nicky

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mylexicon @ Aug 21 2007, 03:57 PM) [snapback]86099[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
However, it could be argued his five world titles are unprecedented; he is the only man to win on 2 different grand prix machines and for 2 different manufacturers.

I take this to mean of those riders with 5+ titles in a row? Otherwise your own Mr Lawson would certainly qualify?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mylexicon @ Aug 21 2007, 03:57 PM) [snapback]86099[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
As far as our sports go, you have to keep in mind America is all about new. New world, new continent, new country, New York, New Jersey, new government, new music, new leaders, new houses, new cars, new ideas. When we showed up and began to prosper it was inevitable we would make new sports, too. And we are always developing new sports think about how big and global snowboarding and skating have become.



That's great! Seriously... I'd never thought about it in those terms

I guess what I was trying to say though, was that it is exactly the reasons that you've given above which lead to the reason as to why perhaps not as many Americans follow MotoGP, as those fans from countries thoughout the rest of the world.

Yes America definitely is the "big boy" on the block! but I hope that everyone keeps in mind that life would be lonely at the top without good friends!

And thanks for the vote of support racejumkie

Cheers, M

I really wonder why such a small article makes people wirting such large comments. Guys, don't you have girlfriends to spend time with? Just kidding....

Hayden is World Champion and that's a good thing for the sport in general. I remember years ago Rossi won everything, the races were pretty boring and I (and for sure it wasn't only me) turned off the TV. Since last year the sport offers a lot of exciting races and this is the main point.

One thing I don't understand is why it's not popular in the states. Most of the people I talked to don't even know it. Sure, Americans love their stick and ball sports, but more popularity cannot hurt. I think an article like that draws attention and that's a good thing.

On the other side I don't know why people make comments like "I don't hate Americans totally". I'm European and live in America, I never would say something like that in general. Yes, sure, there are some things I like and don't like...but hey, take it easy. Don't know why you had a bad time in the US, but life is what you make of it.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinky @ Aug 21 2007, 01:10 AM) [snapback]86044[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
what full of american .....

remember hayden has had the BEST bike for the past 4 years. and when rossi swaped over to the inferior yamaha, hayden still got his ... whipped.

i can put it this way, even if nicky is on the BEST bike he wont win any races I guarantee you that.

he won 3 in 4 years, on the best bike.

nicky has single handedly brought honda to a level that honda would be ashamed of, from the heights of the doohan and rossi era.


How has he brought shame to Honda, by winning a world championship on the 'best bike'?

If Hayden is as bad as you're implying, it shows how good Honda must be, assuming he's as bad as you say, it's quite the opposite of bringing shame wouldn't you say?

Phil

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(muzzy57 @ Aug 21 2007, 02:09 AM) [snapback]86123[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
I take this to mean of those riders with 5+ titles in a row? Otherwise your own Mr Lawson would certainly qualify?


That's great! Seriously... I'd never thought about it in those terms

I guess what I was trying to say though, was that it is exactly the reasons that you've given above which lead to the reason as to why perhaps not as many Americans follow MotoGP, as those fans from countries thoughout the rest of the world.

Yes America definitely is the "big boy" on the block! but I hope that everyone keeps in mind that life would be lonely at the top without good friends!

And thanks for the vote of support racejumkie

Cheers, M


Yeah, riders with 5 in a row. If I was talking about any world champion I guess Lawson would half qualify since he only won on 2 strokes, not 2 and 4.

Americans don't watch MotoGP because motorsports is dead in America. The only motorsport prospering is NASCAR, a soap opera racing series that has evolved from druken bootlegers trying to outrun cops (how to people not get sucked in to watching occasionally?).

Furthermore, motorcycling is not nearly as mainstream as in other cultures. The only time motorcylcing thrives is after major world wars. After WWI harley's got big, then after WWII it was british cafe racers. After Vietnam it was the Easy Rider choppers, and now as Iraq is winding down I think our vets are driving the sport bike market.

Motorcycling has always faded away after times of prosper, but if oil prices continue to climb it may become more mainstream. Time will tell whether or not Americans start to focus on two wheeled motorsports.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mylexicon @ Aug 21 2007, 10:14 PM) [snapback]86271[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Yeah, riders with 5 in a row. If I was talking about any world champion I guess Lawson would half qualify since he only won on 2 strokes, not 2 and 4.

Americans don't watch MotoGP because motorsports is dead in America. The only motorsport prospering is NASCAR, a soap opera racing series that has evolved from druken bootlegers trying to outrun cops (how to people not get sucked in to watching occasionally?).

Furthermore, motorcycling is not nearly as mainstream as in other cultures. The only time motorcylcing thrives is after major world wars. After WWI harley's got big, then after WWII it was british cafe racers. After Vietnam it was the Easy Rider choppers, and now as Iraq is winding down I think our vets are driving the sport bike market.

Motorcycling has always faded away after times of prosper, but if oil prices continue to climb it may become more mainstream. Time will tell whether or not Americans start to focus on two wheeled motorsports.



