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Stoner ..... asks for panic!!

[quote name='BarryMachine' date='18 November 2010 - 07:04 PM' timestamp='1290107066' post='260560']

I know what you mean, though I suspect not many would agree with you. I think the biggest problem for acceptance is that the showrooms don't have many 800cc sportbikes
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I do think that the 800's are in favour of a younger rider though.



[b]I'd love to see the top MGP class as an open class for anything over 750cc. Then over the next few years, the teams would then sort out which capacity is the fastest.
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And it would also evolve with development as well.



I aggree with ya here Bazza that would be somin, seeing how Casey goes on an 800 Honda, .... give him an RB26 with 2 wheels & a seat & he'll lap a track fast enough to slow earth's rotation!!



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BarryMachine said:
I know what you mean, though I suspect not many would agree with you. I think the biggest problem for acceptance is that the showrooms don't have many 800cc sportbikes
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I do think that the 800's are in favour of a younger rider though.



I'd love to see the top MGP class as an open class for anything over 750cc. Then over the next few years, the teams would then sort out which capacity is the fastest.
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And it would also evolve with development as well.
Click to expand...



actually i'd go even further than that!

i'm not a fan of the 800cc bikes ,let me make that clear.

but the main reason many people go on about the 1000s is that bikes below liter capacity aren't regarded as the top level. its stupid, its the same as when gsxr750 riders are being called douches for not daring to go 1000
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One other tidbit to consider regarding why larger-motored bikes are more physically demanding is their beefier internal drive components require greater steering effort, especially in transition. Consider the 848 vs 1198. The bikes basically weigh the same overall, but the 848 has significantly less reciprocating mass in the engine, which in turn make it less demanding physically than its big brother.
 
We all know midget Pedrosa would rather have a 'smoothe' power delivery on the machine rather then a 'raw' beast.... that's due to his riding style. He's not one who can manhandle a monster of a machine due to his physical stature maybe? He's a smoothe rider rather then a late braker point and shoot kind of style ala Casey Stoner. But if Honda's going to put all their eggs in a basket..... best bet is to put them in Stoner's.
 
SuperShinya56 said:
We all know midget Pedrosa would rather have a 'smoothe' power delivery on the machine rather then a 'raw' beast.... that's due to his riding style. He's not one who can manhandle a monster of a machine due to his physical stature maybe? He's a smoothe rider rather then a late braker point and shoot kind of style ala Casey Stoner. But if Honda's going to put all their eggs in a basket..... best bet is to put them in Stoner's.
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As long as putting all the eggs in the stoner basket doesn't result in a bike nobody else can ride, which may be dani's quite legitimate concern. Events will reveal whether this was the case with stoner at ducati as has been widely assumed; an alternative possibility is that with the 800 ducatis as they have been stoner's set-up and riding style were the only way to make one go fast.
 
michaelm said:
As long as putting all the eggs in the stoner basket doesn't result in a bike nobody else can ride, which may be dani's quite legitimate concern. Events will reveal whether this was the case with stoner at ducati as has been widely assumed; an alternative possibility is that with the 800 ducatis as they have been stoner's set-up and riding style were the only way to make one go fast.
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Though Marco's interview:

http://motomatters.com/news/2010/11/18/marco_melandri_i_had_the_same_problems_a.html

suggests it wasn't Stoner, but perhaps Ducati's "bigheadedness", I can also see why Pedro is worried a bit as he has already been complaining about Honda not providing what he wants, it must piss one off if along comes Stoner and gets just what he wants. And given that Honda must have pursued and signed Stoner some time ago, one would think they have a pretty deep interest in him.

But none of that really matters, Dani is "the perpetal bridesmaid", he would probablystill get second, its his lot in life
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Agile said:
One other tidbit to consider regarding why larger-motored bikes are more physically demanding is their beefier internal drive components require greater steering effort, especially in transition. Consider the 848 vs 1198. The bikes basically weigh the same overall, but the 848 has significantly less reciprocating mass in the engine, which in turn make it less demanding physically than its big brother.
Click to expand...



I know where you are coming from, but not sure those two specifically are a great example. Eg. you can torque around a bit at lower rev's with the 1198, hence the resultant rotational forces are not as nasty as first envisioned. Or if you want a bit f stability from sideways forces you can get it spinning a bit, I'd more see it as a broader range of "gyroscopic forces" ( I said that word!!!
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) being available wth the 1198.
 
Pigeon said:
Dani Pedrosa issues engine warning to Casey Stoner

By Matthew Birt -



MotoGP



17 November 2010 16:16



Dani Pedrosa warned Casey Stoner not to get too carried away after the Australian’s sensational factory Honda debut in Valencia earlier this month.



Stoner raved about the smooth engine performance of the RC212V machine after he finished a close second to Jorge Lorenzo in the first test ahead of the 2011 MotoGP world championship.



