Dorna to kill world superstock

what i don't get is what this new class is supposed to be...


honda nsf250 cup for b-grade riders?


can't think of any production machines that would be suitable for 250cc 4 stroke racing....especially with the baby ninja now being 300cc and the cbr250r being anything but a sportsbike....why not just stick with the cbr500r cup for next year?


 


here's a better idea: introduce underbone racing in europe,that would actually be fun to watch.

<strike> World Superbike</strike>.  It begins.  Bye bye Wsbk.  Your success on the field has come back to haunt you. 

Must have missed something. I don't even see the word superstock mentioned anywhere in the article itself which was written back in October when little or nothing was actually known about any specific changes. The only place superstock is mentioned on the whole page is in the form of speculation by someone in the "comments" section.

This is probably about global rules alignment. The manufacturers are not particularly keen on Superstock b/c it encourages them to put racing equipment on production bikes. Sounds cool, but isn't. How long do racing engines last? How much maintenance do they require?


 


The manufacturers have probably lost interest, but more importantly this could be a move to create an international rules standard. Right now, any series affiliated with the FIA can use FIM Superstock regulations as a basis for their home series. I believe ASBK and IDM both use Superstock related rules, and BSB Evo used Superstock engine regulations last year. If the Superstock rulebooks are withdrawn, the national sanctioning bodies would be required to run the new Superbike regulations.


 


This could be a precursor to the reintroduction of homologation specials or racing kits. If the manufacturers are going to invest in production racing equipment, the FIM need to guarantee they have a vast market to sell their wares.

mylexicon

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This is probably about global rules alignment. <u>The manufacturers are not particularly keen on Superstock b/c it encourages them to put racing equipment on production bikes. Sounds cool, but isn't. How long do racing engines last? </u>How much maintenance do they require?


 


The manufacturers have probably lost interest, but more importantly this could be a move to create an international rules standard. Right now, any series affiliated with the FIA can use FIM Superstock regulations as a basis for their home series. I believe ASBK and IDM both use Superstock related rules, and BSB Evo used Superstock engine regulations last year. If the Superstock rulebooks are withdrawn, the national sanctioning bodies would be required to run the new Superbike regulations.


 


This could be a precursor to the reintroduction of homologation specials or racing kits. If the manufacturers are going to invest in production racing equipment, the FIM need to guarantee they have a vast market to sell their wares.

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Complete and utter rubbish,the factories have loved superstock as the racing is always good and as a marketing tool its been fantastic,the factories have lost no interest,if it gets ditched its becouse of your friends at Dorna, lex i like some of what you write but dont make .... up just to defend Dorna.

I am sad. Super stock ain't dead, it is now WSBK. 


 


Carmen is a complete fuckhead and a .... and one day all that Karma for torturing donkeys and watching midget .... will run the tyrant over. 


 


....... mother ...... ....... .... dog ...... arse licker .... sniffing ....... ..... 


 


I fully admit to being in astronomical pain, I haw taken double my normal dose of opiates and I am flying. 


 


Straight to ....... Spain to kick one .... dog ...... in the arse. 


 


 


Deal, JUM cliché  right now I am having an imaginary man hug with you lamenting the loss of a great thing. I want you to push my wheel chair to his front door so I can drag him to the ground and punch him insensate.


 


Then I am going to get a toy train (Stephenson's Rocket) and stick it right up hid arse, choo choo .............  

What we are going to end up with is WWE (MotoGP) and Steroid Free WWE (WSBK). There will be no sport there will just be entertainment.


In the short term it is going to suck but long term maybe ok. When Dorna destroys the whole of World Motorcycle Racing in all its forms there will be an opportunity for someone to start something new and get back to the grass roots. Seeing who is the smartest and who has the biggest balls.

Andy Roo

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I am sad. Super stock ain't dead, it is now WSBK. 


 


Carmen is a complete fuckhead and a .... and one day all that Karma for torturing donkeys and watching midget .... will run the tyrant over. 


 


....... mother ...... ....... .... dog ...... arse licker .... sniffing ....... ..... 


 


I fully admit to being in astronomical pain, I haw taken double my normal dose of opiates and I am flying. 


 


Straight to ....... Spain to kick one .... dog ...... in the arse. 


 


 


Deal, JUM cliché  right now I am having an imaginary man hug with you lamenting the loss of a great thing. I want you to push my wheel chair to his front door so I can drag him to the ground and punch him insensate.


 


Then I am going to get a toy train (Stephenson's Rocket) and stick it right up hid arse, choo choo .............  

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I thought it was torturing midgets and watching donkey ....? I obviously wasn't paying attention!


 


But... if Super Stock does go, I won't be heartbroken - 4 classes that only an aficionado could tell apart - Nearly the same as the bike you buy; pretending to be nearly the same as the mid-capacity bike you buy while being a completely modded racebike; pretending to be a bigger version of the bike you buy with racy pipes and tyres; pretending to be the big bike you buy with a few go-fast bits thrown on, while in reality being as close to state-of-the-art as you can get using production crankcases.


