donnington race discussion

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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mjpartyboy @ Jun 24 2008, 03:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Estoril 2006, Rossi vs. Elias. Rossi could have settled for second to safely take the points but fought Elias hard in the last few corners to get beat at the line by something like 0.002 seconds. Rossi's a winner.

Which ultimately cost him the Championship.

Long way to go yet.
Earlier, Pinky said that Rossi can settle for seconds and thirds and still win the Championship.
Well he can't settle for second or third behind Stoner or Pedrosa winning the rest of the races, and still win.
All the riders that want to win the Championship need to do as well as possible, and it would help if some points can be taken of their competitors, either by their team mates, or others.
Just as Elias took those vital 5 points of Rossi that eventually handed the title to Hayden.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mjpartyboy @ Jun 24 2008, 03:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Estoril 2006, Rossi vs. Elias. Rossi could have settled for second to safely take the points but fought Elias hard in the last few corners to get beat at the line by something like 0.002 seconds. Rossi's a winner.

probably because there was a greater chance of winning on that particular moment so he didn't ettle for anything less of a win, compared to hunting down an impossibly to hunt down casey coz he already is 6 seconds ahead of you
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (an4rew @ Jun 24 2008, 05:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Rossi will only settle for second if the win is impossible, he will win more races with that attitude.

No racer settles if they think it's realistically possible to get further, thats standard
 
I think it quite unlikely that the same three riders will swap positions on the podium for the rest of the year without something like a DNF to spoil the run. Someone is going to fall or get wiped out or have a mechanical problem. The championship is far from over.
 
I was looking over the top speeds of the race and I saw something very interesting.
Pedrosa had top speed
<

Obviously Donington doesn't have the long straight that Qutar or the likes have but its very interesting that he should still have the top speed still using the spring valve engine. What is it that Honda have found with his bike? Is it bike to weight ratio that gives him that much of an advantage on these 800cc bikes? Honda wasn't stupid in moving the class to 800cc engines so they must have thought about this.

Thoughts??
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Jun 24 2008, 03:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think it quite unlikely that the same three riders will swap positions on the podium for the rest of the year without something like a DNF to spoil the run. Someone is going to fall or get wiped out or have a mechanical problem. The championship is far from over.
Maybe, but stoner didn't have any last year and valentino didn't have many before 2006. I guess they were pushing things with the yamaha to try and catch up with the ducati power-wise last year which they haven't had to do this year thus far.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Jun 24 2008, 07:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think it quite unlikely that the same three riders will swap positions on the podium for the rest of the year without something like a DNF to spoil the run. Someone is going to fall or get wiped out or have a mechanical problem. The championship is far from over.

You all keep saying this .... is going happen. I keep hearing it in my head, any given raceday something can happen. I agree to this to a certain extent. Yes it is possible that anything can happen and we have seen some things but all of the races at the front have been a yawnfest pretty much. One racer leading virtually the entire race. Now lets move on to the top three podiums that Casey even pointed out, is the same three individuals standing up there smiling with there champagne bottles week in and week out.
LINK
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>The championship top three have now monopolised the podium positions for three straight races, and Stoner feels their consistent advantage over the rest of the field will make it hard for him to close in.

"At the moment, when all three of us seem to be getting all the podiums, it's very difficult to gain an advantage even when you do take a victory," he said.

"So I think there might be a bits of points swapping, but maybe not too much change. It would be nice to try and do more races like this, but we can only do our best and see what happens at the end."

Obviously these guys don't have to race hard to beat the rest of the field so once the race is sorted out as we saw in Donington then it appears as if the riders settle, IT HAS HAPPENED EVERY RACE. The bikes/riders are so consistent these days that not much happens, Casey even said something long those lines in his interview. My guess is the rest of the season we will see these 3 up there 90% of the time. Sorry I am very disgruntled at the way the season has been shaping up. The only thing that excites me is looking at how close the points are. Wooopie
<


There is one think that I think will throw a curve into the mix, and I agree with whomever said it, WHorehay will caue some disruption up there when he gets back on form. And I can't wait for that
<
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SackWack @ Jun 24 2008, 09:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I was looking over the top speeds of the race and I saw something very interesting.
Pedrosa had top speed
<

Obviously Donington doesn't have the long straight that Qutar or the likes have but its very interesting that he should still have the top speed still using the spring valve engine. What is it that Honda have found with his bike? Is it bike to weight ratio that gives him that much of an advantage on these 800cc bikes? Honda wasn't stupid in moving the class to 800cc engines so they must have thought about this.

Thoughts??

40 pounds lighter
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (sarto @ Jun 24 2008, 02:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Which ultimately cost him the Championship.

Incorrect. If that is what cost him the championship, then why race the 15 races before that? Oh, and did you happen to miss the last race of the season?
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Gaz @ Jun 23 2008, 08:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I love this kind of stuff (not having a go Roger, using your commens as an example only) as it is all based on assumption, lack of knowledge of any background circumstances and often ones own bias or prejudice.

If MM or any other rider took exception to some 'shaking their head' at them, then really the need to go play another sport. It is something you see week in and week out at race meetings of many different statures.

