Joined Jul 2006
11K Posts | 291+
Texas
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Oct 23 2008, 01:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>LINK
Dumb .....!
<span style="font-size:36pt;line-height:100%+1
Dumb .....!
<span style="font-size:36pt;line-height:100%+1
After their results last year, they looked like they might be on the brink of, not exactly a big breakthough, but at least not sucking quite so much.
As much as like Loris, they should have gone fro Spies.
As much as like Loris, they should have gone fro Spies.
Joined Mar 2007
2K Posts | 0+
Alpha Setti 5
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MigsAngel @ Oct 23 2008, 08:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>How exactly would signing Spies has lifted the fortunes and points for Suzuki this year?
Well they couldn't get any worse...could they!
Well they couldn't get any worse...could they!
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MigsAngel @ Oct 23 2008, 08:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>How exactly would signing Spies has lifted the fortunes and points for Suzuki this year?
No one said that, but the implication is that by signing the same less than high acheiving riders, the team might well be in for more of the same next year.
No one said that, but the implication is that by signing the same less than high acheiving riders, the team might well be in for more of the same next year.
Joined Jul 2006
11K Posts | 291+
Texas
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MigsAngel @ Oct 23 2008, 02:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>How exactly would signing Spies has lifted the fortunes and points for Suzuki this year?
talking bout next year brother
talking bout next year brother
Joined Jun 2007
3K Posts | 309+
UK
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Helix @ Oct 23 2008, 08:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>No one said that, but the implication is that by signing the same less than high acheiving riders, the team might well be in for more of the same next year.
The Suzuki GP project has been sht since the switch from 500s....KRJR could not develop it, Hopper could not develop it, and now Loris and CV (very personally dissapointing) cannot develop it.....
I think the problem is not with the riders, but the engineers back in Japan.....so even if they had Spies next year, they team would still suck....
If Yoshimura ran the Suzuki GP Racing then they might have be in with a shot during the last 8 years....with Loris, CV and maybe even Hopper....
I think we have to remember Spies ran and won on a Yosh Suzuki....not a Suzuki.....big difference in my view.
The Suzuki GP project has been sht since the switch from 500s....KRJR could not develop it, Hopper could not develop it, and now Loris and CV (very personally dissapointing) cannot develop it.....
I think the problem is not with the riders, but the engineers back in Japan.....so even if they had Spies next year, they team would still suck....
If Yoshimura ran the Suzuki GP Racing then they might have be in with a shot during the last 8 years....with Loris, CV and maybe even Hopper....
I think we have to remember Spies ran and won on a Yosh Suzuki....not a Suzuki.....big difference in my view.
Joined Jun 2007
3K Posts | 309+
UK
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Oct 23 2008, 08:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Paul Dumbing
He was good at running a BSB team....that was it...but even then he did not come on board from 2001...so the issue cannot just Paul D....
He was good at running a BSB team....that was it...but even then he did not come on board from 2001...so the issue cannot just Paul D....
Yeah I agree that the engineers have to pull their fingers out, but I think a bit of new blood wouldn't be a bad thing either. Spies might be hungrier and be more willing push harder to show he deserves to be there. Loris sometimes gives the impression he's just riding to build up his retirement fund.
Joined Jul 2006
11K Posts | 291+
Texas
Spies kicked both Loris and CV's ... at least one time if i member correctly...that should have been enough to take a seat....oh well....he'll win the SBK Championship on the Yamaha, then take Colins place and win the Moto GP Championship. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/.....gif
Joined Oct 2006
25K Posts | 4K+
Your Mom's House
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MigsAngel @ Oct 23 2008, 12:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>so the issue cannot just Paul D....
I disagree (but nothing new here). Now let me ask you, has Burgess made a difference at Yamaha?
Well, I think this applies to Rizla Suzuki. I think Denning ran out Hopper, and then Spies. There was no way they thought that keeping their two regulars was a step forward.
Now I will agree with you (news flash) that if Yosh ran a team in MotoGP that they would be competitive. But this would mean they would get rid of the dead weight, and I'd say Denning would be the first one to be axed and replaced with a Schwantz. (But of course this is just dreaming).
