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GOAT

A

AntG

Joined Feb 2015
1K Posts | 678+
England
I am sick to death of seeing this term anywhere on motorcycle racing forums.

GOAT apparently means "Greatest Of All Time"

Who you regard to be the 'greatest of all time' is entirely an opinion but people throw it around as if it's a fact, I saw on another message board a few years back that modern riders are better than old riders because they go faster "simple as that mate" obviously advances in motorcycle and tyre technology and improvements in track surfaces have nothing to do with that do they fella? He said Hailwood was just a silly old man, yeah a silly old man who ruled motorcycle racing at a time when motorcycle racers had a mortality rate similar to WW2 fighter pilots.

It's not their fault really it's that they're brainwashed by fawning sycophants like Neil Hodgson and Suzi Perry who force feed this ........ to the masses.
 
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Current GOAT is called Valentino Rossi.

But Marquez could take that title away from him if does as well as expected.

The current generation is always the best. They start earlier, they're fitter, they learn from previous racing history etc.
 
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Greatest of ALL TIME

15 word titles = Agostini
He also carries himself with dignity that Rossi could never manage...
 
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The Worst said:
Current GOAT is called Valentino Rossi.

But Marquez could take that title away from him if does as well as expected.

The current generation is always the best. They start earlier, they're fitter, they learn from previous racing history etc.
Click to expand...

Lets see how the current generation last on the TT.
 
Win percentages in MGP?

Surtees - 76%
Agostini - 66%
Doohan - 39%
Marquez - 39%
Rossi - 34%
Lorenzo - 27%
Stoner - 26%
Rainey - 25%
Schwantz - 24%
 
Every rider on this list https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Grand_Prix_motorcycle_racing_World_champions#By_rider is a great motorcycle racer because regardless of the class whether it was a 50cc title in the 60's, 125 in the 70's, 350 in the 80's, 500 in the 90's or 1000 now they have all been a world champion. Now determining who is the greatest ever is an impossible task because there are so many variables, some will look at the amount of titles and say "Yes, he's got the most he's the best" but then that rider - Agostini for example - spent the majority of his career on a much superior bike and hence a huge amount of titles came with it. On the other hand Kevin Schwantz only has one world championship but he spent his entire career riding a Suzuki which wasn't as good as the Hondas or Yamahas of that time. That's why it's entirely opinion based, statistics don't tell the full story.
 
I see it that there is a greatest for each generation.....and the GOAT, though i have called Rossi that before, has to be on something equal to all generations...which we cant really do....

Maybe it should be GOAATT (Greatest of All at the Time)...In that sense I looked very very quickly through the MotoGP legends for their records...riders vs their peers on 'similar' machines of their era

GOAATTs
The 1950s - G. Duke
Early-1960s to Mid-1960s - M. Hailwood
Mid-1960s to Mid-1970s - Ago
Late 1970s to Early 1980s - KRSR
Mid-1980s - F. Spencer
Mid-1980s to Late-1980s - E.Lawson
Late-1980s to Early-1990s - W.Rainey
Mid-1990s to Late 1990s - M. Doohan
Late-1990s to Mid-2000s - V.Rossi
Mid-2000s to Late-2000s - C.Stoner
Late-2000s to 2013 - J.Lorenzo
2014 to Now - M.Marquez

There points that GOAATT do change over and it can be over a couple of seasons...

So in the end it as AntG said at the start...it is a personal thing......it is Rossi for some, Ago to others, and Hailwood to many....If JLo can win this years title and maybe win on the Ducati next or the following year then maybe it JLo.....it all depends on your point of view...
 
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Stoner was too weak and prone to crashing. He was very quickly adaptable to different bikes and tracks, for which he deserves a lot of credit. But his racecraft and mental strength were lacking relative to say Rossi or Marquez. Lorenzo is very strong in some areas but a bit of a one-trick pony. I'd rate him overall similarly to Stoner, but they're very different.

Rossi and Marquez are head and shoulders above anyone else from any era.

Sorry if this is not compatible with your agenda/nationality.
 
The Worst said:
Stoner was too weak and prone to crashing. He was very quickly adaptable to different bikes and tracks, for which he deserves a lot of credit. But his racecraft and mental strength were lacking relative to say Rossi or Marquez. Lorenzo is very strong in some areas but a bit of a one-trick pony. I'd rate him overall similarly to Stoner, but they're very different.

