Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
I was just getting ready to post the link when i checked to see if someone had beat me to it.And you had!
Good article,thought it was interesting what Mamola said about Stoner.Also thought it painted a pretty good picture of who Nicky is, and why he is who he is.
Good article,thought it was interesting what Mamola said about Stoner.Also thought it painted a pretty good picture of who Nicky is, and why he is who he is.
Good article, I wish they could have grabbed a better attention getting picture than him in the gravel trap----a wheelie perhaps.
Mamola's statemnent about Stoner being unable to win on Nicky's bike is intriguing. I wonder if he was stating it matter of factly as an insult to the disaster of a bike the RC212V has been. Or if the statement was actually in regards to the addition of TC in motogp. If the latter is what he was implying, it's a pretty big compliment to Hayden and a pretty nasty backhanded slap to a kid who is racing out of his mind.
I feel bad for Spencer, Lawson, Rainey, and Schwantz. KR got a mention in the historic section, besides him.........Mamola? One hell of a motorcycle racer but how do you mention the 4 times runner up without mentioning the four times premier class champion?
Mamola's statemnent about Stoner being unable to win on Nicky's bike is intriguing. I wonder if he was stating it matter of factly as an insult to the disaster of a bike the RC212V has been. Or if the statement was actually in regards to the addition of TC in motogp. If the latter is what he was implying, it's a pretty big compliment to Hayden and a pretty nasty backhanded slap to a kid who is racing out of his mind.
I feel bad for Spencer, Lawson, Rainey, and Schwantz. KR got a mention in the historic section, besides him.........Mamola? One hell of a motorcycle racer but how do you mention the 4 times runner up without mentioning the four times premier class champion?
Joined Oct 2006
25K Posts | 4K+
Your Mom's House
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(povol @ Aug 20 2007, 01:29 PM) [snapback]86008[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Good article,thought it was interesting what Mamola said about Stoner.
What a great article. It’s a long read but totally worth it.
Povol, I think Mamola was saying more about the Honda than of Stoner. What he was saying was, even a great rider like Stoner wouldn't have had great results on the Honda this year. I agree.
I was delighted to read some of what goes on at home and his personal life. I was most impressed by his humble and clean lifestyle. I would say this is a rarity in motorsports, especially of famous people who have achieved the pinnacle of success by a championship. I was both inspired and amused by the family’s virtue.
You don’t need to be a Hayden fan to appreciate the rewards and praiseworthiness of a well and decently lived life.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mylexicon @ Aug 20 2007, 02:33 PM) [snapback]86013[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Good article, I was they could have grabbed a better attention getting picture than him in the gravel trap----a wheelie perhaps.
...and a pretty nasty backhanded slap to a kid who is racing out of his mind.
Hi Lex, I have enjoyed reading your post and find much insight and refreshing truth in them. I think Mamola was saying in essence that Stoner is a great rider, and even one like Stoner couldn't have willed that hunk of crap Honda to a great result for the first half of the season. He could have used Rossi's name to make his point, but I fear that would have got him fired or shot. In other words, the effect of the machines has been so adverse, that even a mature and superbly talented rider like Stoner would have struggled with the Honda.
Anyway, great read. I wonder how many hits this thread will get from fans other than Hayden. And I wonder what will be the focus of their comments…. I for one took most of the article as an education/introduction of Hayden and the sport to the mass of unaware Americans to MotoGP.
Good article,thought it was interesting what Mamola said about Stoner.
What a great article. It’s a long read but totally worth it.
Povol, I think Mamola was saying more about the Honda than of Stoner. What he was saying was, even a great rider like Stoner wouldn't have had great results on the Honda this year. I agree.
I was delighted to read some of what goes on at home and his personal life. I was most impressed by his humble and clean lifestyle. I would say this is a rarity in motorsports, especially of famous people who have achieved the pinnacle of success by a championship. I was both inspired and amused by the family’s virtue.
You don’t need to be a Hayden fan to appreciate the rewards and praiseworthiness of a well and decently lived life.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mylexicon @ Aug 20 2007, 02:33 PM) [snapback]86013[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Good article, I was they could have grabbed a better attention getting picture than him in the gravel trap----a wheelie perhaps.
...and a pretty nasty backhanded slap to a kid who is racing out of his mind.
Hi Lex, I have enjoyed reading your post and find much insight and refreshing truth in them. I think Mamola was saying in essence that Stoner is a great rider, and even one like Stoner couldn't have willed that hunk of crap Honda to a great result for the first half of the season. He could have used Rossi's name to make his point, but I fear that would have got him fired or shot. In other words, the effect of the machines has been so adverse, that even a mature and superbly talented rider like Stoner would have struggled with the Honda.
