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Testing restrictions lifted for 2012

Had to happen really. We couldn't have Vale falling off every race next season as well now could we?
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motortom said:
Had to happen really. We couldn't have Vale falling off every race next season as well now could we?
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First of all, I'm hoping we all take a step back and debate in a measure fashion. That's my hope for the forum moving forward. I'm looking in the mirror when I say that.



Anyway, the timing of the new rules will undoubtedly have benefits for some, certainly Ducati, but also realize that the testing will be limited to tire allocation. Also, this is the same for all the factories, so that means those ahead of the game, like Honda, will continue to have an advantage.
 
I concur wholeheartedly. But a little joke here and there can't hurt =]



I don't really know how many tyres is enough tyres, so the limitation doesn't really mean anything to me until we start to see some results from the tests. Naturally this will benefit everyone - but for those who are languishing further behind like Ducati it should allow them to bridge the gap and at least get in touch with the front runners. When you're doing as well as Honda it makes finding that extra thousandth of a second all the harder, where as if you're 2 seconds down the extra time to try new ideas and designs out should bring them closer in a shorter space of time. In theory.
 
Isn't the tyre limit the same as now, so testing miles will be about the same but with the more valuable input of the contracted race riders.
 
Well it's a good start, hopefully they have some more positive reforms to come.



The rubber issue needs to be addressed asap
 
The testing limitation was yet another measure they didn't think through, or not to the point of considering such situations as new riders joining the field, new formulae being introduced, manufacturers coming up with a radical new design, or even top riders changing marques, none of which it would seem good policy to actively discourage. The rossi/ducati situation is illustrative (in terms of money saving, not about favouritism for rossi), any money saved by ducati by testing less or advantage gained by the other teams by testing more because they can afford to is made irrelevant if the rider to whom you are paying 15 million euros per year doesn't gel with your bike in its existing form.
 
Wonder how many sets of tyres Nicky will get for the season?



I think this new testing rule should be called Rule #46. It will allow Bridgestone to develop a tyre for Rossi and the Ducati much quicker than they would have been able to with testing limits. Seeing as though they have not been able to develop the bike their last chance is to develop a tyre that suits the bike and hope that it will suit Lorenzo/Yamaha and Stoner/Honda less.



Of course I could be wrong as history ... cough .... cough .... suggests that changes to the rules are done to create a level playing field.
 
michaelm said:
The testing limitation was yet another measure they didn't think through, or not to the point of considering such situations as new riders joining the field, new formulae being introduced, manufacturers coming up with a radical new design, or even top riders changing marques, none of which it would seem good policy to actively discourage. The rossi/ducati situation is illustrative (in terms of money saving, not about favouritism for rossi), any

money saved by ducati by testing less or advantage gained by the other teams by testing more because they can afford to is made irrelevant if the

rider to whom you are paying 15 million euros per year doesn't gel with

your bike in its existing form.
Click to expand...



moreso the fact that the sweet spot in set up with hugely inflexible rubber supply, mixed with electronics variables leaves a very very narrow and expensive window for success.



Until they add another tyre supplier to compete or remove bridgestone or force them to supply variety, I see little changing
 
Mental Anarchist said:
Wonder how many sets of tyres Nicky will get for the season?



I think this new testing rule should be called Rule #46. It will allow Bridgestone to develop a tyre for Rossi and the Ducati much quicker than they would have been able to with testing limits. Seeing as though they have not been able to develop the bike their last chance is to develop a tyre that suits the bike and hope that it will suit Lorenzo/Yamaha and Stoner/Honda less.



Of course I could be wrong as history ... cough .... cough .... suggests that changes to the rules are done to create a level playing field.
Click to expand...

For someone who is a disinterested observer of the sport you seem to be rather obssessed with rossi and conspiracies involving him.
 
michaelm said:
For someone who is a disinterested observer of the sport you seem to be rather obssessed with rossi and conspiracies involving him.
Click to expand...

I am not a disinterested observer at all. I have decided to withdraw from several hours a day on MotoGP/Motorcycle forums. Just so happens in the last few days I have had some time up my sleeve so have been playing a bit.



As far as conspiracies go I hardly call this a conspiracy. Any thinking observer could have predicted that testing rules would change as soon as Rossi failure to ride and develop the Ducati became apparent. Only mushrooms would fall for the BS being peddled at the moment.



It is my opinion that the sport has moved past Rossi and he is now irrelevant to it. Unfortunately it seems that just like in the climate change debate there are some dinosaurs who are clinging to fossil fuels being relevant to the future. The new breed of rider - Stoner, Lorenzo, Spies etc don't require nor seek unfair advantages they just want a fair and just treatment for all and in my opinion the sport will be better for it.
 
I don't think that proposing a theory that this is something done in order to bring Rossi up to speed is outlandish.



There are plenty of prior examples.



Now all the teams get the same benefit, which in reality doesn't give Rossi any advantage.



If it makes for good racing next year then all is well. It isn't just about keeping Valentino competitive, it will be about keeping Ducati, who supply a large number of bikes to the grid on the grid.



Valentino just happened to be their number 1 draw card
 
Step in the right direction. I don't care if Ducati appear to be advantaged more than the others. They have so far to go just to pull equal that I'm not so sure we're going to see them make material improvements in 2012. Ducati are so far behind that I'm not certain there's anything that can be done between now and 2012 to affect the dominance displayed by Stoner on the Honda.



