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Conspiracy GP

Joined Mar 2007
8K Posts | 2K+
Texas
Okay, I figured it out.

Bridgestone built some ridiculously expensive tires for the new 800cc class referred to by the press as the 2007's. Bridgestone thought it would be sweet revenge to go out and quadruple their budget building special tires at a time when the manufacturers were calling for reduced tire costs. They thought it would be good payback for all the years Michelin used to run overnight specials. The actual tire costs to the teams for the 2007 spec Bridgestones was minimal, but the tires were extremely expensive to make, and Bridgestone were willing to operate at a huge loss (like they used to) to capture their first title. The development of the 2007's was a joint project with Ducati, Ducati knew how much money was being spent. Perhaps Bridgestone even violated a few testing restrictions
<
Nobody has ever done that before.
<


At the end of the season, Ezy threatened to throw Bstone out when they refused to supply the grid. Rather than risk expulsion Bridgestone came clean and told Ezy they had wildly overspent and couldn't afford to supply the grid. Ducati has no leverage because they have seen as collaborators and have been held accountable for indirectly violating the manufacturers agreement.


Ezy realized he couldn't move everyone to Michelin b/c it compromised the competitive integrity of the sport. He realized he couldn't allow Bridgestone/Ducati to win in perpetuity b/c they had violated the spirit of the covenant regulations. Michelin threatened to surrender if they didn't receive subsidies from the governing body to catch up. Ezy handed them a big fat subsidy and the Tech 3 team to develop. Colin was demoted to test tires. Coincidentally, Lorenzo landed right where Rossi didn't want him--on the factory squad. Rossi had no say b/c he was begging Ezy for B-stone rubber. That's how Lorenzo ended up riding next to Rossi.

At Qatar everyone lined up on their equipment of choice. Stoner had the 2007 spec tires. Pedrosa still had his special line of Michelins. Rossi was on the 2008s, he has never had access to the 2007s. Stoner obliterated the field and Ezy quickly realized no one had made significant improvements to challenge the Bridgestone/Ducati tandem. Citing reckless indiscretion and exercising his unlimited power to make the sport look better for marketing, Ezy banned Stoner from the 2007 tires. Other teams have been allowed to run them until Bridgestone can successfully transition them to new spec.

Calling Rossi's tires the 2008 spec is actually a misnomer. The 2008s are not a new technology they are the evolution of Bridgestone's old 990 technology. They are more or less Bridgestone's take on a Michelin tire, as you may remember, in 2006 Bridgestone ran quite well in Europe. The 2008's are the 800cc-developed descendant of the 2006 tire. Rossi was so convinced they would work like his old 990 tires, he ran an antiquated 990 setup for the first race at Qatar. Soft front, hard rear. It didn't go the way he wanted. The Yamaha melted his B-stones like they were Michelins too.
<
It was Michelin's fault he didn't win in 2006, right?

Anyway, Ezy put Michelin on the government juice so he could control them. He actually required Michelin to make mass recommendations to protect Bridgestone while they transitioned teams to different technology. At the early rounds of the season Eurosport reported DORNA had hoards of officials monitoring corner entry g's. The suspected it was for safety monitoring. It was actually to help Michelin find the tires most like the 2008 Bridgestones. When convenient, Ezy let Michelin give preferred tires to preferred riders at their home markets. Pedrosa got a hard rear at Jerez (no one else did). At Catalunya he was also off the pace in the late sessions and yet he ran away with the race. I suspect he received similar treatment for that round as well.

During the beginning of the season when Bridgestone was being forced to further develop their old 990 technology it was every man for himself. The reason Yamaha and Ducati showed up ill prepared to run the 2008 technology is because Bridgestone was banned from developing tires during the off season. As soon as the season began, Rossi/Burgess spearheaded for team Yamaha b/c they were the only ones who could, Sete Gibernau returned to spearhead development for Ducati. You may remember Gibby once rode a Ducati on 990 spec Bridgestones in 2006. He was never meant to race in the premier class again, he was at Mugello to test tires. When they saw he was barely off of Stoner's times with development rubber, he quickly became a logical replacement for Marco Melandri.