Anyway, great read. I wonder how many hits this thread will get from fans other than Hayden. And I wonder what will be the focus of their comments…. I for one took most of the article as an education/introduction of Hayden and the sport to the mass of unaware Americans to MotoGP.
what full of american .....
remember hayden has had the BEST bike for the past 4 years. and when rossi swaped over to the inferior yamaha, hayden still got his ... whipped.
i can put it this way, even if nicky is on the BEST bike he wont win any races I guarantee you that.
he won 3 in 4 years, on the best bike.
nicky has single handedly brought honda to a level that honda would be ashamed of, from the heights of the doohan and rossi era.
remember hayden has had the BEST bike for the past 4 years. and when rossi swaped over to the inferior yamaha, hayden still got his ... whipped.
i can put it this way, even if nicky is on the BEST bike he wont win any races I guarantee you that.
he won 3 in 4 years, on the best bike.
nicky has single handedly brought honda to a level that honda would be ashamed of, from the heights of the doohan and rossi era.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Racejumkie @ Aug 21 2007, 01:54 AM) [snapback]86057[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
I have an idea to improve this forum. Lets start having an IQ minimum.^^^
Yeah, let's say 10 for starters!!!!
I have an idea to improve this forum. Lets start having an IQ minimum.^^^
Yeah, let's say 10 for starters!!!!
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinky @ Aug 20 2007, 05:10 PM) [snapback]86044[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
what full of american .....
remember hayden has had the BEST bike for the past 4 years. and when rossi swaped over to the inferior yamaha, hayden still got his ... whipped.
i can put it this way, even if nicky is on the BEST bike he wont win any races I guarantee you that.
he won 3 in 4 years, on the best bike.
nicky has single handedly brought honda to a level that honda would be ashamed of, from the heights of the doohan and rossi era.
a 6 page writeup in the NYT is pretty awesome. i'll ignore the obvious errors such as the comment that all riders have opted to drop launch control or that GLARING omission of Rainey and Schwantz when talking about American riders.
what you epic fail to understand is that nobody gives a crap about motoGP (or any motorcycle racing series) in the U.S. so, this is pretty huge to get that many words in a world-renowned newspaper article on our favorite series. such coverage is pretty much unheard of. it would be like if a newspaper in your country had a 6 page article on education or standards of grammar or critical thinking.
what full of american .....
remember hayden has had the BEST bike for the past 4 years. and when rossi swaped over to the inferior yamaha, hayden still got his ... whipped.
i can put it this way, even if nicky is on the BEST bike he wont win any races I guarantee you that.
he won 3 in 4 years, on the best bike.
nicky has single handedly brought honda to a level that honda would be ashamed of, from the heights of the doohan and rossi era.
a 6 page writeup in the NYT is pretty awesome. i'll ignore the obvious errors such as the comment that all riders have opted to drop launch control or that GLARING omission of Rainey and Schwantz when talking about American riders.
what you epic fail to understand is that nobody gives a crap about motoGP (or any motorcycle racing series) in the U.S. so, this is pretty huge to get that many words in a world-renowned newspaper article on our favorite series. such coverage is pretty much unheard of. it would be like if a newspaper in your country had a 6 page article on education or standards of grammar or critical thinking.
Good article, I agree Mamola is not the sort of person to out and out trash anyone. No one could have done much on that honda this year, not even Vale himself! The more I read about the Hayden's the more I respect what they have achieved and the more likeable they become.
And Pinky, that's one of the silliest comments I've yet to read. He won them a world championship last year - what do you want from the guy?
And Pinky, that's one of the silliest comments I've yet to read. He won them a world championship last year - what do you want from the guy?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinky @ Aug 21 2007, 12:10 AM) [snapback]86044[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
what full of american .....
remember hayden has had the BEST bike for the past 4 years. and when rossi swaped over to the inferior yamaha, hayden still got his ... whipped.
i can put it this way, even if nicky is on the BEST bike he wont win any races I guarantee you that.
he won 3 in 4 years, on the best bike.
nicky has single handedly brought honda to a level that honda would be ashamed of, from the heights of the doohan and rossi era.
Who says the Honda was the best bike last year? Given that Stoner was a second a lap faster than Capirossi at Brno, what do you have if you put him or somebody equivalent on last year's Ducati? Bayliss hopping straight off a plane and winning the last race would seem to support this.
