ghost racing

Wow .... get ready for a boring year ..... if you don't like runaway wins.

A lot of sneaky analysis goes into it doesn't it ..... Is Burgess really that tricky/smart?

I think only Stoner can stop himself in 08 ... ie. a return to 06 performance.

It is shaping up like an old fashioned Swantz, Rainey, Lawson, Doohan type year ..... love it.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 8 2008, 07:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Wow .... get ready for a boring year ..... if you don't like runaway wins.




It is shaping up like an old fashioned Swantz, Rainey, Lawson, Doohan type year ..... love it.
Why did you say two opposite points? Its either gonna be a run away season or its gonna be a Schwantz etal year? I think it's gonna be like 07. Stoner the run away, with Rossi and Pedrosa trying to keep up. Hayden will be making as much progress as if he were on a tri-cycle.

Ah, Hayden fans, brace yourselves for another very ......, ...... year for us!!!

Again, Honda development is behind all the factories, bar none.

Bridgestone kills michiline, and thats why my boy Hopkins will be up there

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Feb 9 2008, 02:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Why did you say two opposite points?

because when Shwantz Rainey Doohan & Co. were racing it was those chaps dicing a mile in fron of the "rest of the pack" .... And this year we may see "the wrong people" racing up front. I'm suggesting that if say Stoner, Pedrosa and Lorenzo are the three guys up front ..... will it really appease those that are saying "its been boring"?. If Rossi had been the one way up in front ( as per say 2005 ) would it have been as "boring"? If it had been Hayden way up in front?? I think we have to look at the demographic to see why it was boring not the bull about side by side racing


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Feb 9 2008, 02:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Its either gonna be a run away season or its gonna be a Schwantz etal year? I think it's gonna be like 07. Stoner the run away, with Rossi and Pedrosa trying to keep up.

Well I was kinda hoping Pedrosa and Lorenzo will step it up throughout the year. So I get to see some more "hell for leather" riding/racing ( I don't need to see the other guys side by side to realise you can be racing from miles in front ) ....... and the swapping places folk get their wish if Pedrosa, Lorenzo etc, step it up.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Feb 9 2008, 02:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Ah, Hayden fans, brace yourselves for another very ......, ...... year for us!!!

Ah I don't think I would ever write off Hayden!! .... he can turn out super fast laps ..... so as soon as they figure out how to make that consistent .... watch out rest of the field.....

I'm a bit surprised you are writing him off so early?? ...... not long over a year ago he earned number #1!!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 8 2008, 08:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I'm a bit surprised you are writing him off so early?? ...... not long over a year ago he earned number #1!!
Dude, I'm as a die-hard Hayden fanboy as is possible. It’s just what I see in the testing, it is a guy struggling. Sure he can click off a fast lap on those good Michelin Qs, but that doesn't win races. I think Honda is in disarray and extremely behind the development curve. Something very bad and uncharacteristic has happened to HRC when they made the move to 800s. It’s been a dismal development on the engineering side of things. To make matters worse, they are developing the bike around Pedrosa leaving Hayden as a red-headed-step-child. I believe in Hayden's ability, probably more than most on here because I have personally followed his career since he was wining Grand National Dirt track titles here in the States. He is an awesome talent. He was a marvel here and was catapulted to the highest echelons of the motorcycling world after stunning success at the lower classes and superbike level against a Susuki-Mladin title machine. He was well suited to the 990s, but I'm afraid that now he hasn't shined or showcased his talent in the 800 era for various reason. First and foremost, he has not adapted to the bike, but not far from the equation, the Honda has been pitiful. So no, I'm not writing the guy off, but I am not gonna stick my head in the sand about the current lack of Honda development situation. Come on man, they are poised to use the 07 spec engine, because the “new” one they have develop is performing poorly, worse than the “old” one, if that is not cause for concern, I don’t know what is! That means they are going to be playing catch up again, relegating Hayden to testing ...., that means not being a contender for the championship.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Feb 9 2008, 04:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>That means they are going to be playing catch up again, relegating Hayden to testing ...., that means not being a contender for the championship.

I still don't get all this "Hayden will be developing again" business ..... is Hayden going to be forced to ride the Pneumo-Honda and Pedrosa the SpringVale or something? What identifies Haydens Honda as the development bike and Pedrosas not? Did they do that in 07?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 9 2008, 12:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I still don't get all this "Hayden will be developing again" business ..... is Hayden going to be forced to ride the Pneumo-Honda and Pedrosa the SpringVale or something? What identifies Haydens Honda as the development bike and Pedrosas not? Did they do that in 07?

They have no direction whatsoever.... what a waste.

Honda used to scare everybody.

Kawaski is the new honda watch out

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 9 2008, 03:01 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think only Stoner can stop himself in 08 ...

I think your underestimating the effects of Rossi on the same tyre as Stoner... Alot of times Rossi was not far away from Stoner with Engine problems and Michelins.

08 will be different... and Lorenzo could be a real threat if Michelin comes back.

Otherwise i can't see Stoner beating Rossi more times than Rossi beating Stoner on the same tyres.

If you look at the races Rossi was able to win last year... Stoner was not really threatening.

You could say the same about Stoners wins... but you know he had better tyres.

it's still just testing remember. it looks like something to be concerned about but i think honda might be holdin more cards. hayden also has never been know for his dominating test times. wait for the irta test that useally gives a much clearer picture of how things will pan out in the early part of the season.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Feb 9 2008, 05:54 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>He was well suited to the 990s, but I'm afraid that now he hasn't shined or showcased his talent in the 800 era for various reason. First and foremost, he has not adapted to the bike, but not far from the equation, the Honda has been pitiful. So no, I'm not writing the guy off, but I am not gonna stick my head in the sand about the current lack of Honda development situation. Come on man, they are poised to use the 07 spec engine, because the “new” one they have develop is performing poorly, worse than the “old” one, if that is not cause for concern, I don’t know what is! That means they are going to be playing catch up again, relegating Hayden to testing ...., that means not being a contender for the championship.