In typical fashion, Rossi/Burgess did a better development job than Stoner/Ducati, but after bringing Gibby on board, Stoner soon acquired the rubber to fight back. The real travesty is that during this transition period Ducati were flailing wildly to make progress and Stoner fell off of the championship pace while other teams rode around on his tires (as confirmed by Hopkins in a recent interview). Since Catlunya when a good 2008 Ducati Bridgestone was delivered to Stoner for the first time, the racing between Rossi and Stoner has more or less been fair. However, you may recall that Stoner was already 41 points behind at that point.

There is no conspiracy causing Stoner to crash in the last couple of rounds. I think the 2007 Bridgestones worked so ridiculously well at Brno and Misano that Stoner has simply had a bit of trouble adapting to his good-but-not-quite-equal 2008 spec tire.

Tertiary to the drama, I believe the Melandri rumors. I think Melandri was given the 2007 spec tire at China because his results were so bad, Ezy decided to throw Ducati a bone. Melandri rode quite well at China. I do believe that Ducati sent Melandri to Japan to see if they could make way for Gibby. Kawasaki have never run anything but the 2007 spec tires, I think Melandri found a home on that bike in Japan and really put in some really hot laps. Ducati got scared and kept him so as not to look like an unrideable bike while trying to get Hayden signed. I really wonder if Melandri is going to have access to the 2007s for the 2009 season. If he doesn't, it could be ugly.

Anywho, I have no idea what this means for a control tire next year. It does seem that Ezy may keep chucking money at Michelin and requiring them to run more satellite equipment in return. Bridgestone are still the brand to beat, but now that they have been forced to regress slightly, they are within reach of Michelin.

Hmmmmmm.........i thought it was in the bag, but Ezy may not be willing to gamble on a revolutionary change when Rossi has won another title; thus quelling the fan upheaval.

All quiet on the Western Front I suppose. No need to start another war with a control tire?

It will be interesting to see what happens.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Sep 18 2008, 04:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Okay, I figured it out.

Bridgestone built some ridiculously expensive tires for the new 800cc class referred to by the press as the 2007's. Bridgestone thought it would be sweet revenge to go out and quadruple their budget building special tires at a time when the manufacturers were calling for reduced tire costs. They thought it would be good payback for all the years Michelin used to run overnight specials. The actual tire costs to the teams for the 2007 spec Bridgestones was minimal, but the tires were extremely expensive to make, and Bridgestone were willing to operate at a huge loss (like they used to) to capture their first title. The development of the 2007's was a joint project with Ducati, Ducati knew how much money was being spent. Perhaps Bridgestone even violated a few testing restrictions
<
Nobody has ever done that before.
<


At the end of the season, Ezy threatened to throw Bstone out when they refused to supply the grid. Rather than risk expulsion Bridgestone came clean and told Ezy they had wildly overspent and couldn't afford to supply the grid. Ducati has no leverage because they have seen as collaborators and have been held accountable for indirectly violating the manufacturers agreement.


Ezy realized he couldn't move everyone to Michelin b/c it compromised the competitive integrity of the sport. He realized he couldn't allow Bridgestone/Ducati to win in perpetuity b/c they had violated the spirit of the covenant regulations. Michelin threatened to surrender if they didn't receive subsidies from the governing body to catch up. Ezy handed them a big fat subsidy and the Tech 3 team to develop. Colin was demoted to test tires. Coincidentally, Lorenzo landed right where Rossi didn't want him--on the factory squad. Rossi had no say b/c he was begging Ezy for B-stone rubber. That's how Lorenzo ended up riding next to Rossi.

At Qatar everyone lined up on their equipment of choice. Stoner had the 2007 spec tires. Pedrosa still had his special line of Michelins. Rossi was on the 2008s, he has never had access to the 2007s. Stoner obliterated the field and Ezy quickly realized no one had made significant improvements to challenge the Bridgestone/Ducati tandem. Citing reckless indiscretion and exercising his unlimited power to make the sport look better for marketing, Ezy banned Stoner from the 2007 tires. Other teams have been allowed to run them until Bridgestone can successfully transition them to new spec.