I know it is a sign of the times in Australia, but what's with all the nationalistic rubbish? Most of the long tem posters on this site are true enthusiasts and quite willing to acknowledge the merits of your favourite riders(if they have any merits) as long as you don't gratuitously insult them and the riders they are fans of.
what full of american .....
remember hayden has had the BEST bike for the past 4 years. and when rossi swaped over to the inferior yamaha, hayden still got his ... whipped.
i can put it this way, even if nicky is on the BEST bike he wont win any races I guarantee you that.
he won 3 in 4 years, on the best bike.
nicky has single handedly brought honda to a level that honda would be ashamed of, from the heights of the doohan and rossi era.
Who says the Honda was the best bike last year? Given that Stoner was a second a lap faster than Capirossi at Brno, what do you have if you put him or somebody equivalent on last year's Ducati? Bayliss hopping straight off a plane and winning the last race would seem to support this.
I know it is a sign of the times in Australia, but what's with all the nationalistic rubbish? Most of the long tem posters on this site are true enthusiasts and quite willing to acknowledge the merits of your favourite riders(if they have any merits) as long as you don't gratuitously insult them and the riders they are fans of.
he had the best bike from 2003 to 2006. no doubt.
and only has won 3 races???
oh ok, he was "learning" the bike in 2003 and 2004.
2005 he was hondas main rider but couldnt do jack.
in 2006 when rossi had heaps of bad luck he won 2 races.
in 2007 he is again "learning" the bike. will take him another 4 years i suppose to get "used" to it.
if you have raw talent, you can switch bikes or jump up a class and be instantly fast. look no further than louis hamilton.
and only has won 3 races???
oh ok, he was "learning" the bike in 2003 and 2004.
2005 he was hondas main rider but couldnt do jack.
in 2006 when rossi had heaps of bad luck he won 2 races.
in 2007 he is again "learning" the bike. will take him another 4 years i suppose to get "used" to it.
if you have raw talent, you can switch bikes or jump up a class and be instantly fast. look no further than louis hamilton.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinky @ Aug 21 2007, 02:08 AM) [snapback]86074[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
if you have raw talent, you can switch bikes or jump up a class and be instantly fast. look no further than louis hamilton.
The whole point about lewis hamilton is that no-one has remotely approached what he has done in his first season, not fangio, not
senna,not schumacher.
Even doohan and to a lesser extent rossi took some time to adjust to
the premier class , and they are contenders for the best of all time.
In any case, you are arguing about whether hayden will contend for world championships or even win races in the future, not about whether he is the best of all time.
He is beating pedrosa, who is a proven racewinner, at the moment, is making the podium on a dodgy bike not built for him on dodgy tyres, and has a contract with HRC who will be very motivated next year so to say he has no chance of winning races in the future is frankly stupid.
if you have raw talent, you can switch bikes or jump up a class and be instantly fast. look no further than louis hamilton.
The whole point about lewis hamilton is that no-one has remotely approached what he has done in his first season, not fangio, not
senna,not schumacher.
Even doohan and to a lesser extent rossi took some time to adjust to
the premier class , and they are contenders for the best of all time.
In any case, you are arguing about whether hayden will contend for world championships or even win races in the future, not about whether he is the best of all time.
He is beating pedrosa, who is a proven racewinner, at the moment, is making the podium on a dodgy bike not built for him on dodgy tyres, and has a contract with HRC who will be very motivated next year so to say he has no chance of winning races in the future is frankly stupid.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(drumfu @ Aug 21 2007, 11:31 AM) [snapback]86066[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
a 6 page writeup in the NYT is pretty awesome. i'll ignore the obvious errors such as the comment that all riders have opted to drop launch control or that GLARING omission of Rainey and Schwantz when talking about American riders
Totally agree with this above!
For the record I have always thought highly of Hayden... wins or no wins. Randy Mamola was himself a great of the sport & never even won a champinship... although that Mono on the warm up lap will be forever etched in my mind!
And to quote the article, see below:
"His son Kenny Jr. was the last American before Hayden to win a title. That was in 2000, a year that is especially notable because it marked the end of the pre-Rossi era. Rossi arrived the next season after winning championships in both lower classes and went on to win five straight G.P. titles, an unprecedented feat that has made him one of the world's most popular and highest-paid athletes, at an estimated $30 million a year."
I find it interesting that a motorsport writer that has gone to the trouble of producing what in many ways is a very entertaining & informative article, manages to rewrite history again. Has the columnist ever heard of Micheal Doohan or Giacomi Agostini?
Unfortunately, MotoGP like many other truly international sports does miss out on coverage in the USA due to what ( and this is just an opinion, don't get me wrong you guys from the good 'ol US of A ) we "outsiders" see as a bit of a blinkered national sporting situation.
Now stick with me as I might seem to go a bit off topic...
