Insiders blame Hayden

By Toby Moody

The 800cc bike was obviously built for Pedrosa, but insiders say Hayden didn't ride the new 800cc bike on the Monday after the Japanese GP of 2006 when it came out for the first time, the American instead preferring to concentrate on his championship push. They say it was a major day in the development of the bike, but Hayden chose not to ride it, resulting in the tiny little 800cc RC212V that now exists.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tamada6 @ Nov 13 2008, 02:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>By Toby Moody

The 800cc bike was obviously built for Pedrosa, but insiders say Hayden didn't ride the new 800cc bike on the Monday after the Japanese GP of 2006 when it came out for the first time, the American instead preferring to concentrate on his championship push. They say it was a major day in the development of the bike, but Hayden chose not to ride it, resulting in the tiny little 800cc RC212V that now exists.


you're a ....... ...... dude

'builted'?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xx CURVE xx @ Nov 13 2008, 09:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>you're a ....... ...... dude

after this discovery, think that hayden is much closer to ...... level than me.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (phleg @ Nov 13 2008, 02:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>'builted'?

Oh yeah thanks for reminding me phleg...

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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xx CURVE xx @ Nov 13 2008, 08:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Oh yeah thanks for reminding me phleg...

5455:English_..._Speak_I.jpg]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (phleg @ Nov 13 2008, 02:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>'builted'?

Oh yeah thanks for reminding me phleg...

5455:English_..._Speak_I.jpg]





<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tamada6 @ Nov 13 2008, 02:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>after this discovery, think that hayden is much closer to ...... level than me.

Yup..that confirms it...you're full blown ......

so myth created by hayden's fanatics is destroyed. nicky moaner can't blame anybody than himself because his 800cc career sucks so far (and will suck in future i'm sure) .

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tamada6 @ Nov 13 2008, 02:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>so myth created by hayden's fanatics is destroyed. nicky moaner can't blame anybody than himself because his 800cc career sucks so far (and will suck in future i'm sure) .

as long as he doesn't suck as much as YOU we'll be fine

That's pretty good. Because Hayden didn't test the already developed RC212V in Motegi in the middle of his championship he now has a bike that doesn't suit him. Because everyone knows had Hayden just thrown a leg over it then and said 'Hey guys, wait a minute. This doesn't feel quite right to me' HRC would have scurried back to the factory and come up with something more suited to Hayden's needs.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Nov 13 2008, 02:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>That's pretty good. Because Hayden didn't test the already developed RC212V in Motegi in the middle of his championship he now has a bike that doesn't suit him. Because everyone knows had Hayden just thrown a leg over it then and said 'Hey guys, wait a minute. This doesn't feel quite right to me' HRC would have scurried back to the factory and come up with something more suited to Hayden's needs.

yes Austin...Tamada6 is ..........i agree

The evolution machine he won the championship "was" the platform for the new 800 and he rode it all year. The new Honda 800 was so bad no previous years single test could have helped. Are you also going to argue that Capirossi's failure to ride the first prototype Ducati 800 (same year) resulted in Ducati's ...... bike?...oh wait it is almost perfect. ........

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Nov 13 2008, 08:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>That's pretty good. Because Hayden didn't test the already developed RC212V in Motegi in the middle of his championship he now has a bike that doesn't suit him. Because everyone knows had Hayden just thrown a leg over it then and said 'Hey guys, wait a minute. This doesn't feel quite right to me' HRC would have scurried back to the factory and come up with something more suited to Hayden's needs.