Calling Rossi's tires the 2008 spec is actually a misnomer. The 2008s are not a new technology they are the evolution of Bridgestone's old 990 technology. They are more or less Bridgestone's take on a Michelin tire, as you may remember, in 2006 Bridgestone ran quite well in Europe. The 2008's are the 800cc-developed descendant of the 2006 tire. Rossi was so convinced they would work like his old 990 tires, he ran an antiquated 990 setup for the first race at Qatar. Soft front, hard rear. It didn't go the way he wanted. The Yamaha melted his B-stones like they were Michelins too.
<
It was Michelin's fault he didn't win in 2006, right?

Anyway, Ezy put Michelin on the government juice so he could control them. He actually required Michelin to make mass recommendations to protect Bridgestone while they transitioned teams to different technology. At the early rounds of the season Eurosport reported DORNA had hoards of officials monitoring corner entry g's. The suspected it was for safety monitoring. It was actually to help Michelin find the tires most like the 2008 Bridgestones. When convenient, Ezy let Michelin give preferred tires to preferred riders at their home markets. Pedrosa got a hard rear at Jerez (no one else did). At Catalunya he was also off the pace in every session and yet he ran away with the race. I suspect he received similar treatment for that round as well.

During the beginning of the season when Bridgestone was being forced to further develop their old 990 technology it was every man for himself. Rossi/Burgess spearheaded for team Yamaha b/c they were the only ones who could. Sete Gibernau returned to spearhead development for Ducati. You may remember Gibby once rode a Ducati on 990 spec Bridgestones in 2006. He was never meant to race in the premier class again, he was at Mugello to test tires. When they saw he was barely off of Stoner's times with development rubber, he quickly became a logical replacement for Marco Melandri.

In typical fashion, Rossi/Burgess did a better development job than Stoner/Ducati, but after bringing Gibby on board, Stoner soon acquired the rubber to fight back. The real travesty is that during this transition period Ducati were flailing wildly to make progress and Stoner fell off of the championship pace while other teams rode around on his tires (as confirmed by Hopkins in a recent interview). Since Catlunya when a good 2008 Ducati Bridgestone was delivered to Stoner for the first time, the racing between Rossi and Stoner has more or less been fair. However, you may recall that Stoner was already 41 points behind at that point.

There is no conspiracy causing Stoner to crash in the last couple of rounds. I think the 2007 Bridgestones worked so ridiculously well at Brno and Misano that Stoner has simply had a bit of trouble adapting to his good-but-not-quite-equal 2008 spec tire.

Tertiary to the drama, I believe the Melandri rumors. I think Melandri was given the 2007 spec tire at China because his results were so bad, Ezy decided to throw Ducati a bone. Melandri rode quite well at China. I do believe that Ducati sent Melandri to Japan to see if they could make way for Gibby. Kawasaki have never run anything but the 2007 spec tires, I think Melandri found a home on that bike in Japan and really put in some really hot laps. Ducati got scared and kept him so as not to look like an unrideable bike while trying to get Hayden signed. I really wonder if Melandri is going to have access to the 2007s for the 2009 season. If he doesn't, it could be ugly.

Anywho, I have no idea what this means for a control tire next year. It does seem that Ezy may keep chucking money at Michelin and requiring them to run more satellite equipment in return. Bridgestone are still the brand to beat, but now that they have been forced to regress slightly, they are within reach of Michelin.

Hmmmmmm.........i thought it was in the bag, but Ezy may not be willing to gamble on a revolutionary change when Rossi has won another title; thus quelling the fan upheaval.

All quiet on the Western Front I suppose. No need to start another war with a control tire?

It will be interesting to see what happens.
I don't think you are too far off,actually.Iknow it is common to disregard your posts here on this forum but i'm not.
Too often things happen that seem fixed somehow.Like you gave examples of.
I follow the sport as close as i can,read every thing i can find and listen very closely to Eurosport's Swedish commentators which i think are very good.They are Johan Stigefelt(ex racer running Stiggy motorsports in WSS)And an ex 250 rider among others.Anyway they have insight.

For instance the Eurosport commentators also reflected over the thing that a while ago everyone was screeming their heads off about control tires and by the time of Indy there wasn't a word.
 
Why would Bridgestone say that they couldn't supply anymore teams? If I were them I would have picked up Pedro and gave him the .... 2008 spec at half the price and then watch him struggle. Of course Rossi would have gotten the good .... because that just makes sense for marketing purposes and Stoner would have to be relegated to the new 2008 spec. Do you think that Ducati was helping B-Stones with developement costs?