Where the rest of the world basically competes in soccer (or football to the enthusiasts), cricket, rugby union, Formula 1 & so on... America tends to stick with the "national" sporting codes of American football, baseball, basketball & the IRL/Champcars and as such does not mix with the rest of us on a regular basis. For example, despite calling the national baseball finals the "World Series" it really isn't so... or there'd be teams from other nations included wouldn't there?
This is in no way an attack on American people, sports or sporting heroes, just maybe an insight as to why the American public hasn't taken to our favourite sport in a way that you might expect.
The US is fairly unique in the world in that it is a macrocosm of life & it's interesting to meet Americans from time to time to talk to them about it.
Whereas here in Australia, thanks to our TV programming, most of us could probably quote the majority of the names of the states in the US, the national capital & quite a number of their presidents. You'd be very lucky for the average US citizen to even be aware that Sydney is not actually the capital of Australia, let alone any other information. I would love to stand corrected on this though!
This is where I believe that the difference lies between the cultures, even ones as similar as Australia & the US!
Anyway that's my 2 cents worth so now I'll duck for cover & hope that I don't get shot down in flames!!
a 6 page writeup in the NYT is pretty awesome. i'll ignore the obvious errors such as the comment that all riders have opted to drop launch control or that GLARING omission of Rainey and Schwantz when talking about American riders
Totally agree with this above!
For the record I have always thought highly of Hayden... wins or no wins. Randy Mamola was himself a great of the sport & never even won a champinship... although that Mono on the warm up lap will be forever etched in my mind!
And to quote the article, see below:
"His son Kenny Jr. was the last American before Hayden to win a title. That was in 2000, a year that is especially notable because it marked the end of the pre-Rossi era. Rossi arrived the next season after winning championships in both lower classes and went on to win five straight G.P. titles, an unprecedented feat that has made him one of the world's most popular and highest-paid athletes, at an estimated $30 million a year."
I find it interesting that a motorsport writer that has gone to the trouble of producing what in many ways is a very entertaining & informative article, manages to rewrite history again. Has the columnist ever heard of Micheal Doohan or Giacomi Agostini?
Unfortunately, MotoGP like many other truly international sports does miss out on coverage in the USA due to what ( and this is just an opinion, don't get me wrong you guys from the good 'ol US of A ) we "outsiders" see as a bit of a blinkered national sporting situation.
Now stick with me as I might seem to go a bit off topic...
Where the rest of the world basically competes in soccer (or football to the enthusiasts), cricket, rugby union, Formula 1 & so on... America tends to stick with the "national" sporting codes of American football, baseball, basketball & the IRL/Champcars and as such does not mix with the rest of us on a regular basis. For example, despite calling the national baseball finals the "World Series" it really isn't so... or there'd be teams from other nations included wouldn't there?
This is in no way an attack on American people, sports or sporting heroes, just maybe an insight as to why the American public hasn't taken to our favourite sport in a way that you might expect.
The US is fairly unique in the world in that it is a macrocosm of life & it's interesting to meet Americans from time to time to talk to them about it.
Whereas here in Australia, thanks to our TV programming, most of us could probably quote the majority of the names of the states in the US, the national capital & quite a number of their presidents. You'd be very lucky for the average US citizen to even be aware that Sydney is not actually the capital of Australia, let alone any other information. I would love to stand corrected on this though!
This is where I believe that the difference lies between the cultures, even ones as similar as Australia & the US!
Anyway that's my 2 cents worth so now I'll duck for cover & hope that I don't get shot down in flames!!
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(michaelm @ Aug 21 2007, 12:51 PM) [snapback]86078[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
The whole point about lewis hamilton is that no-one has remotely approached what he has done in his first season, not fangio, not
senna,not schumacher.
Even doohan and to a lesser extent rossi took some time to adjust to
the premier class , and they are contenders for the best of all time.
In any case, you are arguing about whether hayden will contend for world championships or even win races in the future, not about whether he is the best of all time.
He is beating pedrosa, who is a proven racewinner, at the moment, is making the podium on a dodgy bike not built for him on dodgy tyres, and has a contract with HRC who will be very motivated next year so to say he has no chance of winning races in the future is frankly stupid.
The whole point about lewis hamilton is that no-one has remotely approached what he has done in his first season, not fangio, not
senna,not schumacher.
Even doohan and to a lesser extent rossi took some time to adjust to
the premier class , and they are contenders for the best of all time.
In any case, you are arguing about whether hayden will contend for world championships or even win races in the future, not about whether he is the best of all time.
He is beating pedrosa, who is a proven racewinner, at the moment, is making the podium on a dodgy bike not built for him on dodgy tyres, and has a contract with HRC who will be very motivated next year so to say he has no chance of winning races in the future is frankly stupid.
