Why The Formula Change?

Austin

Joined Mar 2005

7K Posts | 20+

Woody Creek

Discussion Starter
• Nov 9, 2005

• #1

This is going to sound like a really dumb question but it's something I need to know. I never heard an explanation as to why the premier class switched from 500cc two strokes to 990cc four strokes. In the years leading to the switch I was up to my eyes in Superbike racing. I watched 500cc racing here and there but never close enough to hear any news on the switch. By the time I started watching regularly it was 2002 and the change had already occured. If anyone could fill me in please do.

 

R

RallyeRon

Joined May 2005

874 Posts | 0+

v

• Nov 10, 2005

• #2

Ooost my main man. Basically my understanding is that they switched because the 500cc two strokes had gone as far as they could go in terms of development. Maybe they could have got more power out of the 2strokes, but maybe that wouldn’t have been reliable, useable power. I think they thought that the future of premiere class GP lay in 4strokes and it meant a change in direction to continue development. Also, with the 4strokes, they produce a lot of power, so much power that-as we all know- the riders never really use max power&throttle which means the engines are not really under a lot of ‘stress’ meaning they are more reliable than the older 2strokes. Obvioulsy in terms of cost, the first two years of development of the 4strokes would have been high, but look at the result- 3 years down the line there are a lot less break downs, more useable power means more control, and less crashes which obviously saves money too.

I think the switch maybe had something to do with emissions too, obviously 2strokes burn more oil, but im not sure about that theory.

 

F

frosty58

Joined Sep 2005

8K Posts | 1+

washington DC, USA

• Nov 10, 2005

• #3

also the fact that what is developed in a 4stroke gp machine could eventually end up in the bike's u & i buy. it just made more sense to run 4 strokes. both cbr & r line of sport bikes already benefit from this. not sure about gsxr or ninjas.

 

R

RallyeRon

Joined May 2005

874 Posts | 0+

v

• Nov 10, 2005

• #4

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (frosty58 @ Nov 10 2005, 02:53 PM)<div class='quotemain'>also the fact that what is developed in a 4stroke gp machine could eventually end up in the bike's u & i buy. it just made more sense to run 4 strokes. both cbr & r line of sport bikes already benefit from this. not sure about gsxr or ninjas.
<div align="right<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i agree mate

The CBR1000RR has def benifited from the RCV

 

D

Dr Costa

Joined Mar 2005

348 Posts | 0+

Lancashire

• Nov 10, 2005

• #5

Think it was most deffo an emissions issue, as the 2 stroke road bikes where begining to get fazed out,then there was the homologation issues ect,end of a lovely era Ahhhhh!

Dont forget the 600RR too, fookin awsome power delivery,i take a step back !and kneel to say !thank you mr Honda !!!

 

C

Captain Snow

Joined Aug 2005

1K Posts | 0+

USA

• Nov 10, 2005

• #6

For the main part the bikes were getting outdated. 990cc WSBK was stealing away from popularity of MotoGP and they didn't want to stay behind.

Technology for the two-strokes had reached a near level of ending. There wasn't really much left to do with them.

Then comes the emmisions and safety concerns.

 

Austin

Joined Mar 2005

7K Posts | 20+

Woody Creek

Discussion Starter
• Nov 10, 2005

• #7

Those were pretty much my thoughts but I just wanted to make sure. Thanks guys.

 

R

RallyeRon

Joined May 2005

874 Posts | 0+

v

• Nov 10, 2005

• #8

Its ok Ooost. Always glad to help you out mate, 'you are a pillar of the motogpforum community'.

Ps. Its 'Ooost' time again, responds to everyones posts without fail.... around 5:30pm GMT.... that must be midday for you right? thats commitment for you

 

T

teomolca

Joined Jun 2005

3K Posts | 0+

Valencia, Spain

• Nov 10, 2005

• #9

The main reason for the change was MARKETING, 500cc 2 strokes had nothing to do with road bikes, and the Japs were not happy about that, meanwhile SBK was stealing the show with their bikes that "looked just like the one you had in the garage".

4 stroke racing is infinately much more expensive than 2 strokes, that's why only the top class has done the switch so far.

The development of 2 strokes goes on other categories 250cc &125cc & Motocross, there's nothing like a limit for this technology (which by the way is younger than 4 strokes). In fact during the 2002 season when 2 & 4 stroke co-existed the japs stopped all the development work on the 2 strokes because they were afraid the 500cc would embarrass their shiny brand new RCVs and M1s

The racing used to be more exciting with 2 strokes and Rossi after his first taste of RCV in 2002 acknowledged that the bike was fast, but nowhere near as challenging as the NSR. He was glad that he had won the championship before the "... racing" era had began.

There's no emissions issue in GP racing that's only for road bikes, emissions is an issue for ROAD 2 stroke bikes, which have almost dissapeared.

 

Austin

Joined Mar 2005

7K Posts | 20+

Woody Creek

Discussion Starter
• Nov 10, 2005

• #10

Thanks teo. Although I must say in the US there is a change in MX from two strokes to four. The development continues for the two strokes but the vast majority of factories have their riders riding four strokes in our series.

 

T

teomolca

Joined Jun 2005

3K Posts | 0+

Valencia, Spain

• Nov 10, 2005

• #11

Yeah I know, but it's the same reason than in MotoGP, I don't know what's the emissions policy for bikes in the US but in Europe it has basically killed all the 2 strokes so the MotoX are changing to 4 strokes because they want to have the same technology on race tracks than on shops, it's a marketing issue. They could build 4 strokes for the mass market and use 2 strokes on racing but it doesn't make sense from the commercial point of view.

 

Austin

Joined Mar 2005

7K Posts | 20+

Woody Creek

Discussion Starter
• Nov 10, 2005

• #12

I know exactly what you mean. I'm not sure what the emissions laws aout here regarding two strokes, I can't think of very many street legal two strokes and I know they are banned on the roads in California.