Rossi and Marquez are head and shoulders above anyone else from any era.

Sorry if this is not compatible with your agenda/nationality.
Click to expand...

Hahahahahahaahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
 
The Worst said:
Stoner was too weak and prone to crashing. He was very quickly adaptable to different bikes and tracks, for which he deserves a lot of credit. But his racecraft and mental strength were lacking relative to say Rossi or Marquez. Lorenzo is very strong in some areas but a bit of a one-trick pony. I'd rate him overall similarly to Stoner, but they're very different.

Rossi and Marquez are head and shoulders above anyone else from any era.

Sorry if this is not compatible with your agenda/nationality.
Click to expand...

Don't agree with your point about lacking 'racecraft' at all.

No need to apologise. My nationality is extremely confused and I don't have an agenda. Although I regard Rossi as utterly insincere, devious and disingenuous I am neutral in terms of affiliation. My favourite riders are either dead or long gone.

On the other hand if you want flagrant unashamed fanboyism, which I make no apologies for, visit the footie thread.
 
MigsAngel said:
I see it that there is a greatest for each generation.....and the GOAT, though i have called Rossi that before, has to be on something equal to all generations...which we cant really do....

Maybe it should be GOAATT (Greatest of All at the Time)...In that sense I looked very very quickly through the MotoGP legends for their records...riders vs their peers on 'similar' machines of their era

GOAATTs
The 1950s - G. Duke
Early-1960s to Mid-1960s - M. Hailwood
Mid-1960s to Mid-1970s - Ago
Late 1970s to Early 1980s - KRSR
Mid-1980s - F. Spencer
Mid-1980s to Late-1980s - E.Lawson
Late-1980s to Early-1990s - W.Rainey
Mid-1990s to Late 1990s - M. Doohan
Late-1990s to Mid-2000s - V.Rossi
Mid-2000s to Late-2000s - C.Stoner
Late-2000s to 2013 - J.Lorenzo
2014 to Now - M.Marquez

There points that GOAATT do change over and it can be over a couple of seasons...

So in the end it as AntG said at the start...it is a personal thing......it is Rossi for some, Ago to others, and Hailwood to many....If JLo can win this years title and maybe win on the Ducati next or the following year then maybe it JLo.....it all depends on your point of view...
Click to expand...



Believe Migs laid it out the best...

GOAT is a media and fan created term for marketing, t-shirts and forum posts.
 
Arrabbiata1 said:
Don't agree with your point about lacking 'racecraft' at all.

No need to apologise. My nationality is extremely confused and I don't have an agenda. Although I regard Rossi as utterly insincere, devious and disingenuous I am neutral in terms of affiliation. My favourite riders are either dead or long gone.

On the other hand if you want flagrant unashamed fanboyism, which I make no apologies for, visit the footie thread.
Click to expand...

The fence straddler.

You should take a side when it comes to VR.
 
JPSLotus said:
The fence straddler.

You should take a side when it comes to VR.
Click to expand...

Why? So long as it's close, legitimate racing and a tight championship, I don't care who is up top. The only reason I wouldn't like VR to win another championship is because of his largely insufferable glory hunting fan base. As much damage as Rossi has done to the integrity of the series, I prefer to follow the sport not the rider. I enjoy it more that way.
 
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Arrabbiata1 said:
Why? So long as it's close, legitimate racing and a tight championship, I don't care who is up top. The only reason I wouldn't like VR to win another championship is because of his largely insufferable glory hunting fan base. As much damage as Rossi has done to the integrity of the series, I prefer to follow the sport not the rider. I enjoy it more that way.
Click to expand...

I also find it enjoyable when someone who has been so damaging to the sport, doesn't win titles that continue to "validate" everything he's done in the eyes of most everyone save for a small minority.

But I'd also tell you that while you are more interested in following the sport instead of the rider --as many of us here are-- the two are inextricably linked together so following the sport makes it impossible to avoid following the rider given the coverage. As an example, sycophant Mat Oxley has written yet another fawning piece over at Motorsport Magazine about the wonder of VR. Impossible to see the sport as a distinct and separate entity from the rider.
 

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