2012 will look like 2011. I expect JL to push for the championship a bit harder but Stoner must be the favorite going forward. No amount of testing will place Stoner on equal footing with the others.



Yeah, he's just that good...
 
Mental Anarchist said:
I am not a disinterested observer at all. I have decided to withdraw from several hours a day on MotoGP/Motorcycle forums. Just so happens in the last few days I have had some time up my sleeve so have been playing a bit.



As far as conspiracies go I hardly call this a conspiracy. Any thinking observer could have strings were pulled for him to get on the bridgestonesthat testing rules would change as soon as Rossi failure to ride and develop the Ducati became apparent. Only mushrooms would fall for the BS being peddled at the moment.



It is my opinion that the sport has moved past Rossi and he is now irrelevant to it. Unfortunately it seems that just like in the climate change debate there are some dinosaurs who are clinging to fossil fuels being relevant to the future. The new breed of rider - Stoner, Lorenzo, Spies etc don't require nor seek unfair advantages they just want a fair and just treatment for all and in my opinion the sport will be better for it.
Click to expand...

Being blessed or cursed with a good memory I remember what you said in your initial posts, where you did claim to have no allegiances.



As I have said current attempts to discredit rossi annoy me almost as much as the previous detraction from stoner. Stoner is vindicated, nobody apart from the odd recidivist teenager on crashnet is failing to recognise his talent/achievements.



Rossi's career is the same as other greats of the sport like doohan and agostini, the best riders wind up on the best bikes, this has always been the way of things; stoner will also now not be found on a substandard bike for the remainder of his career. Rossi had to have the talent and deliver the performances to be chosen by the big teams in the first place.



As lex, hardly a rossibopper and the main proponent of the bridgestone/rossi tyre conspiracy theory, has argued maybe strings were pulled to get him on the bridgestones/ remove the bridgestones peculiarly suited to ducati/stoner to aid his 2008 championship, but this does not apply to any of his other championships.



If anything I think dorna and to some extent he believed the hype about his unchallengeable greatness and thought he would win regardless, hence him choosing to go to ducati and some of dorna's rule changes which were very definitely not to his advantage.
 
Mental Anarchist said:
As far as conspiracies go I hardly call this a conspiracy. Any thinking observer could have predicted that testing rules would change as soon as Rossi failure to ride and develop the Ducati became apparent. Only mushrooms would fall for the BS being peddled at the moment.



The new breed of rider - Stoner, Lorenzo, Spies etc don't require nor seek unfair advantages they just want a fair and just treatment for all and in my opinion the sport will be better for it.
Click to expand...



Any thinking observer would know the following: 1) ALL the riders want more relaxed testing rules, they want to ride their bikes, learn setups, steer development and keep their eye in.



2) All the teams will feel exactly the same, this especially applies to teams with less experienced riders.



3) The factories all want more testing to develop their bikes, especially now with the start of a new formula. Currently they are paying test riders to do the work while their race guys sit on their hands, then hope the feedback these guys generate applies to the considerably quicker guys who actually do the job.



Now suddenly this is about Rossi? Get a grip, Rossi is still extremely relevant to the sport but it is you that is clinging on to him and overblowing his position by convincing yourself every thing that changes or remains unchanged does so to serve Rossi some kind of 'unfair advantage'.
 
Tom said:
Any thinking observer would know the following: 1) ALL the riders want more relaxed testing rules, they want to ride their bikes, learn setups, steer development and keep their eye in.



2) All the teams will feel exactly the same, this especially applies to teams with less experienced riders.



3) The factories all want more testing to develop their bikes, especially now with the start of a new formula. Currently they are paying test riders to do the work while their race guys sit on their hands, then hope the feedback these guys generate applies to the considerably quicker guys who actually do the job.



Now suddenly this is about Rossi? Get a grip, Rossi is still extremely relevant to the sport but it is you that is clinging on to him and overblowing his position by convincing yourself every thing that changes or remains unchanged does so to serve Rossi some kind of 'unfair advantage'.
Click to expand...

1,2 & 3 are all correct. They were correct last year and the year before that. The question is why were the rules not changed then when all those people wanted it? Easy, the natural order of who was winning was as it should be. Now that it is not the rules must change to restore that order.



My beef is more with Dorna than with Rossi. It is about Rossi but not directed at him personally. Dorna is a business and they are greedy. They want to milk the cow but the cow is at the back of the paddock where it is not producing the milk that it used to.



My argument is that there is a new breed to base the future of the sport on and they will go on producing revenue for the next decade.
 
Ultimately there will be more revenue if all manufacturers are competitive - not just Rossi-centric. That includes Suzuki as well as Ducati. It's good business sense not to have certain rides being career killers.
 
Andy Roo said:
I don't think that proposing a theory that this is something done in order to bring Rossi up to speed is outlandish.



There are plenty of prior examples.



Now all the teams get the same benefit, which in reality doesn't give Rossi any advantage.



If it makes for good racing next year then all is well. It isn't just about keeping Valentino competitive, it will be about keeping Ducati, who supply a large number of bikes to the grid on the grid.



Valentino just happened to be their number 1 draw card
Click to expand...



Pretty much sums it up for me. The company that supplies so many bikes to the grid being more competitive - is of greater import

than whether Vale gets to the front again. Stoner and the other top competitors are by now over their awe of Rossi and should he

become competitive again things will be "more equal" all 'round.
 

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