As for mocking, well who really knows whether it was intended that way as there have been no ongoing reports of this action nor any reports of any lead up activity that may have led to it. For all that we know, MM and CS may issues that go back further than one corner at any given race.

Personally, I would fully expect CS to be getting very frustrated at the lack of support being provided by his team-mate in terms of results and/or his team-mate's ability to take points of the opposition (by the way. team-mate used very loosely in this text).

Does any of this justify any derogatory remarks or actions aimed at another rider? Well IMO no, but then I don't believe that what occurred was anything out of the ordinary for most riders of this level, just that it being CS brings it to the attention (given the media dislike in some circles).

Whether CS is childish or not is an individual's perogative and up to their perception, but would say he is no more childish that a person who can't get results so walks away or quits, or kicks his bike when things don't go right, or somene who gives the ...... signal to make them feel tough.

As for the race itself (after all, this discussion is about the race), IMO it was very much 'normal service resumed' as the top three (CS, VR and DP) in the championship battled it out, only the finishing positions changed. eing honest I was pleased for West to get some sort of result but he is now at circuits where he has ridden the MotoGP bike before so the reslts should be better. CE is starting to look a bit more consistent while the others, were, well, others.

But two mentions.

Toseland - bad luck but sht happens. How often do we see a rider at their home GP do exactly what JT did? Big credit (and do mean big credit) for dusting himself off, remounting and riding around to try to see what happens. Lesson learnt and respect earnt along with it.

Spies - a lot of hoopla which grew stronger with his Qualifying position and maybe raised expectations further. A good result even if he finished lower than I thought he would and a lesson that will no doubt server him well for later races. Still a way to go before I (and likely others get the feeling that he belongs, but a definite pass mark nonetheless.

....... eh Garry. Its a pleasure to read fair and balanced posts around here. Excellent man.

I can't really add anthing and say it better, so I'll just quote your entire post. Every point you made here is right on.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (vale4607 @ Jun 24 2008, 02:41 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Snooze of a race. Just the way it is these days, guess we have to get use to it.
1. No surprise from Stoner, dominated the weekend.
2. Rossi showed his class, reminded Pedro.08 'unless you lead the first lap, no win for you'
3. Pedro.08 grew one nut passing Rossi.
4. de Puniet didn't crash, amazing!
5. melandri sucks arse
Didn't your forget something? No comment for our 4th place finisher?
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Jun 24 2008, 07:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Incorrect. If that is what cost him the championship, then why race the 15 races before that? Oh, and did you happen to miss the last race of the season?


There were plenty of "cost him the championship" moments in 2006!

And Nicky had 2 "Won him the championship" moments, laguna and Assen. (Thanks Col!)

Disclaimer: The above post may contain elements of "tongue" and "cheek" if you are lacking a sense of humour, possess an Australian passport or have Haystack as your fav rider, please look up "Joke" or "humour" on Google.

Pete
 
125 race was definately the highlight of the day, not just Scott winning, but the close racing throughout the field, the 800's by comparison was boring, after the first few laps the leaders were pretty much sorted out, then it was a case (for me) of hoping Hayden didn't slip too far backwards in the second half of the race. Sitting in the start/finish grandstand and watching as he went down the order every time he passed us, was a bit depressing, but not as bad as previous races.
Toseland falling was a huge disappointment, there were at least as many 52 shirts were we were as 46 ones. Still everyone cheered him as he went by on every lap.
Donington itself was the same as usual; overpriced, undercooked burgers & the unmistakeable waft of urine every time you got anywhere near the toilets both being part of the experience, but add to that dust flurries that made us feel like we needed tuscan raider gear to keep it out of our eyes, and a deceptively strong sun that burnt us without actually shining (we are now a flattering shade of radioactive red) made this year especially memorable, not that this will stop us from going again, it's still worth it.
<
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SackWack @ Jun 24 2008, 04:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I was looking over the top speeds of the race and I saw something very interesting.
Pedrosa had top speed
<

Obviously Donington doesn't have the long straight that Qutar or the likes have but its very interesting that he should still have the top speed still using the spring valve engine. What is it that Honda have found with his bike? Is it bike to weight ratio that gives him that much of an advantage on these 800cc bikes? Honda wasn't stupid in moving the class to 800cc engines so they must have thought about this.

Thoughts??
gearing !
dony is one of those track's where it's notoriously difficult to get the gearing right, most riders dont get of of 4th or 5th gear and most dont use 1st so there only using the middle gears. get the gearing right and reap the benefits. this is why im not quite buying into the "stoners back" theory just yet. just because you got your bike to work here does not mean it will work anywhere else and vice vercer.
<
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jun 24 2008, 02:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>No racer settles if they think it's realistically possible to get further, thats standard

No i mean if you had a 50pt lead, some riders wouldn't take the risk.... like hayden in 06.
 
Something occurred to me while re-watching Stoner's dominant Donny race. It is possible that we may have a situation where the champion of this year has less wins than his closest rival. So I was just wondering, in the case where say Rossi wins the championship but Stoner gets more wins (but loses title because of no-fault DNF mechanical), will the Rossi fans verbalize the same rationalizations for the title 'not being deserved' as they did in 06? Yeah, anybody remember all the reasons given why it was a "lucky" & "gifted" title?....just a thought.
<
 

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