I know why they don't ride bikes.

They weigh too much!

American sports fans are a uninformed slovenly lot and deserve all the flak we get.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(bojuhl @ Aug 21 2007, 08:46 PM) [snapback]86330[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
American sports fans are a uninformed slovenly lot and deserve all the flak we get.

I disagree Bo. Americans have many options and are over 350 million people. (Just think, in the state, one of 50, that I live in, California, we have more people then all of Canada, and the land size is larger that most European countries). Think about the diversity in a span of this many people in terms of both population and geography in Europe. I don’t think its fair to lump us all together. Some of us like motorsports and they are equally valid a pastime as stick and ball sports. Just because we don't fancy MotoGP and F1 to the degree per capita as they do in Europe, doesn't mean we don't have great motorsports here. Why don't the Europeans appreciate IRL, Champ Car, NASCAR, NHRA, etc? Or for that matter Baseball, American Football, and Basketball? Do they deserve "flak" because these sports are not popular there?

Look, we are different cultures and we enjoy different things. One very good reason why MotoGP is so popular in Europe and Asia is for the simple fact that most your average person can relate to being on two wheels--whether it be a bicycle, a scooter, or a motorcycle. If we where a society whose gas prices where so outrageous (and they are right now but to a greater scale in Europe), then perhaps motorcycling would be more popular here. But to go along the line as some others here have tried to suggest that somehow Americans don't have an appreciating for anything other than our own homegrown sports to make the case that we are somehow deserving of flak is a bit much.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mylexicon @ Aug 20 2007, 10:33 PM) [snapback]86013[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Good article, I wish they could have grabbed a better attention getting picture than him in the gravel trap----a wheelie perhaps.

I feel bad for Spencer, Lawson, Rainey, and Schwantz. KR got a mention in the historic section, besides him.........Mamola? One hell of a motorcycle racer but how do you mention the 4 times runner up without mentioning the four times premier class champion?


I thought the picture was appropriate actually...

Otherwise, I agree that he history could have been more complete...and it might have reminded the liberal elite of the US (AKA Times readers) that America used to be great at this sport.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Racejumkie @ Aug 22 2007, 07:03 AM) [snapback]86337[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Why don't the Europeans appreciate IRL, Champ Car, NASCAR, NHRA, etc? Or for that matter Baseball, American Football, and Basketball? Do they deserve "flak" because these sports are not popular there?

IRL and Champ Car are pretty good actually since they are American series of F1 and A1 GP...

NASCAR is not a sport let's get this clear at the onset...It take no talent to drive around in ovals as fast as the car will go and yell 'Yeeha' every other lap, and to top it all off the race ends with a Celebratory Good O'le Southern Cross Burning...

NHRA is for people that can't drive since American cars can't go around corners...again lazy silly sport that requires little skill.....

Baseball is sport for small children and its real name is Rounders...

American Football is for wimps...try Rugby, Aussie Rule Football or Gaelic Football then we'll be impressed...

Basketball is actually quite big in Europe and growing....

America has great sports, but some are for lazy fat wimpish people and require little skll to do....It is the American way....

BTW - I am American!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Racejumkie @ Aug 22 2007, 07:03 AM) [snapback]86337[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'> Why don't the Europeans appreciate IRL, Champ Car, NASCAR, NHRA, etc? Or for that matter Baseball, American Football, and Basketball? Do they deserve "flak" because these sports are not popular there?


I personally am not a fan of NASCAR, as it requires little to no skill, you drive round with your foot in the same place, moving the steering wheel every so often and then at the end, whoever had the fastest car wins.

I await your replies

Phil

MIGS and Dean...I don't want to start a debate about NASCAR on here because it is off topic to this dicussion, but I will say this...it's a little more difficult than you might think, just ask a former Formula1 driver how easy it is and I'm sure J.P. Montoya will have a different view. I used to be a big time NASCAR fan, but now I'm just a casual observer mainly because of some politics the NASCAR execs seem to be applying to the sport.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(phildean @ Aug 22 2007, 11:15 AM) [snapback]86351[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
I personally am not a fan of NASCAR, as it requires little to no skill, you drive round with your foot in the same place, moving the steering wheel every so often and then at the end, whoever had the fastest car wins.

:boxing: I await your replies

Phil


I like NHRA. Old schoolfriends of mine (and unfortunately I do mean old) are still competition drag racers.

I quite like champcar/indycar racing, although I think the split is stupid and damaging. I definitely like danica patrick.

I have 2 problems with nascar, but lack of involvement of skill is not one of them. As another responder to your post has said, ask juan montoya. This is probably the most competitive form of car racing in the world, and what most american car racers aspire to. Oval track racing requires different skills to road racing, but they are still considerable.
My first problem is that a lead hard-won by skill and effort can be capriciously expunged by the so-frequent yellow flags , some of which seem to be manufactured. I gather a major nascar racer was recently disciplined for saying this. I like close racing, but not at any cost.
The second is that a proportion of fans seem to be there to see crashing rather than racing, i am sure not including racejumkie. I have seen a lot of live car racing and hate this attitude.

