Insiders blame Hayden

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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Keshav @ Nov 13 2008, 03:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So now he's a ...... with a link.

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Hayden rolled out of the pits in testing and thought he was being punked. How stupid does Honda have to be to get the ergos of a guy that had been riding for them for years all wrong? They made the bike for Pedrosa and that is it.
 
not riding the first incarnation of the rc212v as opposed to winning the 2006 championship....

seems a fair trade off to me.

and as an afterthought, the rc212 was built to a design philosophy of "mass centralisation". no amount of testing by hayden would have gotten honda engineering to change that...
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Nov 13 2008, 03:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Hayden rolled out of the pits in testing and thought he was being punked. How stupid does Honda have to be to get the ergos of a guy that had been riding for them for years? They made the bike for Pedrosa and that is it.

HAHA i member him saying that to!
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tamada6 @ Nov 13 2008, 09:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>http://www.autosport.com/journal/article.php/id/1786
that link says
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>By Toby Moody

The mounting pressure on the diminutive shoulders of Dani Pedrosa. Valentino Rossi, the best ever? And the dreaded single tyre move. Toby Moody muses over them all after an eventful Japanese Grand Prix weekend

wtf
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BigAl @ Nov 13 2008, 09:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>the rc212 was built to a design philosophy of "mass centralisation". no amount of testing by hayden would have gotten honda engineering to change that...

As i have said before, the 211 was built with the same philosophy and Rossi went through the same issue. It seems his speed, leadership and backing within the team put him in a position to demand a solution he was happy with. Unfortunately the same cannot be said of Nicky
 
Everybody can copy-paste a snippit and create a fuss (Crash.net, that would be you)

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE ("Toby Moody's review of Motegi '08 in Autosport's Online Journal- unlike some other people here I properly name my links
<
")<div class='quotemain'>Time to deliver

Valentino Rossi won again at the weekend, victory number 96 in grand prix racing, title number six in MotoGP and eight overall. He is just incredible, as once more he leaves us all aghast as to his abilities, some 11 years after winning his first title at Brno in August 1997.

This weekend at Phillip Island in Australia, Rossi should be well and truly unleashed as he's got nothing to lose. Hell, if we were in the old days he wouldn't turn up to these remaining races if he wasn't paid enough start money!

Bizarrely, the atmosphere was a bit flat once Valentino crossed the line to take the title at Motegi on Sunday. Others in the paddock agreed with me that it was a bit of a flat race once Rossi had got ahead of Stoner. Maybe the autumn of the season and many hours on planes were taking their toll, but one person who was happy was Dani Pedrosa. Or was he?
Dani Pedrosa at speed in Motegi © DPPI

Pedrosa's podium at Motegi was amazingly, his first since a second at Assen in late June, and of course his first podium on Bridgestones since the controversial switch. The question is, has he vindicated his decision to go Bridgestone after giving Michelin the flick?

There was outrage in the paddock at Misano when the announcement was made by Honda and Repsol that their golden boy was going to ditch Michelin with five races to go, and take up the Bridgestones that everyone wanted to be on. The irony is that, just like trendy nightclubs, once you've tagged onto a good idea, by the time you've got it up and running, it might just be on the cusp of being out of date.

Rossi made sure that his switch to Bridgestones over the winter was a measured and solid decision that he totally vindicated with eight victories from 15 races and a world title.

So where does this leave Pedrosa going into the all important 2009 season? Why is it important? That's a very simple answer. It's his fourth season with HRC in MotoGP and he has to win the title for them.

Has to.

Nicky Hayden won the title for Honda in his fourth season at HRC and Hayden had to learn all the tracks and the whole 'European thing' in the process. Pedrosa knows the tracks and has home only a couple of hours flight away from the majority of circuits that make up the calendar. Hayden certainly didn't have that luxury living on the other side of the planet.

The main point is what HRC expect from their riders. Alex Criville joined Repsol Honda before Repsol had such power to tell HRC what tyres they want their rider to ride.

"The first year they said to me that I had to enjoy, work hard, watch, and learn. The second year was a bit different in that I was told to fight for podiums, but in my third year I had to go and fight for the championship."

Criville had an ultra-hard teammate in Mick Doohan, winner of 54 grands prix and a five-time world champion, from the very season he joined the team. Hardly an easy prospect having just got a works contract in your pocket, but Criville dug in and fought Doohan to win once in 1995 and twice in 1996. That may not sound a lot, but to battle against Doohan in the same team was a hell of a feat.