 


I would like to see more distinction between the classes in 'super' racing - SS1: up to 250cc. SS2 250 to 600cc. SS3 600 to 1000cc, you can change brakes, pipes, suspension. Has to be a stock frame and swingarm, you can play with induction, has to be a stock ECU. SBK: up to 1000cc, spec racing ECU, change suspension, strengthen frame, change swingarm, stock throttle bodies and fuel pump, stock stroke and head.


 


 


I might even be convinced to return to watching super racing... haven't done so since Slight retired and Edwards moved to GP, IIRC.

thedeal

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Complete and utter rubbish,the factories have loved superstock as the racing is always good and as a marketing tool its been fantastic,the factories have lost no interest,if it gets ditched its becouse of your friends at Dorna, lex i like some of what you write but dont make .... up just to defend Dorna.

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in lex's defense  : i too heard/read multiple times that the big japanese factories are not very keen on stock style racing because it forces them to make their bikes (which are to be sold in large quantities compared to ducatis/aprillias) too racy/expensive.


 


what they want it a set of rules that allows them to make a very comfy/heavy yamaha r1 go super fast and be able to whoop an expensive , on the road unusable 1098r.


 


i'm not as pessimistic as some of you guys, i've been asking for less sophisticated wsbk for years. give them a couple of years time without any rule changes and it will be motogp 2007-2012 all over again. have a look at a naked wsbk bike. wtf is there fuel under the seat?


 


could be very simple to write new rules and its definately the right thing to do but of course we have to wait and see if/when dorna ..... it up.


there will be no 250cc class in 2014 unless its moto3 because there are no such bikes. end of.


jum, wanna make it 3 bottles you owe me?

thedeal

3400801357718612


Complete and utter rubbish,the factories have loved superstock as the racing is always good and as a marketing tool its been fantastic,the factories have lost no interest,if it gets ditched its becouse of your friends at Dorna, lex i like some of what you write but dont make .... up just to defend Dorna.

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According to whom? Where are the factory Superstock teams and the big name riders if the manufacturers think it is essential for their bottom line?


 


My only interest is finding the correct answer. The manufacturers made their production racing desires known at the outset of the 1000cc era. They published everything. They want lots of cost-effective modifications and horsepower equalization. They want one rules standard for all championships and private teams. Superstock has very few modifications and no horsepower equalization. Dorna have announced they will no longer pay European Superstock bills, perhaps the rulebook will be eliminated as well. The current SBK rules have many modification with horsepower equalization, but at an extraordinarily high cost/sophistication point with no international viability. That's part of how the IMS vs. MSMA conflict was started in 2003. Dorna have announced the SBK regulations will change.


 


Until a lion's share of the manufacturers condemn the elimination of Superstock and the effort to change Superbike, we have no reason to believe that they aren't behind the changes.

mylexicon

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According to whom? Where are the factory Superstock teams and the big name riders if the manufacturers think it is essential for their bottom line?


 


My only interest is finding the correct answer. The manufacturers made their production racing desires known at the outset of the 1000cc era. They published everything. They want lots of cost-effective modifications and horsepower equalization. They want one rules standard for all championships and private teams. Superstock has very few modifications and no horsepower equalization. <u>Dorna have announced they will no longer pay European Superstock bills,</u> perhaps the rulebook will be eliminated as well. The current SBK rules have many modification with horsepower equalization, but at an extraordinarily high cost/sophistication point with no international viability. That's part of how the IMS vs. MSMA conflict was started in 2003. Dorna have announced the SBK regulations will change.


 


Until a lion's share of the manufacturers condemn the elimination of Superstock and the effort to change Superbike, we have no reason to believe that they aren't behind the changes.

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And there is your answer.

mylexicon

3401111357761402


 


According to whom? Where are the factory Superstock teams and the big name riders if the manufacturers think it is essential for their bottom line?


 


My only interest is finding the correct answer. The manufacturers made their production racing desires known at the outset of the 1000cc era. They published everything. They want lots of cost-effective modifications and horsepower equalization. They want one rules standard for all championships and private teams. Superstock has very few modifications and no horsepower equalization. Dorna have announced they will no longer pay European Superstock bills, perhaps the rulebook will be eliminated as well. The current SBK rules have many modification with horsepower equalization, but at an extraordinarily high cost/sophistication point with no international viability. That's part of how the IMS vs. MSMA conflict was started in 2003. Dorna have announced the SBK regulations will change.


 


Until a lion's share of the manufacturers condemn the elimination of Superstock and the effort to change Superbike, we have no reason to believe that they aren't behind the changes.

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Where was the first success for the new BMW S1000RR: Superstock.


 


What happened to the BMW superstock team: they were promoted to WSBK.