Although i wouldn't subscribe to the idea that not testing that day single handedly caused the situation Nicky found himself in, i believe it could well be a contributing factor. On testing the 211 for the first time Rossi told HRC the bike was too small and demanded it was made bigger. For Nicky to turn down the test, and for Dani to ok it and be pretty quick would have given the engineers a direction they were happy with. Obviously the circumtances being as they were Nickies decision is understandable, but HRC couldn't realistically hold off development commitment until he said otherwise. It would be foolish to expect Honda to u-turn against what appeared positive for the sake of a rider who openly struggled to adapt to the reduced power riding style, at the expense of his thriving team mate.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tamada6 @ Nov 13 2008, 08:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>By Toby Moody

The 800cc bike was obviously built for Pedrosa, but insiders say Hayden didn't ride the new 800cc bike on the Monday after the Japanese GP of 2006 when it came out for the first time, the American instead preferring to concentrate on his championship push. They say it was a major day in the development of the bike, but Hayden chose not to ride it, resulting in the tiny little 800cc RC212V that now exists.
so honda couldn't get rider measurement's from his 990
no link either i notice

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Nov 13 2008, 09:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>That's pretty good. Because Hayden didn't test the already developed RC212V in Motegi in the middle of his championship he now has a bike that doesn't suit him. Because everyone knows had Hayden just thrown a leg over it then and said 'Hey guys, wait a minute. This doesn't feel quite right to me' HRC would have scurried back to the factory and come up with something more suited to Hayden's needs.

poor excuses. if hayden don't care about new machine development why would honda obeyed his appeals afterr that? critical phase of development was gone... hayden missed that phase by his own choice.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tamada6 @ Nov 13 2008, 01:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>By Toby Moody

The 800cc bike was obviously built for Pedrosa, but insiders say Hayden didn't ride the new 800cc bike on the Monday after the Japanese GP of 2006 when it came out for the first time, the American instead preferring to concentrate on his championship push. They say it was a major day in the development of the bike, but Hayden chose not to ride it, resulting in the tiny little 800cc RC212V that now exists.


That's all well and good except Pedrosa hated it too.

I don't think anyone could have stopped Honda from building a two wheeled joke.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Nov 13 2008, 02:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Although i wouldn't subscribe to the idea that not testing that day single handedly caused the situation Nicky found himself in, i believe it could well be a contributing factor. On testing the 211 for the first time Rossi told HRC the bike was too small and demanded it was made bigger. For Nicky to turn down the test, and for Dani to ok it and be pretty quick would have given the engineers a direction they were happy with. Obviously the circumtances being as they were Nickies decision is understandable, but HRC couldn't realistically hold off development commitment until he said otherwise. It would be foolish to expect Honda to u-turn against what appeared positive for the sake of a rider who openly struggled to adapt to the reduced power riding style, at the expense of his thriving team mate.
Perhaps I'm misunderstanding, but if it would be foolish for HRC to make a 180 in development based on Pedrosa's early test success wouldn't it be equally foolish for them to make the same change if Hayden voiced his concerns at that point? That's not worded very well. If HRC saw potential in the 212 and Pedrosa from early testing wouldn't they be just as unlikely to make changes to suit Hayden in Motegi as they were when Hayden made his debut on the 212 just a few months later?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Nov 13 2008, 10:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>no link either i notice

http://www.autosport.com/journal/article.php/id/1786

So now he's a ...... with a link.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Nov 13 2008, 09:03 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Perhaps I'm misunderstanding, but if it would be foolish for HRC to make a 180 in development based on Pedrosa's early test success wouldn't it be equally foolish for them to make the same change if Hayden voiced his concerns at that point? That's not worded very well. If HRC saw potential in the 212 and Pedrosa from early testing wouldn't they be just as unlikely to make changes to suit Hayden in Motegi as they were when Hayden made his debut on the 212 just a few months later?

What i am trying to say is that at Motegi HRC rolled out a bike they (as usual) believed was excellent. One of their riders said he'd rather not ride it (understandable), while the other rode it quickly and said positive things. The result of this would be that when Hayden came to ride the bike they were more commited (relative to the previous test) to the current development direction. I'm not suggesting that simply riding that day would have changed HRC's direction, or that it would have necessarily been pivotal to the eventual outcome of the winter. However i do believe that it would have had some kind of impact, espeically if Nicky had voiced concerns regarding the bike earlier (or even taken a "leadership" role and demand changes rather than suggest them), instead of doubting his riding.