Ok, now as far as enginequeers are concerned, yes, of course they have to improve. I'm convinced Suzuki management do NOT have a win at all cost & effort mentality. Just look at their MotoGP record over the last 30 years. Only when they had an extraordinary rider did things look up (and usually short lived). So this is why I think Spies would have been a good fit, that is, it ay have shaken up a few things at the team. Its not like his performance potential was that big of a question either. I've said it, and stand by it, had they tried harder to find a reasonable contract agreement it would have looked up with Spies (young and hungry, & not stupid), but as it stands, they continue to go backwards.
I disagree (but nothing new here). Now let me ask you, has Burgess made a difference at Yamaha?
Well, I think this applies to Rizla Suzuki. I think Denning ran out Hopper, and then Spies. There was no way they thought that keeping their two regulars was a step forward.
Now I will agree with you (news flash) that if Yosh ran a team in MotoGP that they would be competitive. But this would mean they would get rid of the dead weight, and I'd say Denning would be the first one to be axed and replaced with a Schwantz. (But of course this is just dreaming).
Ok, now as far as enginequeers are concerned, yes, of course they have to improve. I'm convinced Suzuki management do NOT have a win at all cost & effort mentality. Just look at their MotoGP record over the last 30 years. Only when they had an extraordinary rider did things look up (and usually short lived). So this is why I think Spies would have been a good fit, that is, it ay have shaken up a few things at the team. Its not like his performance potential was that big of a question either. I've said it, and stand by it, had they tried harder to find a reasonable contract agreement it would have looked up with Spies (young and hungry, & not stupid), but as it stands, they continue to go backwards.
Joined Oct 2006
25K Posts | 4K+
Your Mom's House
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xx CURVE xx @ Oct 23 2008, 01:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Spies kicked both Loris and CV's ... at least one time if i member correctly...
Both at Indy (while on the heals of Stoner & Dovi.) He may have scored a 4th had Suzuki's helmet guy had treated his visor with the rain-x (check out the race tape again, you can see him wiping his visor at the end of the straight). Dumb ... team.
Both at Indy (while on the heals of Stoner & Dovi.) He may have scored a 4th had Suzuki's helmet guy had treated his visor with the rain-x (check out the race tape again, you can see him wiping his visor at the end of the straight). Dumb ... team.
Money. They don't put enough dough on the table to win. CV and Capper are able to hit the top 5 if they have the machine but the development is too slow and the factory to uninvolved. I may be wrong but this is the only Suzuki team run by the factory all others are sponsored management. The sponsored managed teams are far better. Suzuki is in a sad state.
Joined Aug 2008
6K Posts | 748+
Thailand
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Helix @ Oct 24 2008, 02:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Yeah I agree that the engineers have to pull their fingers out, but I think a bit of new blood wouldn't be a bad thing either. Spies might be hungrier and be more willing push harder to show he deserves to be there. Loris sometimes gives the impression he's just riding to build up his retirement fund.
Loris can develop a bike, just ask Ducati. Stoner's run in '07 was basically on a bike that Loris developed. Just turned out that Casey could ride it faster. A team like Suzuki is very wise, IMHO, to keep Loris around. Spies has inherited a bike developed by Mladin and having the cagey old veteran around couldn't hurt. CV is a nice guy and all but a Spies/Capper lineup would be an improvement, no doubt. Add Yoshimura and a greater commitment from the factory and you'd have the recipe for a contender in '10.
Loris can develop a bike, just ask Ducati. Stoner's run in '07 was basically on a bike that Loris developed. Just turned out that Casey could ride it faster. A team like Suzuki is very wise, IMHO, to keep Loris around. Spies has inherited a bike developed by Mladin and having the cagey old veteran around couldn't hurt. CV is a nice guy and all but a Spies/Capper lineup would be an improvement, no doubt. Add Yoshimura and a greater commitment from the factory and you'd have the recipe for a contender in '10.
