Interview with Martin Raines

chopperman · Nov 22, 2013

J4rn0

3694941385164148

Oh god, I forgot the conspiracies.

Anyway Pedro got his Bridgestones before 2008 end anyway, no? And all these great riders were on Bridgestones in 2009... Hmmm...

If you really believe Bridgestone changed construction to suit Rossi's preferences, then you'd have to explain why they stopped doing that later when he needed it most -- but I'm sure you'll find a convenient explanation for that as well. It's so wasy to write (or rewrite) history that way, isn't it.

He isn't "re-writing" history. He is trying to "improve" history haha

povol · Nov 22, 2013

chopperman

3694901385163422

What ?? Pedrosa went to bridgstones in 08. In fact Rossi's Michelin contract had expired which left him free to contract to another supplier, unlike pedrosa. Besides Michelin were in talks at the time about pulling out of racing, this in the wake of tyre chunking issues in motogp.

Yea, 3/4 of the way through the season. Yes, Rossi's contract was up, and Bridegestone told him no. That is when Dorna stepped in and forced the move. Thats not changing history, thats stating fact,

Talpa · Nov 22, 2013

I wonder if there is a better word than 'complete'

BarryMachine · Nov 22, 2013

Talpa

3695181385192670

I wonder if there is a better word than 'complete'

I guess that's really up to you.

I assume you are writing a love song? I mean its your song, your composing it.

If that's how Rossi makes you feel then use "complete".

chopperman · Nov 23, 2013

povol

3695151385180684

Yea, 3/4 of the way through the season. Yes, Rossi's contract was up, and Bridegestone told him no. That is when Dorna stepped in and forced the move. Thats not changing history, thats stating fact,

Yes it was an attempt to change history on your part. You originally stated only Rossi switched to stones in 2008. That was false. You stated pedrosa didn't switch to stones in 08. That was also false, You omitted facts like Rossi's contract with Mich had expired at that time. You also omitted the fact Perdrosa still had a current contract with mich at the time he switched. You are cherry picking facts to suit your argument. You are making a scandal where there isn't one then trying to throw fuel on it.

povol · Nov 23, 2013

chopperman

3695351385214026

Yes it was an attempt to change history on your part. You originally stated only Rossi switched to stones in 2008. That was false. You stated pedrosa didn't switch to stones in 08. That was also false, You omitted facts like Rossi's contract with Mich had expired at that time. You also omitted the fact Perdrosa still had a current contract with mich at the time he switched. You are cherry picking facts to suit your argument. You are making a scandal where there isn't one then trying to throw fuel on it.

You omitted that Bridgestone turned him down and Dorna forced Bridgestone to give Rossi someone elses years of hard work and research.Talk about twisting and cherry picking facts. Mich let Pedrosa out of his committment because it had already been decided that they were not coming back in 09 You forget that point, 08 might be the most tainted title of all. You and other Rossi fans are the ones trying to change historical fact. It happened, and will not be forgotten. Ask your boy Jumkie, he was quite vocal about it himself before you guys started your bromance

chopperman · Nov 23, 2013

povol

3695381385223114

You omitted that Bridgestone turned him down and Dorna forced Bridgestone to give Rossi someone elses years of hard work and research.Talk about twisting and cherry picking facts. Mich let Pedrosa out of his committment because it had already been decided that they were not coming back in 09 You forget that point, 08 might be the most tainted title of all. You and other Rossi fans are the ones trying to change historical fact. It happened, and will not be forgotten. Ask your boy Jumkie, he was quite vocal about it himself before you guys started your bromance

That's just spin. Rossi refused to re-sign with mich and was under no obligation to re-sign. in fact he said he would rather retire than enter into a NEW contract with them. As you rightly pointed out, it was established Mich were not continuing in 2009. So what would have been the point in re-signing at the end of 2008 ??? Mich had no commitment and their tyres were damn right dangerous, an issue they couldn't or wouldn't fix. They had a board room struggle with the shareholders an expressed a wish to exit racing. What moron would re-sign into that farce ?

povol · Nov 23, 2013

chopperman

3695391385227281

That's just spin. Rossi refused to re-sign with mich and was under no obligation to re-sign. in fact he said he would rather retire than enter into a NEW contract with them. As you rightly pointed out, it was established Mich were not continuing in 2009. So what would have been the point in re-signing at the end of 2008 ??? Mich had no commitment and their tyres were damn right dangerous, an issue they couldn't or wouldn't fix. They had a board room struggle with the shareholders an expressed a wish to exit racing. What moron would re-sign into that farce ?