Do you recall the Nicky Hayden video on MTV? He knew B-Stones were good from the start

It was odd how Pedro ran away with the races he did
<
. "Perfect setup" can mean a whole lot of things besides just the right tire, however it was odd that he was the only one to receive the tire of choice.

What about the last rounds where Michelins really ...... up? How is that explained?

It was a very interesting read. No offfense, but you must have a lot of time on your hands to think about these things.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Sep 18 2008, 06:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Okay, I figured it out.

Bridgestone built some ridiculously expensive tires for the new 800cc class

How do they make them more expencive than they allready are? These tires are "hand buildt" or more correctly Manually buildt allready, each tire buildt according to spec with a high degree of manual labor. Dual compond, different inner structure, it's allready done manually. Did the use gold plating inside for heat transport?
<


Interesting how you can spinn the whole season's development cycle around one thing only. Engine electronics, engine development, chassi development, all those things that "usually" (or allways as we say in the real world) make a difference is totally wiped out. Amusing.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Babelfish @ Sep 18 2008, 11:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>How do they make them more expencive than they allready are? These tires are "hand buildt" or more correctly Manually buildt allready, each tire buildt according to spec with a high degree of manual labor. Dual compond, different inner structure, it's allready done manually. Did the use gold plating inside for heat transport?
<

The tire expert has spoken. You all better listen up.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Sep 18 2008, 05:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Okay, I figured it out.

Bridgestone built some ridiculously expensive tires for the new 800cc class referred to by the press as the 2007's. Bridgestone thought it would be sweet revenge to go out and quadruple their budget building special tires at a time when the manufacturers were calling for reduced tire costs. They thought it would be good payback for all the years Michelin used to run overnight specials. The actual tire costs to the teams for the 2007 spec Bridgestones was minimal, but the tires were extremely expensive to make, and Bridgestone were willing to operate at a huge loss (like they used to) to capture their first title. The development of the 2007's was a joint project with Ducati, Ducati knew how much money was being spent. Perhaps Bridgestone even violated a few testing restrictions
<
Nobody has ever done that before.
<


At the end of the season, Ezy threatened to throw Bstone out when they refused to supply the grid. Rather than risk expulsion Bridgestone came clean and told Ezy they had wildly overspent and couldn't afford to supply the grid. Ducati has no leverage because they have seen as collaborators and have been held accountable for indirectly violating the manufacturers agreement.


Ezy realized he couldn't move everyone to Michelin b/c it compromised the competitive integrity of the sport. He realized he couldn't allow Bridgestone/Ducati to win in perpetuity b/c they had violated the spirit of the covenant regulations. Michelin threatened to surrender if they didn't receive subsidies from the governing body to catch up. Ezy handed them a big fat subsidy and the Tech 3 team to develop. Colin was demoted to test tires. Coincidentally, Lorenzo landed right where Rossi didn't want him--on the factory squad. Rossi had no say b/c he was begging Ezy for B-stone rubber. That's how Lorenzo ended up riding next to Rossi.

At Qatar everyone lined up on their equipment of choice. Stoner had the 2007 spec tires. Pedrosa still had his special line of Michelins. Rossi was on the 2008s, he has never had access to the 2007s. Stoner obliterated the field and Ezy quickly realized no one had made significant improvements to challenge the Bridgestone/Ducati tandem. Citing reckless indiscretion and exercising his unlimited power to make the sport look better for marketing, Ezy banned Stoner from the 2007 tires. Other teams have been allowed to run them until Bridgestone can successfully transition them to new spec.

Calling Rossi's tires the 2008 spec is actually a misnomer. The 2008s are not a new technology they are the evolution of Bridgestone's old 990 technology. They are more or less Bridgestone's take on a Michelin tire, as you may remember, in 2006 Bridgestone ran quite well in Europe. The 2008's are the 800cc-developed descendant of the 2006 tire. Rossi was so convinced they would work like his old 990 tires, he ran an antiquated 990 setup for the first race at Qatar. Soft front, hard rear. It didn't go the way he wanted. The Yamaha melted his B-stones like they were Michelins too.
<
It was Michelin's fault he didn't win in 2006, right?