Joined Jul 2007
5K Posts | 1K+
unda cheese
I live in Miami which is the 3rd or 4th biggest media market in the country. This year Fox was going to broadcast the USGP live.
Instead they decided to pull the plug and pre empt it with the local news at 5.
If I didn't subscribe to MotoGp.com I would not have been able to see
the race.
So I would say that this defenitely is a big deal running that story in that newspaper.
Cool to see Honda let him keep the bike.
Hope they got good security because I'm on my way to Kentucky now.
Instead they decided to pull the plug and pre empt it with the local news at 5.
If I didn't subscribe to MotoGp.com I would not have been able to see
the race.
So I would say that this defenitely is a big deal running that story in that newspaper.
Cool to see Honda let him keep the bike.
Hope they got good security because I'm on my way to Kentucky now.
I am from Kentucky and it's cool that he likes to go home and recharge. I have not lived there for over 20 years but I love to go back there and hang out with old friends. I never sleep as good anywhere as I do there. I live in the busy high tech world and I like going back to the woods, hanging out on the river bank for a few days. Totally revitalizing.
The family's can be tight back there and that can be good and it can be a bad thing. Kentucky has the highest teen smoking rate in the USA. The place is absolutely eat up with Meth heads and Oxycodone has destroyed communities. It bums me out to read all the .... that goes on there and the backward way people think. The bumpking factor gets old as well. But the land is special, for many people, like me, It keeps calling you back.
Hayden doesn't even get much press in KY. The place has it's head up college basketball players ... so far they don't see anything but brown.
He may not have the raw talent as others and the "AW Shucks" is not for everybody but I just hope he hangs in there and keeps fighting competitively for a few more seasons. And every time he knocks the midget off the box I smile.
Old KY
The family's can be tight back there and that can be good and it can be a bad thing. Kentucky has the highest teen smoking rate in the USA. The place is absolutely eat up with Meth heads and Oxycodone has destroyed communities. It bums me out to read all the .... that goes on there and the backward way people think. The bumpking factor gets old as well. But the land is special, for many people, like me, It keeps calling you back.
Hayden doesn't even get much press in KY. The place has it's head up college basketball players ... so far they don't see anything but brown.
He may not have the raw talent as others and the "AW Shucks" is not for everybody but I just hope he hangs in there and keeps fighting competitively for a few more seasons. And every time he knocks the midget off the box I smile.
Old KY
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(muzzy57 @ Aug 20 2007, 06:57 PM) [snapback]86079[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Totally agree with this above!
For the record I have always thought highly of Hayden... wins or no wins. Randy Mamola was himself a great of the sport & never even won a champinship... although that Mono on the warm up lap will be forever etched in my mind!
And to quote the article, see below:
"His son Kenny Jr. was the last American before Hayden to win a title. That was in 2000, a year that is especially notable because it marked the end of the pre-Rossi era. Rossi arrived the next season after winning championships in both lower classes and went on to win five straight G.P. titles, an unprecedented feat that has made him one of the world's most popular and highest-paid athletes, at an estimated $30 million a year."
I find it interesting that a motorsport writer that has gone to the trouble of producing what in many ways is a very entertaining & informative article, manages to rewrite history again. Has the columnist ever heard of Micheal Doohan or Giacomi Agostini?
Unfortunately, MotoGP like many other truly international sports does miss out on coverage in the USA due to what ( and this is just an opinion, don't get me wrong you guys from the good 'ol US of A ) we "outsiders" see as a bit of a blinkered national sporting situation.
Now stick with me as I might seem to go a bit off topic...
Where the rest of the world basically competes in soccer (or football to the enthusiasts), cricket, rugby union, Formula 1 & so on... America tends to stick with the "national" sporting codes of American football, baseball, basketball & the IRL/Champcars and as such does not mix with the rest of us on a regular basis. For example, despite calling the national baseball finals the "World Series" it really isn't so... or there'd be teams from other nations included wouldn't there?
This is in no way an attack on American people, sports or sporting heroes, just maybe an insight as to why the American public hasn't taken to our favourite sport in a way that you might expect.
The US is fairly unique in the world in that it is a macrocosm of life & it's interesting to meet Americans from time to time to talk to them about it.
Whereas here in Australia, thanks to our TV programming, most of us could probably quote the majority of the names of the states in the US, the national capital & quite a number of their presidents. You'd be very lucky for the average US citizen to even be aware that Sydney is not actually the capital of Australia, let alone any other information. I would love to stand corrected on this though!
This is where I believe that the difference lies between the cultures, even ones as similar as Australia & the US!
Anyway that's my 2 cents worth so now I'll duck for cover & hope that I don't get shot down in flames!!