But Pedrosa had a cautious word for his new Repsol team-mate, the Spaniard still frustrated by Honda’s failure to make its V4 contender easier to manage.



Pedrosa, who finished fifth fastest in the Valencia test, said: “I don't know how the Ducati is, but compard to the Yamaha we are still too aggressive both on acceleration and deceleration.



"Our bike is moving a lot because of the engine and we still have to work on that. Casey’s experience with the Honda is very low. He hasn't it raced it yet so compared to the Ducati he felt the difference. I know how difficult it is to manage the power delivery for the whole race where he was only doing short runs. I tried a new engine in Valencia but it is still too aggressive in the way it delivers the power.”









let the .... flinging begin
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Maybe people at HRC is thinking,

-dang! we hired first a woss and then a woss,but now we finally have a decent cosmonaut to put on the rocket.Finally we can start making an engine with some umph,instead of baby-smooth.



As i understand the developement of Moto GP engines in both Honda and Ducati has been,first extract power,then make it more useable.And above all keep fuelconsuption down,as that seems to be the biggest problem rather than engine durabillity.

I'm guessing that when Ducati/Preziosi designed the first 800 engine they didn't make that engine for a particular rider,(and certainly not Stoner who wasn't hired yet)but rather the maximum (within reason of driveabillity)poweroutput.All because of that stupid 800 regulation.

Also,as i understand it,the top engineers at the factories has the same problems to solve.They probarbly just have to choose,rough and more powerful or smoother and less torque.Ducati has maybe been leaning more towards rough and more powerful compared to the others. At HRC they might not consider a new enginedesign ready to use,Pedrosa or not,if it isn't smooth.Or rather,alot smoother than someting Ducati would approve.Honda might be ahead of Yamaha and Ducati as they've made a screamer-like engine that is also smooth.

I'm more or less expecting scary topspeeds and acceleration from RepsolHonda at around midseason,and complaining from Pedrosa and Dovisioso.New topspeedrecord at Barcelona?
 
Anders GUZZI said:
Maybe people at HRC is thinking,

-dang! we hired first a woss and then a woss,but now we finally have a decent cosmonaut to put on the rocket.Finally we can start making an engine with some umph,instead of baby-smooth.



As i understand the developement of Moto GP engines in both Honda and Ducati has been,first extract power,then make it more useable.And above all keep fuelconsuption down,as that seems to be the biggest problem rather than engine durabillity.

I'm guessing that when Ducati/Preziosi designed the first 800 engine they didn't make that engine for a particular rider,(and certainly not Stoner who wasn't hired yet)but rather the maximum (within reason of driveabillity)poweroutput.All because of that stupid 800 regulation.

Also,as i understand it,the top engineers at the factories has the same problems to solve.They probarbly just have to choose,rough and more powerful or smoother and less torque.Ducati has maybe been leaning more towards rough and more powerful compared to the others. At HRC they might not consider a new enginedesign ready to use,Pedrosa or not,if it isn't smooth.Or rather,alot smoother than someting Ducati would approve.Honda might be ahead of Yamaha and Ducati as they've made a screamer-like engine that is also smooth.

I'm more or less expecting scary topspeeds and acceleration from RepsolHonda at around midseason,and complaining from Pedrosa and Dovisioso.New topspeedrecord at Barcelona?
Click to expand...

Fuel economy was still reputedly a problem for honda this year.
 
michaelm said:
Fuel economy was still reputedly a problem for honda this year.
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From what I've read It seems that's the biggest problem for all factories,I would guess.

I was just so surprised about the great "smoothness"when I read about Stoner's thoughts on the HRC engine.

I thought with that topspeed and acceleration-update it had at the end of the season,it would be more agressive.

So maybe there is room for a more agressive peaky engine if Stoner gets to decide direction.And if so,then it's back to 2007 all over again,Stoner and then the rest of the field.
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michaelm said:
As long as putting all the eggs in the stoner basket doesn't result in a bike nobody else can ride
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But they've already done that with other riders, most recently with Pedrosa's 2006 RC211V. What's to stop them trying again for Stoner? Of course the last time didn't work out so well for them, the eggs might wind up on their face instead of in the basket, but as it is their eggs aren't getting anywhere!
 
BarryMachine said:
D'oh! you weren't actually supposed to post here guys .......... the silence was supposed to show Rossiofsky what "no panic" looks like in reality
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Some nice points anyway though.
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Click to expand...



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exactly !!! This was meant to teach me something, why are you folks taking it serious?



Are you still mad at JB for his "dont panic titanic" thing? Well, anyway, that interview added another layer to your chorus.

I've had it up to here with all the biblobile you spew.
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Eric Schwartz - Keep your jesus off my .....





[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5YrB7TpT1Y[/media]
 

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