"There is pressure put on your shoulders to win there."

Criville went on to win the world title in 1999.

Engineers are not emotional souls, instead preferring 0.01 seconds here and a gram less somewhere else, but when I mentioned to Pete Benson, the crew chief to Nicky Hayden, that they won the title in their fourth year, he hadn't realised they had and that Pedrosa's fourth year was 2009.

Made him grin a little, that nugget, as there is zero friendship from one side of the Repsol Honda garage to the other. Zero.
The pit garage barrier that appeared at the Indianapolis Grand Prix © LAT

"The wall down the centre of the garage has been there for a while, it's just only gone up in the last couple of races." Is a regular line coming from many on the Hayden side of the pit box...

Pedrosa is not forthcoming with his data to other Honda riders but it has become apparent that some set-up data has come from other bikes into his garage, rather than the other way around.

One very experienced source at Honda said quite logically that: "The only way for (Andrea) Dovizioso and Pedrosa to beat Valentino Rossi next year is to work together." That somehow might not be the case if Pedrosa doesn't help out and nurture the speed and lap times with Dovi.

"I prefer a good relationship, but if he doesn't want it, it doesn't matter." said Dovizioso pointedly during his confirmation of being a works Repsol Honda rider on Friday in Japan.

Ominous words that got the press corps rubbing their hands together for next year.

And as Rossi has proved this season, if you are on the same tyre he is, you're going to struggle to beat his sheer riding skill. In 2006 he had too many problems with his Yamaha, something they admitted to after the race on Sunday, and last year the Ducati on Bridgestones was far too strong for the Italian.

So, the task ahead for Pedrosa. He's started his battle to turn the bike into a Bridgestone bike two months ahead of the first day of 2009, which is on Monday October 27th - the day after the Valencia GP. But Honda have heeded Pedrosa's every want and need in recent years by focusing attention on him, capitulating to get Bridgestone tyres and kicking out Michelin, and even making Nicky Hayden develop the new 800cc bike during the last year of 990cc, forcing the American to dig ultra deep and win the title through anger at being used as a drone.

The 800cc bike was obviously built for Pedrosa, but insiders say Hayden didn't ride the new 800cc bike on the Monday after the Japanese GP of 2006 when it came out for the first time, the American instead preferring to concentrate on his championship push. They say it was a major day in the development of the bike, but Hayden chose not to ride it, resulting in the tiny little 800cc RC212V that now exists.

Hard words and a difficult decision for Hayden to make at the time, but he would rightly say it was a good one in that he won the title and a place in the history books.

It is now time for all the stern, frowning, dour faces from the No.2 Repsol Honda side of the garage to have the final laugh in the paddock, win next year's title, and get their own place in the history books.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Nov 13 2008, 03:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>What i am trying to say is that at Motegi HRC rolled out a bike they (as usual) believed was excellent. One of their riders said he'd rather not ride it (understandable), while the other rode it quickly and said positive things. The result of this would be that when Hayden came to ride the bike they were more commited (relative to the previous test) to the current development direction. I'm not suggesting that simply riding that day would have changed HRC's direction, or that it would have necessarily been pivotal to the eventual outcome of the winter. However i do believe that it would have had some kind of impact, espeically if Nicky had voiced concerns regarding the bike earlier (or even taken a "leadership" role and demand changes rather than suggest them), instead of doubting his riding.
I get what you're saying. But my opinion is that had Hayden said he didn't like the 212 the response from HRC would have been something like "tough ....." Although, at the time I believe HRC were still trying to get him to sign an extension so perhaps it would have been a rash of excuses followed by "tough ...." after NH signed.

And thanks for posting the entire article Sally.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Nov 13 2008, 10:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I get what you're saying. But my opinion is that had Hayden said he didn't like the 212 the response from HRC would have been something like "tough ....." Although, at the time I believe HRC were still trying to get him to sign an extension so perhaps it would have been a rash of excuses followed by "tough ...." after NH signed.

Quite possible. It could have in fact just been the same saga we have seen starting a few weeks earlier. I think that it was a combination of events and factors that led to the siutation we witnessed rather than a single concious decision to work against Nicky regardless of his actions.
 

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