I also agree with you in another thread I said something same
"oh heres a good example when a winning nfl team wins the super bowl they are crowned world champions but america is the only real country that supports it.. how is that considered a world title"
I dont hate americans totally but I did not enjoy live in america for couples months (I had family there)
Again I enjoy read most americans message on here!
(hides too)
Totally agree with this above!
For the record I have always thought highly of Hayden... wins or no wins. Randy Mamola was himself a great of the sport & never even won a champinship... although that Mono on the warm up lap will be forever etched in my mind!
And to quote the article, see below:
"His son Kenny Jr. was the last American before Hayden to win a title. That was in 2000, a year that is especially notable because it marked the end of the pre-Rossi era. Rossi arrived the next season after winning championships in both lower classes and went on to win five straight G.P. titles, an unprecedented feat that has made him one of the world's most popular and highest-paid athletes, at an estimated $30 million a year."
I find it interesting that a motorsport writer that has gone to the trouble of producing what in many ways is a very entertaining & informative article, manages to rewrite history again. Has the columnist ever heard of Micheal Doohan or Giacomi Agostini?
Unfortunately, MotoGP like many other truly international sports does miss out on coverage in the USA due to what ( and this is just an opinion, don't get me wrong you guys from the good 'ol US of A ) we "outsiders" see as a bit of a blinkered national sporting situation.
Now stick with me as I might seem to go a bit off topic...
Where the rest of the world basically competes in soccer (or football to the enthusiasts), cricket, rugby union, Formula 1 & so on... America tends to stick with the "national" sporting codes of American football, baseball, basketball & the IRL/Champcars and as such does not mix with the rest of us on a regular basis. For example, despite calling the national baseball finals the "World Series" it really isn't so... or there'd be teams from other nations included wouldn't there?
This is in no way an attack on American people, sports or sporting heroes, just maybe an insight as to why the American public hasn't taken to our favourite sport in a way that you might expect.
The US is fairly unique in the world in that it is a macrocosm of life & it's interesting to meet Americans from time to time to talk to them about it.
Whereas here in Australia, thanks to our TV programming, most of us could probably quote the majority of the names of the states in the US, the national capital & quite a number of their presidents. You'd be very lucky for the average US citizen to even be aware that Sydney is not actually the capital of Australia, let alone any other information. I would love to stand corrected on this though!
This is where I believe that the difference lies between the cultures, even ones as similar as Australia & the US!
Anyway that's my 2 cents worth so now I'll duck for cover & hope that I don't get shot down in flames!!
I also agree with you in another thread I said something same
"oh heres a good example when a winning nfl team wins the super bowl they are crowned world champions but america is the only real country that supports it.. how is that considered a world title"
I dont hate americans totally but I did not enjoy live in america for couples months (I had family there)
Again I enjoy read most americans message on here!
(hides too)
Joined Mar 2005
7K Posts | 20+
Woody Creek
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinky @ Aug 21 2007, 12:10 AM) [snapback]86044[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
what full of american .....
remember hayden has had the BEST bike for the past 4 years. and when rossi swaped over to the inferior yamaha, hayden still got his ... whipped.
i can put it this way, even if nicky is on the BEST bike he wont win any races I guarantee you that.
he won 3 in 4 years, on the best bike.
nicky has single handedly brought honda to a level that honda would be ashamed of, from the heights of the doohan and rossi era.
You're absolutely right, the article is full of American bias. Then again, it is published in a magazine fronted by the New York Times. Weird.
How did Hayden bring Honda shame? Because he won them a world championship and then they built a bike, that appears to be, developed in a direction that does not suit Hayden's style? Or maybe it was when he was designated second to receive parts? It couldn't be the fact that HRC simply got it wrong and Hayden and Pete Benson are finally catching up now that they've equal parts, could it?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinky @ Aug 21 2007, 02:08 AM) [snapback]86074[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
he had the best bike from 2003 to 2006. no doubt.
and only has won 3 races???
oh ok, he was "learning" the bike in 2003 and 2004.
2005 he was hondas main rider but couldnt do jack.
in 2006 when rossi had heaps of bad luck he won 2 races.
in 2007 he is again "learning" the bike. will take him another 4 years i suppose to get "used" to it.
if you have raw talent, you can switch bikes or jump up a class and be instantly fast. look no further than louis hamilton.
Leading man in 2005? You're joking right? This was the year that HRC brought Biaggi to the Repsol team to spearhead development with Gibernau. I don't think Hayden was ever a lead rider aboard the 211V until he rode the 'evo' last year.
Hamilton is a great example of a tremendous talent driving for a manufacturer who has done their homework (not to mention copying others' homework). Please, leave F1 comparisons out. Comparing any F1 driver to a MotoGP rider is ridiculous.
