Tyre Wars...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Mar 16 2008, 11:22 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So stoner being regularly beaten in qualifying by people he beats easily in the race has nothing to do with tyres either?

Is that not the exact same as it was in 07

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Mar 16 2008, 06:44 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Is that not the exact same as it was in 07
Sure. My point is that on michelin qualifiers for a single lap the yamaha both last year and this year can be quite fast and more competitive with the stoner ducati than in most of the races. This may well be strongly contributed to by the quality of the michelin qualifying tyre, although I accept other factors such as race fuel restrictions and running unencumbered by traffic may also contribute. Rossi's michelins last year appeared in many races to be less durable than stoner's bridgestones, although I acknowledge it is possible this may be due to the the design and set-up of the yamaha rather than a difference between the tyre brands. One thing I think unlikely is that after having made a career of being light on tyres rossi has suddenly changed the way he rides so that he wears them out more than the rest of the field.

I think one can see why rossi may have wanted to change, and his judgement of these things is presumably better than mine or even yours. This doesn't preclude him being wrong, and as I said in the previous interminable tyre discussions I think stoner's success last year probably has messed with his head a bit so that he was looking for some sort of new angle. If he is wrong, this will be proved to most people by his performance at tracks where the bridgestones appeared to have the advantage last year rather than qatar where he performed less well than elsewhere in pre-season testing and where michelin runners whether coincidentally or not generally performed well in this year's race.

stoner beaten in qualifying??? hmmm thats why he won the brand new shiney bmw last year for the slowest qualifying time???

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Pinky @ Mar 16 2008, 06:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>stoner beaten in qualifying??? hmmm thats why he won the brand new shiney bmw last year for the slowest qualifying time???

i think the post was in reference to the qatar quali wherein 3 yams were able to beat stoner for the pole position...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Mar 16 2008, 06:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Sure. My point is that on michelin qualifiers for a single lap the yamaha both last year and this year can be quite fast and more competitive with the stoner ducati than in most of the races. This may well be strongly contributed to by the quality of the michelin qualifying tyre, although I accept other factors such as race fuel restrictions and running unencumbered by traffic may also contribute. Rossi's michelins last year appeared in many races to be less durable than stoner's bridgestones, although I acknowledge it is possible this may be due to the the design and set-up of the yamaha rather than a difference between the tyre brands. One thing I think unlikely is that after having made a career of being light on tyres rossi has suddenly changed the way he rides so that he wears them out more than the rest of the field.

I think one can see why rossi may have wanted to change, and his judgement of these things is presumably better than mine or even yours. This doesn't preclude him being wrong, and as I said in the previous interminable tyre discussions I think stoner's success last year probably has messed with his head a bit so that he was looking for some sort of new angle. If he is wrong, this will be proved to most people by his performance at tracks where the bridgestones appeared to have the advantage last year rather than qatar where he performed less well than elsewhere in pre-season testing and where michelin runners whether coincidentally or not generally performed well in this year's race.
nicely put.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Mar 16 2008, 12:38 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Except that folk seem to have forgotten the main question from last season ........ "are the Michelins broken?" .... especially since there was that glaring anomally of Stoner who was the only Bridgestone going well.

Rossi going to Bridgestone was going to answer that question one way or the other......

what has happened to date in 08? ....... Rossi is now going worse ....... would seem to suggest wel ok the Michelins were fine.

I do not say that cannot be the case, but dont you think you are jumping to conclusions?

I would be more cautious. There has been only one race, at night, for which Michelin had the time to test without any limitations just a few days before, so they could manufacture and ship in a custom tyre for the specific conditions... We'll need at least three-four races to have an idea where they really are.

... or that the MIchelins ARE fine now.

just only one race guys, give it time. then we'll sound conclusions with more data.

I think even when Michelin was winning races, it was mostly on their saturday night specials that were formulated and flown in last minute for select riders. This gave the factory riders (or whoever else receved the SNS) an unfair advantage over the other regular riders. I new tire rules are the great equalizer. Not only leveling the firld between Michelin and Bridgestone but also among Michelin riders.

As some of you have pointed out, whether or not Michelin will be competetive this year remains to be seen. But, Bridgestone's humility shoulbe appreciated:

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Generally, we have struggled for performance compared to our rivals, both with race and qualifying tyres.Casey was the only Bridgestone rider to get competitiveness from the race tyres over the full race distance, and he set some very impressive times, but the results from other riders on our tyres shows that we have more work to do on our low temperature compounds.
Bridgestone Aims to Learn from Losail