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Hayden to score more points than Rossi in 2011 ?

B

Bunyip

Joined Aug 2007
824 Posts | 19+
Sydney
What if Rossi really can,t get to grips with the Ducati.........................



Some say Rossi and Melandri have similar styles and here is Melandri predicting no good fortune for Vale



Whether that would be successful is another matter altogether, Melandri noted. "I don't know whether he will manage to change the situation," Melandri told Motosprint, "but he has the means to do it. I'm not convinced that he will succeed, however."



http://motomatters.com/news/2010/11/18/marco_melandri_i_had_the_same_problems_a.html



To Haydens credit, he never gave up, and after an awful 2009, has managed to largely get his head around the bike. Does that mean Hayden has 12 months head start on Rossi??
 
Well thats exaclty what I've been saying. Good of Marco to come out with it.



And it would not surprise me at all if Hayden tops Rossi in 2011. But I would think that something of more import is that if Rossi has not got "the hang of it" by mid 2011 then he should see Marco about how he got out, because waiting for 2012 will be too late.
 
BarryMachine said:
Well thats exaclty what I've been saying. Good of Marco to come out with it.



And it would not surprise me at all if Hayden tops Rossi in 2011. But I would think that something of more import is that if Rossi has not got "the hang of it" by mid 2011 then he should see Marco about how he got out, because waiting for 2012 will be too late.
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I have to disagree . Whatever they do to the ducati next year it will still be an 800.



I don't call anyone a bopper anyway, but bopperism is not required to be of the opinion that a rider who has always performed oustandingly whatever the bike will continue to do so, with those contending he will not do so the more likely to be prejudiced imo.
 
michaelm said:
I have to disagree . Whatever they do to the ducati next year it will still be an 800.



I don't call anyone a bopper anyway, but bopperism is not required to be of the opinion that a rider who has always performed oustandingly whatever the bike will continue to do so, with those contending he will not do so the more likely to be prejudiced imo.
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Well you are throwing a lot to speculation just for those extra 200cc. And given that the last time Rossi was on a 990 he got beaten, and that there are some evenmore competitive riders out there, a switch to 990 again may not be in Rossi's favour. Especially since the Ducati with its "power" has him stumped.

Its also important to realise that the fuel restrictions in place will also affect power usage limits ...... though who can ride with the torque may tell.

I don't go for the whole "he's a 990 rider thing, but mainly outof personal experience, fast guys are usually fast on anything and with little adaptation time.



2012 is an open book to me, but I do tend toward it being the realm of the same guys who are topping the 800's in 2011, whomsoever they be.
 
BarryMachine said:
Well you are throwing a lot to speculation just for those extra 200cc. And given that the last time Rossi was on a 990 he got beaten, and that there are some evenmore competitive riders out there, a switch to 990 again may not be in Rossi's favour. Especially since the Ducati with its "power" has him stumped.

Its also important to realise that the fuel restrictions in place will also affect power usage limits ...... though who can ride with the torque may tell.

I don't go for the whole "he's a 990 rider thing, but mainly outof personal experience, fast guys are usually fast on anything and with little adaptation time.



2012 is an open book to me, but I do tend toward it being the realm of the same guys who are topping the 800's in 2011, whomsoever they be.
Click to expand...

I meant the 800 formula as a whole, the fuel restrictions, the advances in electronics etc rather than the capacity itself which may be at least partly coincidental; at the moment the leading exponent of riding these bikes is jorge lorenzo who is said to have a 250 riding style rather than nicky's more superbike style in his pomp, corner speed vs point and shoot etc , concerning which you may well be better informed than I am.



I am mainly trying to imply that writing off rossi after one test where he rode injured and awarding the 2011 title to stoner is perhaps unwise; I consider it to be bad karma apart from anything else.
 
Bunyip said:
What if Rossi really can,t get to grips with the Ducati.........................



Some say Rossi and Melandri have similar styles and here is Melandri predicting no good fortune for Vale



Whether that would be successful is another matter altogether, Melandri noted. "I don't know whether he will manage to change the situation," Melandri told Motosprint, "but he has the means to do it. I'm not convinced that he will succeed, however."



http://motomatters.com/news/2010/11/18/marco_melandri_i_had_the_same_problems_a.html



To Haydens credit, he never gave up, and after an awful 2009, has managed to largely get his head around the bike. Does that mean Hayden has 12 months head start on Rossi??
Click to expand...

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2w1g-idt-8U[/media]
 
Could we perhaps give the bloke a chance?

Rossi has done the Valencia test. Thats it.

Could we just see how much he will improve over the coming tests before everyone gets too negative and writes his career off?

This is Valentino Rossi we're talking about. Does anyone seriously think after all that he's achieved, he isn't capable of getting his head round that Ducati?

And all due respect to Marco Melandri, but I dont think he's qualified to make comments. He's hardly on a level pegging to Rossi.

You doubters will eat your words. Rossi will come good, and sooner than you think.

No, Nicky will not score more points than him in 2011.
 
C,mon Rog.............you can do better than that, surely.



Am I adding to the seeds of doubt that make you toss and turn at night..................................is Rossi really the messiah, or just a naughty boy after all. (apologies of pythonesque magnitude).



Don,t blame me..........have a word to Marco.



Anyway, I DO believe Vale can do something with the Ducati, but it may be his greatest challenge to date.
 