 


Why?: Superstock is another feeder class to WSBK. The BMW superstock team was actually getting more out of less than the official BMW team and taught them a thing or two about dialling in electronics. Namely they used far less and got better results. They also got far more out of the S1000RR in superstock trim than the SBK team was getting considering all the modifications. The end result, now the once Superstock private team is running the official BMW SBK team.


 


Where is the new Ducati Panigale being honed: Superstock


 


Who beat them both this year with a much lower spec, cheaper but well designed bike: Kawasaki.


 


Also we just had a Superstock rider promoted to Motogp CRT grid filler status, presumably as the bikes are similar spec hahaha.


 


Att the manufacturers are in the SBK series not Motogp. Usually they vote with their feet. What does that tell you? There is currently more value racing in SBK than there there is Motogp. Instead of ....... around and sabotaging SBK Dorna shoudl fix the decacle which is Motogp.

thedeal

3401121357761686


And there is your answer.

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The cost of the championship is your obsession b/c you believe it is Dorna's obsession, but it is not the answer. Business is a value proposition. Superstock does not meet the manufacturers objectives, thus, the manufacturers did not use Superstock as the premier class in 2003, nor did they trouble themselves with factory teams or world-class riders in Superstock.


 


The situation is getting so confused, it's really quite pathetic. The people responsible for leading fans towards the answer are responsible for leading them farther and farther away from reality. When Francis Batta spoke about reforming the SBK rules, did he mention FIM Superstock? No. When Mike Edwards wrote an op-ed about the new BSB Evo rules for 2012, did he opine that Superstock regs were best? No. In fact, he said that the existing Superstock engine rules in BSB Evo prevented him from having brand allegiance with Suzuki. Did AMA or BSB select Superstock regulations when they rebooted their rulebooks? No!


 


No one on the inside is interested in maintaining the current relationship between production bikes and the Superbike/Superstock regulations. Yet many journalists are so incompetent that they imagine Dorna, a company who is rumored to be eliminating Superstock competition, is really interested in using the Superstock rules in SBK. Why? b/c Superstock is the cheapest rulebook for the commercial rights holders. Forget that Superstock has low revenue creating capability. What credentials are required to be a racing pundit in this era?


 


Neither BSB nor AMA want Superstock. Private WSBK teams don't want Superstock. Manufacturers don't want Superstock. Fans don't want Superstock. Dorna have allegedly slated Superstock for cancellation. Somehow, people imagine that the current relationship between production bikes and Superstock will be maintained in SBK. Why?


 


People who adhere to this theory need to supply an answer that holds up to scrutiny, not just a bias about Dorna's hidden agenda and their unrealistic ability to earn money with a bad rulebook, while unrealistically overruling the MSMA, the FIM, the fans, the national racing series, and all of the racing teams.

birdman

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Where was the first success for the new BMW S1000RR: Superstock.

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How did BMW get more out of the bike in Superstock than they did in SBK?


 
birdman

3401141357769204


Also we just had a Superstock rider promoted to Motogp CRT grid filler status, presumably as the bikes are similar spec hahaha.

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Why did a Superstock rider, who finished 4th in the championship, get promoted to MotoGP?

Mental Anarchist

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What we are going to end up with is WWE (MotoGP) and Steroid Free WWE (WSBK). There will be no sport there will just be entertainment.


In the short term it is going to suck but long term maybe ok. When Dorna destroys the whole of World Motorcycle Racing in all its forms there will be an opportunity for someone to start something new and get back to the grass roots. Seeing who is the smartest and who has the biggest balls.

Click to expand...

 


Well, about 20 years ago, there was almost a coup in Grands Prix.


Fell in a heap.

mylexicon

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mylexicon

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Neither BSB nor AMA want Superstock. Private WSBK teams don't want Superstock. Manufacturers don't want Superstock. Fans don't want Superstock. Dorna have allegedly slated Superstock for cancellation. Somehow, people imagine that the current relationship between production bikes and Superstock will be maintained in SBK. Why?


 

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Well, firstly, unless you know exactly what rules (and we know how well you understand tech specs) are going to control SBK in the future, your opinion holds the same value as you hold other's.


 


And secondly, Superstock was the povvo little brother of the 'real' <cough> production racing. So it was always treated as second tier. When the top tier is cut down, perhaps it becomes more compelling...

Dr No

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Well, firstly, unless you know exactly what rules (and we know how well you understand tech specs) are going to control SBK in the future, your opinion holds the same value as you hold other's.


 


And secondly, Superstock was the povvo little brother of the 'real' <cough> production racing. So it was always treated as second tier. When the top tier is cut down, perhaps it becomes more compelling...

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Of course SStk becomes more compelling. That's why AMA and BSB picked Superstock rules when they had money problems. That's why the fans love Superstock. That's why team owners like Batta, Buckmaster, and Edwards all agree that Superstock is the right direction for SBK and WSS. That's why the manufacturers are dumping money into Superstock, not Superbike. That's why Dorna are rumored to be protecting the current Superstock class.


 


SStk is just so damn compelling that people can't get enough of it.