Anyway, Ezy put Michelin on the government juice so he could control them. He actually required Michelin to make mass recommendations to protect Bridgestone while they transitioned teams to different technology. At the early rounds of the season Eurosport reported DORNA had hoards of officials monitoring corner entry g's. The suspected it was for safety monitoring. It was actually to help Michelin find the tires most like the 2008 Bridgestones. When convenient, Ezy let Michelin give preferred tires to preferred riders at their home markets. Pedrosa got a hard rear at Jerez (no one else did). At Catalunya he was also off the pace in every session and yet he ran away with the race. I suspect he received similar treatment for that round as well.

During the beginning of the season when Bridgestone was being forced to further develop their old 990 technology it was every man for himself. Rossi/Burgess spearheaded for team Yamaha b/c they were the only ones who could. Sete Gibernau returned to spearhead development for Ducati. You may remember Gibby once rode a Ducati on 990 spec Bridgestones in 2006. He was never meant to race in the premier class again, he was at Mugello to test tires. When they saw he was barely off of Stoner's times with development rubber, he quickly became a logical replacement for Marco Melandri.

In typical fashion, Rossi/Burgess did a better development job than Stoner/Ducati, but after bringing Gibby on board, Stoner soon acquired the rubber to fight back. The real travesty is that during this transition period Ducati were flailing wildly to make progress and Stoner fell off of the championship pace while other teams rode around on his tires (as confirmed by Hopkins in a recent interview). Since Catlunya when a good 2008 Ducati Bridgestone was delivered to Stoner for the first time, the racing between Rossi and Stoner has more or less been fair. However, you may recall that Stoner was already 41 points behind at that point.

There is no conspiracy causing Stoner to crash in the last couple of rounds. I think the 2007 Bridgestones worked so ridiculously well at Brno and Misano that Stoner has simply had a bit of trouble adapting to his good-but-not-quite-equal 2008 spec tire.

Tertiary to the drama, I believe the Melandri rumors. I think Melandri was given the 2007 spec tire at China because his results were so bad, Ezy decided to throw Ducati a bone. Melandri rode quite well at China. I do believe that Ducati sent Melandri to Japan to see if they could make way for Gibby. Kawasaki have never run anything but the 2007 spec tires, I think Melandri found a home on that bike in Japan and really put in some really hot laps. Ducati got scared and kept him so as not to look like an unrideable bike while trying to get Hayden signed. I really wonder if Melandri is going to have access to the 2007s for the 2009 season. If he doesn't, it could be ugly.

Anywho, I have no idea what this means for a control tire next year. It does seem that Ezy may keep chucking money at Michelin and requiring them to run more satellite equipment in return. Bridgestone are still the brand to beat, but now that they have been forced to regress slightly, they are within reach of Michelin.

Hmmmmmm.........i thought it was in the bag, but Ezy may not be willing to gamble on a revolutionary change when Rossi has won another title; thus quelling the fan upheaval.

All quiet on the Western Front I suppose. No need to start another war with a control tire?

It will be interesting to see what happens.
I'm intrigued, please elaborate!
<
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SackWack @ Sep 18 2008, 10:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Why would Bridgestone say that they couldn't supply anymore teams?

I don't know for sure, but chances are it was related to cost. I can see a scenario where Ezy asks them to supply and the refuse citing cost. Ezy would have told them he would subsidize, but unwilling to show their hand, Bridgestone probably would have refused again. Ezy would have been furious, and I can imagine this is when the Michelin control tire rumors started. I doubt very much Ezy threatened a Michelin control b/c they wouldn't supply Rossi. I think it is much more likely Bstone refused flatly and Ezy became enraged.

Only when Bridgestone finally revealed the extent of their budget did Ezy realize not even Dorna could afford to bankroll a Bridgestone control tire. That's when he realized he needed to find another solution. It took 3 months to hammer out the details in the private emergency technical meetings.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>If I were them I would have picked up Pedro and gave him the .... 2008 spec at half the price and then watch him struggle. Of course Rossi would have gotten the good .... because that just makes sense for marketing purposes and Stoner would have to be relegated to the new 2008 spec. Do you think that Ducati was helping B-Stones with developement costs?

I think Honda were deeply conflicted about the situation b/c they knew Bridgestone would be returning to 990 tech. If you recall Michelin used to hold the cards back then, but that was before the days of electronics.