Mamola's comment says it all really. Mamola has said publicly that he doesn't like Hayden so for him to say that Stoner couldn't achieve any better than what Hayden has done on the 212V is saying something.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(muzzy57 @ Aug 21 2007, 02:57 AM) [snapback]86079[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Totally agree with this above!
For the record I have always thought highly of Hayden... wins or no wins. Randy Mamola was himself a great of the sport & never even won a champinship... although that Mono on the warm up lap will be forever etched in my mind!
And to quote the article, see below:
"His son Kenny Jr. was the last American before Hayden to win a title. That was in 2000, a year that is especially notable because it marked the end of the pre-Rossi era. Rossi arrived the next season after winning championships in both lower classes and went on to win five straight G.P. titles, an unprecedented feat that has made him one of the world's most popular and highest-paid athletes, at an estimated $30 million a year."
I find it interesting that a motorsport writer that has gone to the trouble of producing what in many ways is a very entertaining & informative article, manages to rewrite history again. Has the columnist ever heard of Micheal Doohan or Giacomi Agostini?
Unfortunately, MotoGP like many other truly international sports does miss out on coverage in the USA due to what ( and this is just an opinion, don't get me wrong you guys from the good 'ol US of A ) we "outsiders" see as a bit of a blinkered national sporting situation.
Now stick with me as I might seem to go a bit off topic...
Where the rest of the world basically competes in soccer (or football to the enthusiasts), cricket, rugby union, Formula 1 & so on... America tends to stick with the "national" sporting codes of American football, baseball, basketball & the IRL/Champcars and as such does not mix with the rest of us on a regular basis. For example, despite calling the national baseball finals the "World Series" it really isn't so... or there'd be teams from other nations included wouldn't there?
This is in no way an attack on American people, sports or sporting heroes, just maybe an insight as to why the American public hasn't taken to our favourite sport in a way that you might expect.
The US is fairly unique in the world in that it is a macrocosm of life & it's interesting to meet Americans from time to time to talk to them about it.
Whereas here in Australia, thanks to our TV programming, most of us could probably quote the majority of the names of the states in the US, the national capital & quite a number of their presidents. You'd be very lucky for the average US citizen to even be aware that Sydney is not actually the capital of Australia, let alone any other information. I would love to stand corrected on this though!
This is where I believe that the difference lies between the cultures, even ones as similar as Australia & the US!
Anyway that's my 2 cents worth so now I'll duck for cover & hope that I don't get shot down in flames!!
I can't stand American sports media. I'm guilty of knowing very little about other country's politicians but then again, that's a subject that I avoid at all costs no matter the country.
I think a low point for me personally occurred this past July. ESPN's SportsCenter began a month-long segment entitled "Who's Now," a competition among athletes as to who is the biggest star in the world of sports based on viewer voting. Each athlete was seeded one through eight based on preliminary voting for who should be involved. There were no MotoGP riders, no F1 drivers and only two footballers, David Beckham and Ronaldinho. Beckham was a seven seed and lost in the first round, Ronaldinho was a six seed but suffered the same fate.
For a media medium whose tagline is "The Worldwide Leader in Sports," there was little to no competition from athletes outside the US. If this truly was a competition of who is the biggest star in the world of sports, there is no way the competition could have been held without the likes of Wayne Rooney, Cristiano Ronaldo, Didier Drogba, Kaka, Lionel Messi, Valentino Rossi, Michael Schumacher or Fernando Alonso. The never-ending snub of any sport not originated in or dominated by this country sickens me.
Sorry for the rant.
what full of american .....
remember hayden has had the BEST bike for the past 4 years. and when rossi swaped over to the inferior yamaha, hayden still got his ... whipped.
i can put it this way, even if nicky is on the BEST bike he wont win any races I guarantee you that.
he won 3 in 4 years, on the best bike.
nicky has single handedly brought honda to a level that honda would be ashamed of, from the heights of the doohan and rossi era.
You're absolutely right, the article is full of American bias. Then again, it is published in a magazine fronted by the New York Times. Weird.
How did Hayden bring Honda shame? Because he won them a world championship and then they built a bike, that appears to be, developed in a direction that does not suit Hayden's style? Or maybe it was when he was designated second to receive parts? It couldn't be the fact that HRC simply got it wrong and Hayden and Pete Benson are finally catching up now that they've equal parts, could it?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinky @ Aug 21 2007, 02:08 AM) [snapback]86074[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
he had the best bike from 2003 to 2006. no doubt.
and only has won 3 races???
oh ok, he was "learning" the bike in 2003 and 2004.