I doubt it, very much. I understand that Hayden fans might be optimistic, or a few people who don't like Rossi may be hopeful for an upset (which is fine by me) but realisically can you predict Hayden to outscore Rossi?



Based on all the evidence available i think it would be foolish to predict this. I'm not saying it's impossible because it clearly isn't, but a correct prediction made for the wrong reasons is still a poor prediction. Does anyone actually have a justification for predicting Nicky to beat Rossi?
 
Tom said:
I doubt it, very much. I understand that Hayden fans might be optimistic, or a few people who don't like Rossi may be hopeful for an upset (which is fine by me) but realisically can you predict Hayden to outscore Rossi?



Based on all the evidence available i think it would be foolish to predict this. I'm not saying it's impossible because it clearly isn't, but a correct prediction made for the wrong reasons is still a poor prediction. Does anyone actually have a justification for predicting Nicky to beat Rossi?
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personally i think rossi will be force by the time they have sorted the duc out for him,just like back in 2004

but if the gp11 will be somewhat near the gp10 i think hayden could keep up with him to a certain degree,at least better than he was able to do with stoner!



possible reasons : haydens aggressive style and 2 more years on a bike that is notorious for being very different and very very difficult



he maybe the goat and theres no doubt that he is the better rider overall,but 2 years of experience could very well mean hayden has the opportunity to stay with rossi or maybe even beat him in the seasons earlier races



am i a hater now?
 
cliché guevara said:
personally i think rossi will be force by the time they have sorted the duc out for him,just like back in 2004

but if the gp11 will be somewhat near the gp10 i think hayden could keep up with him to a certain degree,at least better than he was able to do with stoner!



possible reasons : haydens aggressive style and 2 more years on a bike that is notorious for being very different and very very difficult



he maybe the goat and theres no doubt that he is the better rider overall,but 2 years of experience could very well mean hayden has the opportunity to stay with rossi or maybe even beat him in the seasons earlier races



am i a hater now?
Click to expand...



No i agree to an extent. I think if they started a season now with the bike unchanged, Nicky's experience and agressive style would help him stay close or possible ahead of Rossi for at least some time. But i don't think any of us really think Ducati wont change the bike to suit Rossi.



Thinking about Melandri's comments and the problems the Ducati bike obviously has, it's easy to critisize Ducati for questioning their riders feedback and being stubborn, but getting Rossi on board is not just a big game of Italian pride and marketting. Now they have recruited a rider and team who's feedback who is not doubted, and they are in a position to alter their working methods and design philosophy to make a bike that many riders can get on with. They are securing their long term future as a competative team in motogp, beyond Rossi. The same thing happened at Yamaha
 
Nicky could well be in front early in the season BUT I see Vale building a momentum to gradually outscore him (and I`m a Hayden fan).
<
 
cliché guevara said:
personally i think rossi will be force by the time they have sorted the duc out for him,just like back in 2004

but if the gp11 will be somewhat near the gp10 i think hayden could keep up with him to a certain degree,at least better than he was able to do with stoner!



possible reasons : haydens aggressive style and 2 more years on a bike that is notorious for being very different and very very difficult



he maybe the goat and theres no doubt that he is the better rider overall,but 2 years of experience could very well mean hayden has the opportunity to stay with rossi or maybe even beat him in the seasons earlier races



am i a hater now?
Click to expand...

No, just misguided and nieve
<
 
Bunyip said:
C,mon Rog.............you can do better than that, surely.



Am I adding to the seeds of doubt that make you toss and turn at night..................................is Rossi really the messiah, or just a naughty boy after all. (apologies of pythonesque magnitude).



Don,t blame me..........have a word to Marco.



Anyway, I DO believe Vale can do something with the Ducati, but it may be his greatest challenge to date.
Click to expand...



Blessed are the cheesemakers.
<
 
SprogTheDog said:
Could we perhaps give the bloke a chance?

Rossi has done the Valencia test. Thats it.

Could we just see how much he will improve over the coming tests before everyone gets too negative and writes his career off?

This is Valentino Rossi we're talking about. Does anyone seriously think after all that he's achieved, he isn't capable of getting his head round that Ducati?

And all due respect to Marco Melandri, but I dont think he's qualified to make comments. He's hardly on a level pegging to Rossi.

You doubters will eat your words. Rossi will come good, and sooner than you think.

No, Nicky will not score more points than him in 2011.
Click to expand...

You hit the nail on the head

This forum is full of Sunday evening couch racers

Full of .... and big on speculation

Ducati never changed the bike to suit anyone other than Stoner, because he was winning on it

Hayden has always been a #2 rider - good for an occasional podium and regular top 5 or 6

also rans



Melandri has not won anything to talk about since 250's

His best recent performance was as the under-dog on the Kwak

Ducati has signed up Rossi to develop a consistently winning bike for them

To take World Champ, Team AND Constructor's title

Anyone wanting to jump on the Valencia test lack of speed needs to read what Burgess and his surgeon had to say about his shoulder

Roll-on 2011 and let's see some good racing
 
Bunyip said:
C,mon Rog.............you can do better than that, surely.



Am I adding to the seeds of doubt that make you toss and turn at night..................................is Rossi really the messiah, or just a naughty boy after all. (apologies of pythonesque magnitude).



Don,t blame me..........have a word to Marco.



Anyway, I DO believe Vale can do something with the Ducati, but it may be his greatest challenge to date.
Click to expand...

I think he's probably more naughty boy than messiah
<
but then again you dont have to be a messiah to out score Haystack
<
<
 

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