Bridgestone made their 990 tires to work with electronics that's why the Suzuki and Ducati were overwhelmed with gadgets early on. The strategy never quite worked until the 800cc regs. Honda were probably fighting internally over what to do, I'm sure Puig was making violent Quixotic charges to change to Bridgestone. Fukui used to run HRC so he was always involved in the discussion. When HRC couldn't resolve its conflict internally, Fukui issued an edict to stay with Michelin.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Do you recall the Nicky Hayden video on MTV? He knew B-Stones were good from the start

I'm sure he did. Bridgestone were probably marketing them pretty hard to a Honda team to make sure they got the championship they splurged to win. Furthermore, Hayden would have seen how they worked at Gresini. At the start Repsol and Gresini were on the same equipment.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>It was odd how Pedro ran away with the races he did
<
. "Perfect setup" can mean a whole lot of things besides just the right tire, however it was odd that he was the only one to receive the tire of choice.

What about the last rounds where Michelins really ...... up? How is that explained?

Pedro was the home rider. I don't think Michelin envisioned that Pedro would stomp Lorenzo, he was pretty far behind in practice. At Catalunya when Stoner took pole on a Bstone Quali I think Ezy thought he could use a little boost. Michelin didn't imagine that he would clear off considering how weak he looked relative to Stoner in FP3.

It was probably done to create a race and give the home rider a boost, but in actuality Pedrosa cleared off.

Michelin's bad rounds were documented last year as well. 800cc tires are much softer than their 990cc counterparts. At resurfaced venues the 800cc Michelins fall apart. It happened this year as well.

On a side note does anyone find it funny that Indy went out of their way to improve grip by diamond polishing the circuit?
<
Maybe it had to be done, but don't believe for one instant that proximity to Nicky's home didn't affect the polishing procedure. It has been known for a long time that resurfaced venues and low-grip circuits benefit Bridgestone.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Babelfish @ Sep 18 2008, 10:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>How do they make them more expencive than they allready are? These tires are "hand buildt" or more correctly Manually buildt allready, each tire buildt according to spec with a high degree of manual labor. Dual compond, different inner structure, it's allready done manually. Did the use gold plating inside for heat transport?
<


Interesting how you can spinn the whole season's development cycle around one thing only. Engine electronics, engine development, chassi development, all those things that "usually" (or allways as we say in the real world) make a difference is totally wiped out. Amusing.

The consensus in the paddock was that Bridgestone had done something revolutionary with edge grip.

I have no idea what it was, I'm not a tire tech. I will admit openly I have no idea exactly what Bridgestone did to gain the advantage. I have often speculated their tires were built for high static coefficient of friction while Michelins have always been good for a slide. That's as good as it gets I'm afraid.
<


The second half of your post is a pretty legitimate argument. I focused almost solely on tires b/c I was trying to focus on the controversies and changes from the riders' standpoint. Obviously, the emergency technical meetings at the end of 2007 is what caused me to start looking.

I think adapting to the tires was quite obviously going to be the biggest challenge for Rossi when it looked like the 2008 pneumatic lump was good. I focused on Stoner's tires because he threw tantrums about the stuff he was being made to run. He frequently cited electronic changes to the bike, in my mind, you change big changes in electronics/traction-control happen when you have big changes in your tires. Stoner did also test a new frame. He was comfortable on the new and the old so it didn't seem like much to examine. The engine blow up at LeMans doesn't seem to be much of a story either. They fixed it, another blow up hasn't occurred.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Sep 18 2008, 02:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>They fixed it, another blow up hasn't occurred.Well, there was the one in practice at Indy.
 
Such profound misteries cannot be explained by mere human reason of course, but I will try to help with one: I think I know why Melandri performed decently in China.
<


It is the same reason why he could probably perform reasonably well in Phillip Island too--many long fast corners on which the Duck runs like a train on rails...
<
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Sep 18 2008, 10:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The consensus in the paddock was that Bridgestone had done something revolutionary with edge grip.