Joined Apr 2008
7K Posts | 3K+
Out of Nowhere
It looked like the GP team stagnated post KRJR's championship in 2000, and certainly was blighted by a lack of development during '01. When the 4 strokes were ushered in they missed the starter gun, and have been non runners playing catch up ever since. The epitome for me was Hopper taking out KRJR, (or was it the other way round) when the experimental fly by wire throttle system failed to shut off and drove the bike into the corner again taking out the hapless teammate in the process. I'll be buggered if I can remember precisely where and when this was. Maybe it was Kenny and Sete - lets face it, it'd be the sort of thing that'd happen to Gibernau. Does anyone remember both Suzuki's taking each other out in a race? - I'm sure it was Hopper and Kenny - anyway I digress.
As most followers of BSB would doubtless testify, Denning ran a tight ship at Crescent - which was to list badly following his departure (and those of Reynolds and Kagayama). I thought his appointment following the retirement of Gary Taylor at the end of 04 looked to be a good thing and that things were on the up. In spite of this '05 was another dismal year and finally saw the exit of a disenchated and thoroughly disgruntled KRJR, and although Hopper kicked .... out of the thing at Qatar in early '06, by the end of the season and the demise of the 990's - following a concerted factory effort, it looked like a pretty sorted ride and with much of the 800 development done that year, things augered well for the following season. Even at the end of '07, I thought that Capi was inheriting a decent ride, and Vermeulen would regularly start pushing for podium places. Not to be. It's probably time for a sea change in personnel in that garage, which is bizarre because on paper and with old heads like Stewart Shenton and Tom O'Kane there's a wealth of experience but sadly a dearth of results. Maybe Denning should be made to walk the plank, but he still leaves a sinking ship behind him.
By not signing Spies, Suzuki have made a huge oversight, if that's the right term given their chronic tendency for myopia.
As most followers of BSB would doubtless testify, Denning ran a tight ship at Crescent - which was to list badly following his departure (and those of Reynolds and Kagayama). I thought his appointment following the retirement of Gary Taylor at the end of 04 looked to be a good thing and that things were on the up. In spite of this '05 was another dismal year and finally saw the exit of a disenchated and thoroughly disgruntled KRJR, and although Hopper kicked .... out of the thing at Qatar in early '06, by the end of the season and the demise of the 990's - following a concerted factory effort, it looked like a pretty sorted ride and with much of the 800 development done that year, things augered well for the following season. Even at the end of '07, I thought that Capi was inheriting a decent ride, and Vermeulen would regularly start pushing for podium places. Not to be. It's probably time for a sea change in personnel in that garage, which is bizarre because on paper and with old heads like Stewart Shenton and Tom O'Kane there's a wealth of experience but sadly a dearth of results. Maybe Denning should be made to walk the plank, but he still leaves a sinking ship behind him.
By not signing Spies, Suzuki have made a huge oversight, if that's the right term given their chronic tendency for myopia.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Oct 23 2008, 07:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>LINK
I wonder if anybody at team Suckzuki is asking themselves, 'yo, remind me, why didn't we sign Spies again?'
Dumb .....!
cos the greedy ....... wanted to much money. who does he think he is,, hopper ?
I wonder if anybody at team Suckzuki is asking themselves, 'yo, remind me, why didn't we sign Spies again?'
Dumb .....!
cos the greedy ....... wanted to much money. who does he think he is,, hopper ?
Joined Mar 2005
7K Posts | 20+
Woody Creek
It's been said and said. And oddly enough I agree with Migs (more or less, I think). Migs, tell me if you disagree with what I'm saying. Signing Spies would have been great for a few years down the line should they ever get the factory behind them and Denning to run the team properly and have the team do their jobs properly. But until that happens, Suzuki MotoGP will be a mess and they need all the stability they can get. Capirossi is a perfect fit for them until he decided to hang up his leathers and I think Vermeulen has shown his speed when the GSVR is running properly and maybe has another season in him to prove it.
Spies would have been great for Suzuki if they could pull their heads out. But until that happens, it's not likely Spies could have done much more than Cappers or Vermy.
Spies would have been great for Suzuki if they could pull their heads out. But until that happens, it's not likely Spies could have done much more than Cappers or Vermy.
Joined Jun 2008
2K Posts | 6+
America
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xx CURVE xx @ Oct 23 2008, 07:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'><span style="font-size:36pt;line-height:100%+1
yeahs sir
yeahs sir
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