That had not been determined at the start of 2008. Pederosa didnt get his release till 3/4s thew way through that season after it had been determined they were not coming. Again, more spin on your part. You still have not addressed the point where Dorna forced Bridgestone against their will to supply Rossi with technology that them and Ducati spent years developing. I guess your reluctance to address it means you have no defense for that little despicable act by Dorna to appease the golden goose.

chopperman · Nov 23, 2013

povol

3695441385232106

That had not been determined at the start of 2008. Pederosa didnt get his release till 3/4s thew way through that season after it had been determined they were not coming. Again, more spin on your part. You still have not addressed the point where Dorna forced Bridgestone against their will to supply Rossi with technology that them and Ducati spent years developing. I guess your reluctance to address it means you have no defense for that little despicable act by Dorna to appease the golden goose.

Actually michelin's trouble started in 2007 They struggled with the new 800cc formula and the higher corner speed. Mich has always built Track / bike specific tyres where as Stone's concentrated on a more general purpose tyre. The rules changed and that put mich on the back foot. also shares within the company changed hands resulting in a new leadership that were uninterested in the race market.

You keep banging on about ducati's hard work bla bla bla, did you forget all about poor little Kawasaki ?

I will however agree that dorna may have forced the switch to stones rather than let Rossi retire. But that's not Rossi's fault, he just refused to be forced to sign a contract that he didn't want and would put him in a disadvantage ones mich pulled out. Something that was on the cards as early as 2007.

I have no reason to spin anything, you on the other hand have the ulterior motive here. That's plain to see for anyone who reads your posts. You use the same attack methods with Rossi as you do with anything Obama hahaha. You're like a stuck record.

povol · Nov 23, 2013

chopperman

3695461385233958

Actually michelin's trouble started in 2007 They struggled with the new 800cc formula and the higher corner speed. Mich has always built Track / bike specific tyres where as Stone's concentrated on a more general purpose tyre. The rules changed and that put mich on the back foot. also shares within the company changed hands resulting in a new leadership that were uninterested in the race market.

You keep banging on about ducati's hard work bla bla bla, did you forget all about poor little Kawasaki ?

I will however agree that dorna may have forced the switch to stones rather than let Rossi retire. But that's not Rossi's fault, he just refused to be forced to sign a contract that he didn't want and would put him in a disadvantage ones mich pulled out. Something that was on the cards as early as 2007.

I have no reason to spin anything, you on the other hand have the ulterior motive here. That's plain to see for anyone who reads your posts. You use the same attack methods with Rossi as you do with anything Obama hahaha. You're like a stuck record.

. Rossi fans and Obama supporters fear the same thing, facts can be a ..... huh.I like how you kinda sorta admitted that maybe Dorna forced Bridgestone to give Rossi the technology that another team developed. Maybe Dorna can force Marquez to give Rossi his balls next.

chopperman · Nov 23, 2013

povol

3695681385255734

. Rossi fans and Obama supporters fear the same thing, facts can be a ..... huh.I like how you kinda sorta admitted that maybe Dorna forced Bridgestone to give Rossi the technology that another team developed. Maybe Dorna can force Marquez to give Rossi his balls next.

I have never denied the fact dorna manipulate the series for their own gain. Maybe dorna didn't want Rossi to retire for their own reasons. Doesn't change the fact Rossi's Michelin contract had expired and he stated he would rather retire than re-sign. Why should anyone be forced to sign an unwanted contract ? Your hatred fuelled argument seems to have fallen flat on its arse AGAIN. hahaha .

povol · Nov 23, 2013

chopperman

3695711385256846

I have never denied the fact dorna manipulate the series for their own gain. Maybe dorna didn't want Rossi to retire for their own reasons. Doesn't change the fact Rossi's Michelin contract had expired and he stated he would rather retire than re-sign. Why should anyone be forced to sign an unwanted contract ? Your hatred fuelled argument seems to have fallen flat on its arse AGAIN. hahaha .

I dont give a .... if his contract had expired. Bridgestone stated they didnt want to supply Rossi with tires, and Dorna forced them to. Just because Rossi was out of contract with Michelin didnt obligate Bridgestone to pick him up. What is so hard to understand about that. I know you think that .......... is god, but no one was obligated to to do a damn thing for him. Dorna chose to .... Ducati and Stoner to appease the golden child, end of. Dorna should have stayed out of it and let him do what he thought he had to do

chopperman · Nov 23, 2013

povol

3695721385257624

I dont give a .... if his contract had expired. Bridgestone stated they didnt want to supply Rossi with tires, and Dorna forced them to. Just because Rossi was out of contract with Michelin didnt obligate Bridgestone to pick him up. What is so hard to understand about that. I know you think that .......... is god, but no one was obligated to to do a damn thing for him. Dorna chose to .... Ducati and Stoner to appease the golden child, end of. Dorna should have stayed out of it and let him do what he thought he had to do

I dont think he is god. But i also don't try and apportion blame to someone just because i hate them. Bridgstone say they can't accommodate Rossi yet not only do that but Pedrosa too. Then not long after the whole series haha Get real.