I have no idea what it was, I'm not a tire tech. I will admit openly I have no idea exactly what Bridgestone did to gain the advantage. I have often speculated their tires were built for high static coefficient of friction while Michelins have always been good for a slide. That's as good as it gets I'm afraid.
<


The second half of your post is a pretty legitimate argument. I focused almost solely on tires b/c I was trying to focus on the controversies and changes from the riders' standpoint. Obviously, the emergency technical meetings at the end of 2007 is what caused me to start looking.

I think adapting to the tires was quite obviously going to be the biggest challenge for Rossi when it looked like the 2008 pneumatic lump was good. I focused on Stoner's tires because he threw tantrums about the stuff he was being made to run. He frequently cited electronic changes to the bike, in my mind, you change big changes in electronics/traction-control happen when you have big changes in your tires. Stoner did also test a new frame. He was comfortable on the new and the old so it didn't seem like much to examine. The engine blow up at LeMans doesn't seem to be much of a story either. They fixed it, another blow up hasn't occurred.
And instead of your numerous tire(some) theories it could be just like Ducati said it was. New engine with too jerky throttle control that finally got tamed at Catalunya. In that mix there is also not only '07 tires but also '07 engine and electronics, '09 carbon fibre frame and a lot more. I've seen complaints about tires but those has mainly come out now after the summer break.
I can see how Bridgestone can use a huge amount on developement but when the tires are here they are just as expencive as any other manually made multicompound tire. After all, it didn't look like Rossi had huge problems with the '08 tires in that period, in fact that's when he won three races.
Besides Hoppkins did say they were running an old type of tires and clearly expressed that as a disadvantage and was looiking forward to get the new ones. Not much of a conspiracy there.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (J4rn0 @ Sep 18 2008, 01:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Such profound misteries cannot be explained by mere human reason of course, but I will try to help with one: I think I know why Melandri performed decently in China.
<


It is the same reason why he could probably perform reasonably well in Phillip Island too--many long fast corners on which the Duck runs like a train on rails...
<


Possibly. He did say, though, that it feels like he has been racing in the wet all season even when the tracks were completely dry. He said he had a different feeling at China.

I have no idea what that means, but it doesn't sound like the turns were the difference.
 
OK Ok, It all came down to lower viewership cause Valentino last year had such a horrible season. So Ezy did what he could to make sure that Valentino breaks the records he needed to so in a sence he makes history during this year and the NEW GOAT! So you can't have CS muckin up the whole plan with all that DUcati power and prowess. So he makes sure that Bstone ..... up on the tires for Stoner so even if he is out front beating Valentino he would still crash and have Vale win. SO you see Gents that this is all a big ufo coverup type thing to keep you off the real story. Which now we know that Vale will win another title. The Rossi Rump Rangers are all happy and think he really won it on his own like stoner did last year. ANd this sets up a season next year so that the torch can be passed to the new generation.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Babelfish @ Sep 18 2008, 01:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>And instead of your numerous tire(some) theories it could be just like Ducati said it was. New engine with too jerky throttle control that finally got tamed at Catalunya. In that mix there is also not only '07 tires but also '07 engine and electronics, '09 carbon fibre frame and a lot more. I've seen complaints about tires but those has mainly come out now after the summer break.
I can see how Bridgestone can use a huge amount on developement but when the tires are here they are just as expencive as any other manually made multicompound tire. After all, it didn't look like Rossi had huge problems with the '08 tires in that period, in fact that's when he won three races.
Besides Hoppkins did say they were running an old type of tires and clearly expressed that as a disadvantage and was looiking forward to get the new ones. Not much of a conspiracy there.

Or it could be what Stoner said about the completely bollox tires. Later after some coaching (I'm sure they convinced him he was giving Rossi a mental edge) he changed his story to electronics.
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We've seen that song and dance before. Everything went back to 2007 as soon as his tire woes were solved. What could that mean?
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An engine with oval pistons isn't that much different than another hand built engine but for whatever reason it's too expensive for the sport and is banned. You can build two identical hand built bike frames--one out of carbon fiber, one out steel. The one built out of carbon fiber costs a little bit more usually.
 
Lex I think this is the most outrageous and ridiculous thing you've ever posted, and that's saying quite a bit for you. I'm not sure whether or not you're right, but it's certainly intriguing and may even be plausible.

Regardless of truth, you put a lot of time into writing it and I enjoyed it and found myself thinking 'hey, that doesn't sound too far off'. Hats off, Lex.
 

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