the entry point will be the same, the action coming into the corner should be less as rather than accelerating and driving through the old turn, they will be harder on the brakes for the sharper right and so in essence, the speeds should be slower.

That said, it opens up a different type of accident (such as a highside) with the sharp change of direction with slower entry but exiting harder on the gas and thus risking a rear slide

Hate to say it, but this does seem like a knee jerk reaction of sorts (understandable that they wish to do something, and almost an admission of design implications) and I just hope that we are not out of the frying pan and into the fire with it.




Short term, they could also throw more air fence at it as from my experience you can double and triple pack airfence in some circumstances (serious rhetorical question - did Luis hit airfence or wall?)
Ask Casey Stoner about STUCK THROTTLE.

About more air fence, it looks to me like Salom hit his bike which bounced back. And then, it appears he went under the air fence, though I'm not sure. Double Tripped the air fence shortens the run off. 5 meters is a lot in terms of energy absorption.

What they need is some substrate that scrubs speed after the margin of the track. Gravel does that superbly. Literally, in 3 hours we can have that entire zone made into gravel, raked and groomed for impact like the gravel you see just adjacent to that turn.
 
With the f1 never using that layout I don't understand why that bit of tarmac was laid. This should have never happened.
Agree. Like I said, it seems such a glaring oversight. However, I suspect it was kept there so an F1 car could come back onto the track if they missed their braking point into turn 12.
 
Ask Casey Stoner about STUCK THROTTLE.

About more air fence, it looks to me like Salom hit his bike which bounced back. And then, it appears he went under the air fence, though I'm not sure. Double Tripped the air fence shortens the run off. 5 meters is a lot in terms of energy absorption.

What they need is some substrate that scrubs speed after the margin of the track. Gravel does that superbly. Literally, in 3 hours we can have that entire zone made into gravel, raked and groomed for impact like the gravel you see just adjacent to that turn.

There is another video I just saw in another site of the aftermath (not physically of Salom as he is being attended) but what struck me more than anything was that behind the airfence are 4 rows of car tyres which would have aided the bike to get airborne and bounce back.

IMO only, but tyres should not be used to protect walls on bike circuits (airfence and other methods) as tyres are damn hard (like concrete in some terms) plus they can produce unexpected reactions when struck by objects or riders.
 
Ask Casey Stoner about STUCK THROTTLE.

About more air fence, it looks to me like Salom hit his bike which bounced back. And then, it appears he went under the air fence, though I'm not sure. Double Tripped the air fence shortens the run off. 5 meters is a lot in terms of energy absorption.

What they need is some substrate that scrubs speed after the margin of the track. Gravel does that superbly. Literally, in 3 hours we can have that entire zone made into gravel, raked and groomed for impact like the gravel you see just adjacent to that turn.


Agree with that for sure. If the bike did not bounce back like it appears to, Louis would have survived. The bike should have gone thru the air fence. But sand or gravel should have been in that area to slow both rider & bike.
 
There is another video I just saw in another site of the aftermath (not physically of Salom as he is being attended) but what struck me more than anything was that behind the airfence are 4 rows of car tyres which would have aided the bike to get airborne and bounce back.

IMO only, but tyres should not be used to protect walls on bike circuits (airfence and other methods) as tyres are damn hard (like concrete in some terms) plus they can produce unexpected reactions when struck by objects or riders.

Aha! So there we have it. This is just Chicken ....! Anybody with a half a brain should have know this is not a good idea.
 
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That was horrible. RIP Luis Salom
I just heard Vale's comments on the passing. Such kind and thoughtfull words. It made me want to cry.
I feel that at times like these, the GP world is so fortunate to have such a beloved and passionate ambassador for the sport. With his leadership he will encourage the paddock that Luis would want the show to go on.
Race In Peace Young Luis. Im sure your battling Rainey and Simoncelli as we speak.
Oh .... off you .....,frankly your lack of knowledge of this sport is astonishing, Rainey ended up in a wheelchair not dead,it's a tragedy and wankers like you have to use it for a bit of Rossi hero worship,you should be ashamed of yourself mate,save it for another thread because it's inappropriate in this one.
 
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You're replying to the wrong person.

I was replying to you, not to call you a wind up merchant, but to say that some folk are better ignored than replied to. If you thought I was having a go at you, I really wasn't. This is the wrong thread to allow people to drag down with garbage, that's all.
 
Agree. Like I said, it seems such a glaring oversight. However, I suspect it was kept there so an F1 car could come back onto the track if they missed their braking point into turn 12.

F1 used to use turn twelve, as the f1 speeds increased the FIA deemed it too fast in the interests of safety and the chicane appeared which they use now.
 
MotoGP officials do not yet know what caused Luis Salom's fatal Friday accident in the Moto2 class at the Grand Prix of Catalunya.