So Pov, why all the blame on Rossi yet non at Pedrosa ? You even stated Pedrosa didn't get stones in 08 which was bollocks. You're just on a crusade armed with nothing but dog .....

povol · Nov 23, 2013

chopperman

3695751385258256

I dont think he is god. But i also don't try and apportion blame to someone just because i hate them. Bridgstone say they can't accommodate Rossi yet not only do that but Pedrosa too. Then not long after the whole series haha Get real.

So Pov, why all the blame on Rossi yet non at Pedrosa ? You even stated Pedrosa didn't get stones in 08 which was bollocks. You're just on a crusade armed with nothing but dog .....

Didnt have anything to do with if they could or couldnt. They simply didnt want to, but were foced into it.. Hows that for real.

Is that what you are hanging your hat on, that Perdosa got the Bridgestones with 4 races to go in the season. Technically, they could have given him the stones at the end of season Valencia test and that would have been 2008

Mick D · Nov 23, 2013

Just as they were forced into supplying the whole grid… The bottom line is by that point none of the front runners wanted to be on Michelins.

michaelm · Nov 24, 2013

Mick D

3695811385271794

Just as they were forced into supplying the whole grid… The bottom line is by that point none of the front runners wanted to be on Michelins.

Except, perhaps oddly, Ducati who wished to start again from scratch with Michelin rather than acquiesce to a control tyre; as it eventuated they were entirely correct in their view, since they have subsequently been totally screwed by the control Bridgestone.

chopperman · Nov 24, 2013

michaelm

3695891385293934

Except, perhaps oddly, Ducati who wished to start again from scratch with Michelin rather than acquiesce to a control tyre; as it eventuated they were entirely correct in their view, since they have subsequently been totally screwed by the control Bridgestone.

I was also odd that Ducati said about a switch to Michelin when they would have been fully aware they were pulling out of racing. At the time i view this as a bit of an empty threat to gain media coverage of their disapproval in the series going control tyre. Something i also agreed with. Why Michelin ? they could have gone to Dunlop at that time.

michaelm · Nov 24, 2013

chopperman

3695911385304308

I was also odd that Ducati said about a switch to Michelin when they would have been fully aware they were pulling out of racing. At the time i view this as a bit of an empty threat to gain media coverage of their disapproval in the series going control tyre. Something i also agreed with. Why Michelin ? they could have gone to Dunlop at that time.

Yes, we both disagreed with the control tyre when many thought it would be a good thing and we were both right Roger, and pretty much for the reasons we advanced at the time.

As I recall both Michelin and Bridgestone said they didn't want a control tyre, Michelin's position became untenable after Dani switched to Bridgestones mid-season leaving Michelin supplying only Jorge, and Michelin didn't bid to be the control tyre supplier saying they only wanted to be involved if there was tyre competition. My recollection is that Ducati offered to go with Michelin before the decision to go to a control tyre became final, perhaps rhetorically as you say. I think we both know why they wouldn't have wanted to go with Dunlop, who had not been competitive for years, whilst Michelin had been the long time premier tyre supplier.

To go over very old ground, I never had a problem with Rossi getting Bridgestones as you know, just with the control tyre in general, and more particularly with the tyre developed to suit the Ducati, and even more particularly as a fanboy the tyre which suited Stoner, being taken away.

chopperman · Nov 24, 2013

michaelm

3695921385306300

Yes, we both disagreed with the control tyre when many thought it would be a good thing and we were both right Roger, and pretty much for the reasons we advanced at the time.

As I recall both Michelin and Bridgestone said they didn't want a control tyre, Michelin's position became untenable after Dani switched to Bridgestones mid-season leaving Michelin supplying only Jorge, and Michelin didn't bid to be the control tyre supplier saying they only wanted to be involved if there was tyre competition. My recollection is that Ducati offered to go with Michelin before the decision to go to a control tyre became final, perhaps rhetorically as you say. I think we both know why they wouldn't have wanted to go with Dunlop, who had not been competitive for years, whilst Michelin had been the long time premier tyre supplier.

To go over very old ground, I never had a problem with Rossi getting Bridgestones as you know, just with the control tyre in general, and more particularly with the tyre developed to suit the Ducati, and even more particularly as a fanboy the tyre which suited Stoner, being taken away.

I agree with your post but the only reason Dunlop were not competitive was due to the fact only "minor" teams were using them. Plus because a dunlop shod bike had not won a race Ducati would have been exempt the new rule limiting tyres. Personally i think the control tyre should have gone to Dunlop or a new supplier. That way no team would of had an advantage from previous Bridgstone data, but thats another subject.

Search

Search

Interview with Martin Raines

chopperman

povol

Talpa

BarryMachine

chopperman

povol

chopperman

povol

chopperman

povol

chopperman

povol

chopperman

povol

Mick D

michaelm

chopperman

michaelm

chopperman

Similar threads

Recent Discussions