I'd agree with that assessment. I'd go so far as to say HRC did not really care or want Nicky to win the title in 2006. I really think HRC was ready to let Nicky go, but the press 'shamed' (lose face) HRC into re-hiring him 2007/2008.

Also, didn't HRC recently (last 2 or 3 years) fire most of their engineering staff back in Japan and start again?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (frosty58 @ Feb 9 2008, 08:43 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>it's still just testing remember. it looks like something to be concerned about but i think honda might be holdin more cards. hayden also has never been know for his dominating test times. wait for the irta test that useally gives a much clearer picture of how things will pan out in the early part of the season. Frost, hav u read the resent articles on the Honda development? There are about 3 articles I've seen on the subject, and all make me very concerned. Not just the real serious engine problem, but the new chassis has a mystery front end feel problem. Now couple this with a tire that has to play catch up, and really, I don't think its gonna work. Do u remember the three major concerns after the first 3rd of last year with the Honda? Let me remind you: poor power, poor front end feel, poor tire performance. This again is the problem. And in a season with Stoner poised to start exactly where he left off last season and Rossi showing he has adapted to those Bstones and much improved bike, I don't think anything less than immediate podium finishes for Hayden will keep him in contention until they figure out a winning combination. So in a season where we see much improved bikes all around with different brands like Suzuki and Kawasaki, plus outstanding and hungry young talent like the 250 newboots, plus Toseland and Ducati rookie of the year Guintoli, well I think Hayden has an uphill battle. Like I said, I'm as fanboy and mindless cheerleader for Nicky as possible, but no amount of wishful hope can fix some of these very dismal development issues.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MigsAngel @ Feb 9 2008, 12:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I'd agree with that assessment. I'd go so far as to say HRC did not really care or want Nicky to win the title in 2006. I really think HRC was ready to let Nicky go, but the press 'shamed' (lose face) HRC into re-hiring him 2007/2008.

Also, didn't HRC recently (last 2 or 3 years) fire most of their engineering staff back in Japan and start again?

Yes. They did.

Rumor has it, it was over the Nicky Hayden situation.

As you may or may not know Fukui was once the managing director of HRC in the late 80's and some have suggested he has a love affair with American riders. After being promoted to CEO in 2003 he began to take interest in Honda's MGP program again. Apparently, Fukui was anxiously awaiting a clinch by Hayden and a win at Motegi for Honda marketing. Fukui was supposedly directly behind re-signing Nicky just 2 days before the Motegi round.

This is what I've heard:

1. Fukui was angered by the teams inability to clinch and demanded that Nicky be given the regular bike starting in PI. The wet prevented Nicky from making any headway but the stage was set for Motegi. After a poor 5th showing at Motegi, Fukui began asking about Honda's poor performance. When he found out HRC had put Hayden back on the Evo test bike he became so enraged he started signing pink slips right then and there.

Obviously, Nicky was fast at Estoril and Valencia, like I said, rumor has it he was on the regular bike (nearly the same bike he had at the end of 2005).

That's what I've heard. Like all good rumors it makes sense.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Feb 9 2008, 04:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Frost, hav u read the resent articles on the Honda development? There are about 3 articles I've seen on the subject, and all make me very concerned. Not just the real serious engine problem, but the new chassis has a mystery front end feel problem. Now couple this with a tire that has to play catch up, and really, I don't think its gonna work. Do u remember the three major concerns after the first 3rd of last year with the Honda? Let me remind you: poor power, poor front end feel, poor tire performance. This again is the problem. And in a season with Stoner poised to start exactly where he left off last season and Rossi showing he has adapted to those Bstones and much improved bike, I don't think anything less than immediate podium finishes for Hayden will keep him in contention until they figure out a winning combination. So in a season where we see much improved bikes all around with different brands like Suzuki and Kawasaki, plus outstanding and hungry young talent like the 250 newboots, plus Toseland and Ducati rookie of the year Guintoli, well I think Hayden has an uphill battle. Like I said, I'm as fanboy and mindless cheerleader for Nicky as possible, but no amount of wishful hope can fix some of these very dismal development issues.
jumkie my brother you've lost faith. just wait & see how it pans out. i know the reports have not been that great sounding, i've been readin them, & honda does'nt exactly inspire any confidence in me at helpin nick out all that much but i'm not ready to give up on him just yet.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Feb 10 2008, 09:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Yes. They did.

Rumor has it, it was over the Nicky Hayden situation.

As you may or may not know Fukui was once the managing director of HRC in the late 80's and some have suggested he has a love affair with American riders. After being promoted to CEO in 2003 he began to take interest in Honda's MGP program again. Apparently, Fukui was anxiously awaiting a clinch by Hayden and a win at Motegi for Honda marketing. Fukui was supposedly directly behind re-signing Nicky just 2 days before the Motegi round.

This is what I've heard:

1. Fukui was angered by the teams inability to clinch and demanded that Nicky be given the regular bike starting in PI. The wet prevented Nicky from making any headway but the stage was set for Motegi. After a poor 5th showing at Motegi, Fukui began asking about Honda's poor performance. When he found out HRC had put Hayden back on the Evo test bike he became so enraged he started signing pink slips right then and there.

Obviously, Nicky was fast at Estoril and Valencia, like I said, rumor has it he was on the regular bike (nearly the same bike he had at the end of 2005).

That's what I've heard. Like all good rumors it makes sense.
Very interesting...