The 24-year-old was tragically killed after falling at the high-speed penultimate turn, blurry security camera footage showing Salom sliding behind his bike across the asphalt run-off and into the airfence.

The fact that Salom and his bike hit exactly the same section of airfence, with tragic consequences, suggests the Spaniard may have lost control before even leaning in to the corner.

“It's important to say that today we don't have an explanation regarding the accident,” said Dorna CEO Carmelo Ezpeleta. “I went there and you can see the tyre marks. The place where Luis fell is absolutely outside [the normal line].

“He was not taking the line to take the corner. Something happened. We don't know exactly what. We are studying the bike and the telemetry and other things.

“But even if it is something strange that we cannot explain; if it happens once it can happen again. So we said we cannot continue exactly as it is and the Safety Commission took the decision [to change the track].”

Ezpeleta added that there had not been a request to change Turn 12 before the accident.

Responding to questions about the lack of a gravel trap, FIM Grand Prix Safety Officer Franco Uncini explained that gravel can be more dangerous if a rider is still on the bike.

“The FIA requested the asphalt [for F1] and in some places asphalt run-off is also necessary [for bikes]. For example when you go straight, because you can continue to brake on asphalt. But if you don't crash and then have to brake on gravel, you will crash for sure.

“We tried the new section two years ago, but the riders said it was better to keep the old layout.”

The former 500cc world champion confirmed that Salom's injuries appeared to be caused by an impact with his bike.

“The airfence worked. Mainly, most probably, the problem for Luis was that he went [into] the bike. So he did not hit the airfence but hit the bike. The bike rebounded and it was a fatal incident.”

In the absence of a clear reason for the incident, the decision was made to switch to the F1 layout. This saw Turn 12 replaced with a tighter right-hander, leading into a chicane, plus a tighter section at the end of the back straight.

“We talked with the Safety Commission members, including ten riders, and they said 'okay, we have this possibility to have another layout'. At any other circuit this would not have been a possibility,” Ezpeleta said.

“We went there and they said 'no' to continuing with the same layout [until we know what happened]. But they also proposed moving some walls and things at the F1 chicane. So we made a lot of work yesterday moving walls, moving the edge of the track, creating gravel run-off and adding air fences. And finally they agreed unanimously with this solution.

“If we continue [in future years] with this layout there will be some more modifications. When we have all the information about what happened and the data, we will decide in the Safety Commission whether to continue with the old or new layout.”

Speaking about safety in general, Ezpeleta admitted that ever-increasing top speeds are a concern, but that there is no easy solution.

“The Safety Commission has always explained that if there is less speed in the straight it is better,” he said. “But also we gave a Grand Prix Commission with FIM, IRTA, Dorna and MSMA to discuss technical things. It is not easy to reduce the speed limit because the [valve] system of the engines are different.

“If you [limit] revs, which is the easiest way, it impacts different engines differently. Of course MSMA is studying possibilities to do that and we are working but to be honest it is not easy.”




















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Read more at MotoGP News - MotoGP Catalunya: Luis Salom accident still a mystery
 
F1 used to use turn twelve, as the f1 speeds increased the FIA deemed it too fast in the interests of safety and the chicane appeared which they use now.
Yet GP used that corner with no premonition that having a totally paved run off was not a concern, talk about not being proactive.

Carmelo was asked about this in the press conference, and he said it was never brought up. He did his best to deflect from the responsibility btw, as he kept putting it back on the riders. Not that the organization has a responsibly to protect the riders even from themselves. If you look at that track from an aerial perspective, and pay someone to look for flaws from a motorcycle racing point of view, that turn was a glaring hazard. All paved to the barrier! I'm not buying the ........ answer that having it paved can be safer than gravel. As Stoner said, having paved run off only serves to allow the riders to take greater risks, if the gravel is there, the prospect of a sure crash is sobering.
 
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Not entirely Jums as there is gravel - https://www.google.com.au/maps/plac...150ed08bef7e2b48!8m2!3d41.5682267!4d2.2571491

Salom missed the gravel as he had fallen extremely early in the piece, almost as if he had fallen on the straight leading into the turn.

As Krop has said elsewhere, there is no record of a motorcycle accident at the spot where Salom crashed (sure, first time for everything) and only 6 in 10 years with the others finishing in the gravel

Sure it can be said that the wall being square on is a danger (which it is) but at the same point, many tracks have walls in places that are dangerous if the same system is used but where there is little risk due to track design

Until it is known what caused Salom to crash (could he have had a medical episode for example?) then we need to hold back a little on the tarmac side as the cause of the death (I do not like it either), but as I have said elsewhere we do need to go hard on the fact that there were 4 rows of tyres behind the airfence whereas a couple of layers of airfence and no tyres would have behaved differently
 
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