Who is your favourite manufacturer?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teomolca @ Apr 2 2008, 12:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>And this is magnified by the fact their superiority in the last 15 years has been abysmal.
Sorry, it may just be me and my friend the Red Wine, but I have no idea what you meant there. Honda's superiority has been "abysmal", or the last few years Honda have been "abysmal", or what?

I meant they were much better than the rest.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teomolca @ Apr 2 2008, 02:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I meant they were much better than the rest.
Cheers for that.

It has been true, but not for the last 4 years. I appreciate Hayden won the WC in '06, but that didn't make the Honda look better than the rest to be brutally honest.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (yamaka46 @ Apr 2 2008, 02:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Cheers for that.

It has been true, but not for the last 4 years. I appreciate Hayden won the WC in '06, but that didn't make the Honda look better than the rest to be brutally honest.

No maybe not, but having three riders winning races and fighting for the title did. As did the manufacturers championship and the teams title for Repsol HRC.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Apr 2 2008, 02:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>No maybe not, but having three riders winning races and fighting for the title did. As did the manufacturers championship and the teams title for Repsol HRC.
In the last four years?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (yamaka46 @ Apr 2 2008, 02:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>In the last four years?

I was reffering to 2006

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teomolca @ Apr 2 2008, 01:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Most of MV's 500cc were won against a bunch of privateers running single cylinder Norton's and crap like that, those titles are almost worthless, heck 500cc wasn't even the premier class in the 60's.

I don't like Honda, but truth is that they are the dominating force in GPs. They've always been when they were present.

And this is magnified by the fact their superiority in the last 15 years has been abysmal.

This is inaccurate.
MV won 10 consecutive championships in 500cc (from 1958 to 1967) racing against the factory teams of Honda and Gilera. What you refer to, happened for 5 years from 1968 to 1972 because Gilera along with Honda and others withdrew from competitions due to economic problems. All Jap manufacturers then returned in 1973. But MV won again in 1973 and 1974 against the 2-strokes, with Phil Read.
So MV won all premier class titles for 17 consecutive years, out of which only 5 were easy, i.e. against a weak competition. The remaining 12 were real achievements.

Its funny how Honda'ss achievments can be passed off as just having the most money, while praise is piled onto MV who had a considerable amount of funding in their day too.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Apr 2 2008, 07:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Its funny how Honda'ss achievments can be passed off as just having the most money, while praise is piled onto MV who had a considerable amount of funding in their day too.
If you take inflation into account, even Ilmor spent more money than MV back in the day. MV's budget wouldn't compare.

Ilmor all the way

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (yamaka46 @ Apr 2 2008, 03:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Cheers for that.

It has been true, but not for the last 4 years. I appreciate Hayden won the WC in '06, but that didn't make the Honda look better than the rest to be brutally honest.

Well there's no mathematical rule to prove one thing or the opposite by my opinion on the last for years is:

2004: Honda was better, Rossi pulled a miracle
2005: Yamaha might be on par. Rossi made the difference.
2006: Honda was clearly the best if Hayden (who managed pretty much nothing until or after then) won.
2007: On par overall with Ducati (worse at the beggining better at the end), let down by the tyres.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Apr 2 2008, 03:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Its funny how Honda'ss achievments can be passed off as just having the most money, while praise is piled onto MV who had a considerable amount of funding in their day too.

I agree it's not Honda'a fault if they have always been the most powerful force from an industrial point of view. But MV - like also Honda and all others in those days - had no sponsors and no external funding.

MV were not even really into the motorcycle business. Their main business was (and is) helicopters, a very vertical market. Motorcycles were just a small side venture to satisfy the passion of Count Agusta. Following the Count's demise, MV's motorcycle division stopped all activities. After a number of years, the glorious trade name was bought by the Castiglioni brothers (Cagiva) and resurrected to sell expensive sportbikes, but there is no engineering/industrial continuity with the original MVs.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Apr 1 2008, 06:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Exactly why I dislike Suzuki. If they would put more time and effort into their MotoGP program they could be winning races with riders like Capirossi and Vermeulen.


I hear you loud and clear. Have you seen this article?


http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/66285