Sorry, off topic. I am too much of a luddite to know how to start a new thread.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MigsAngel @ Aug 22 2007, 05:10 AM) [snapback]86347[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
IRL and Champ Car are pretty good actually since they are American series of F1 and A1 GP...

NASCAR is not a sport let's get this clear at the onset...It take no talent to drive around in ovals as fast as the car will go and yell 'Yeeha' every other lap, and to top it all off the race ends with a Celebratory Good O'le Southern Cross Burning...

NHRA is for people that can't drive since American cars can't go around corners...again lazy silly sport that requires little skill.....

Baseball is sport for small children and its real name is Rounders...

American Football is for wimps...try Rugby, Aussie Rule Football or Gaelic Football then we'll be impressed...

Basketball is actually quite big in Europe and growing....

America has great sports, but some are for lazy fat wimpish people and require little skll to do....It is the American way....

BTW - I am American!


You have absolutley no idea what your talking about. It takes an incredible amount of talent to drive Nascar.Imagine for a second your tooling down the highway at 200 mph with 42 other drivers stacked 3 wide and literally bumper to bumper and then you go into a 30 degree corner knowing if the guy in front of you,beside you,or behind you ..... up an inch,you could die.And they do this for 500-600 miles in an 140 degree oven,believe me,they have talent,Ask JPM

American football is for wimps,thats the most idiotic statement i may have ever heard.Its probably the most violent sport on the planet.I will be impressed when i see any of the European football pl;ayers make it in the NFL.I think one has made it and he was a kicker.The size and speed of NFL players is something you really cant comprehend and when you match size with speed you get very violent collisions.And the old toothless argument about them wearing pads,the pads make them more dangerous because they can hit with greater force and the helmet makes a hell of a weapon.Rugby is a game for drunken bar room brawlers who like to grab other mens nuts and bite ears and then get drunk some more.See how stupid that sounds

? Haha, yeah, I figured NASCAR would get some lumps here, if you don't like it I really don't think I can convince you of the skill level you need to be successful. Its ok I guess, some people think golfing is easy, yet two of the top five highest paid players in sports are golfers, if it were that easy I think I might try. Anyway, I think Mich, L8brake, and Povol pretty much covered it.

Anyway, back on topic. I think it was a good enough article, which had a few mistakes and could have been improved, but really that applies to most articles of this length. Oh well, I think it gave us another glimpse into the life of one of our MotoGP personalities and I think there was much value in that. I'm not sure how this became an American .... fest but its all good. I don't hate all Europeans (ha-ha, tongue and cheek, just taking a dig at something somebody posted, I’m not sure if they meant it as a compliment). I am aware that Americans take some flak in Europe, but frankly I use to have similar feelings before I actually visited France, Italy, and the UK. I came home thinking; damn those people are cool and nice. That's why I try and be cordial to visitors from other countries so they can take back a better impression from here. Really, if you are ever in the neighborhood and you think we Americans deserve some schooling, look me up, I'll take you to a NASCAR race and try to change your mind. Well at least I'll get you drunk enough to enjoy it, ha-ha.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(michaelm @ Aug 22 2007, 03:08 PM) [snapback]86367[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
NASCAR... This is probably the most competitive form of car racing in the world, and what most american car racers aspire to.

What are you talking about...?

Have you ever watched WTCC...? Or a Porsche Cup series? Those are the most competative car series in the world....

And American car racers aspire to NASCAR becaue they don't know any better....

Montoya switched to NASCAR from F1 cause he got beat to many times to the title by Alonso and Schumaker, and so Juan became an 'also ran' at the top level of Car Racing (F1) in the world....muck like Tamada, Barros, Capirossi and others in MotoGP...Montoya was just smart enough to know when he was beat and gave up trying!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MigsAngel @ Aug 22 2007, 03:16 PM) [snapback]86379[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
What are you talking about...?

Have you ever watched WTCC...? Or a Porsche Cup series? Those are the most competative car series in the world....

And American car racers aspire to NASCAR becaue they don't know any better....

Montoya switched to NASCAR from F1 cause he got beat to many times to the title by Alonso and Schumaker, and so Juan became an 'also ran' at the top level of Car Racing (F1) in the world....muck like Tamada, Barros, Capirossi and others in MotoGP...Montoya was just smart enough to know when he was beat and gave up trying!

I have seen lots of all types of car racing live , including Tasman series open wheel racing with jackie stewart et al in australia in the 70s and modern F1. My favourite was formula cosworth (with the odd hand grenade french turbo) F1 racing in the early 80s which I only saw on TV.

I am not saying nascar is my favourite or the best form of car racing but it is certainly competitive. Huge amounts of money, huge fields with a large number of potential winners, a large number of races, huge numbers of drivers trying to get into it.

I'll now wait for another thread to go off-topic in.
By the way, always enjoyed your posts on the old crashnet forum.