2005 he was hondas main rider but couldnt do jack.
in 2006 when rossi had heaps of bad luck he won 2 races.
in 2007 he is again "learning" the bike. will take him another 4 years i suppose to get "used" to it.
if you have raw talent, you can switch bikes or jump up a class and be instantly fast. look no further than louis hamilton.
Leading man in 2005? You're joking right? This was the year that HRC brought Biaggi to the Repsol team to spearhead development with Gibernau. I don't think Hayden was ever a lead rider aboard the 211V until he rode the 'evo' last year.
Hamilton is a great example of a tremendous talent driving for a manufacturer who has done their homework (not to mention copying others' homework). Please, leave F1 comparisons out. Comparing any F1 driver to a MotoGP rider is ridiculous.
Mamola's comment says it all really. Mamola has said publicly that he doesn't like Hayden so for him to say that Stoner couldn't achieve any better than what Hayden has done on the 212V is saying something.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(muzzy57 @ Aug 21 2007, 02:57 AM) [snapback]86079[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Totally agree with this above!
For the record I have always thought highly of Hayden... wins or no wins. Randy Mamola was himself a great of the sport & never even won a champinship... although that Mono on the warm up lap will be forever etched in my mind!
And to quote the article, see below:
"His son Kenny Jr. was the last American before Hayden to win a title. That was in 2000, a year that is especially notable because it marked the end of the pre-Rossi era. Rossi arrived the next season after winning championships in both lower classes and went on to win five straight G.P. titles, an unprecedented feat that has made him one of the world's most popular and highest-paid athletes, at an estimated $30 million a year."
I find it interesting that a motorsport writer that has gone to the trouble of producing what in many ways is a very entertaining & informative article, manages to rewrite history again. Has the columnist ever heard of Micheal Doohan or Giacomi Agostini?
Unfortunately, MotoGP like many other truly international sports does miss out on coverage in the USA due to what ( and this is just an opinion, don't get me wrong you guys from the good 'ol US of A ) we "outsiders" see as a bit of a blinkered national sporting situation.
Now stick with me as I might seem to go a bit off topic...
Where the rest of the world basically competes in soccer (or football to the enthusiasts), cricket, rugby union, Formula 1 & so on... America tends to stick with the "national" sporting codes of American football, baseball, basketball & the IRL/Champcars and as such does not mix with the rest of us on a regular basis. For example, despite calling the national baseball finals the "World Series" it really isn't so... or there'd be teams from other nations included wouldn't there?
This is in no way an attack on American people, sports or sporting heroes, just maybe an insight as to why the American public hasn't taken to our favourite sport in a way that you might expect.
The US is fairly unique in the world in that it is a macrocosm of life & it's interesting to meet Americans from time to time to talk to them about it.
Whereas here in Australia, thanks to our TV programming, most of us could probably quote the majority of the names of the states in the US, the national capital & quite a number of their presidents. You'd be very lucky for the average US citizen to even be aware that Sydney is not actually the capital of Australia, let alone any other information. I would love to stand corrected on this though!
This is where I believe that the difference lies between the cultures, even ones as similar as Australia & the US!
Anyway that's my 2 cents worth so now I'll duck for cover & hope that I don't get shot down in flames!!
I can't stand American sports media. I'm guilty of knowing very little about other country's politicians but then again, that's a subject that I avoid at all costs no matter the country.
I think a low point for me personally occurred this past July. ESPN's SportsCenter began a month-long segment entitled "Who's Now," a competition among athletes as to who is the biggest star in the world of sports based on viewer voting. Each athlete was seeded one through eight based on preliminary voting for who should be involved. There were no MotoGP riders, no F1 drivers and only two footballers, David Beckham and Ronaldinho. Beckham was a seven seed and lost in the first round, Ronaldinho was a six seed but suffered the same fate.
For a media medium whose tagline is "The Worldwide Leader in Sports," there was little to no competition from athletes outside the US. If this truly was a competition of who is the biggest star in the world of sports, there is no way the competition could have been held without the likes of Wayne Rooney, Cristiano Ronaldo, Didier Drogba, Kaka, Lionel Messi, Valentino Rossi, Michael Schumacher or Fernando Alonso. The never-ending snub of any sport not originated in or dominated by this country sickens me.
Sorry for the rant.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(muzzy57 @ Aug 20 2007, 07:57 PM) [snapback]86079[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
And to quote the article, see below:
"His son Kenny Jr. was the last American before Hayden to win a title. That was in 2000, a year that is especially notable because it marked the end of the pre-Rossi era. Rossi arrived the next season after winning championships in both lower classes and went on to win five straight G.P. titles, an unprecedented feat that has made him one of the world's most popular and highest-paid athletes, at an estimated $30 million a year."
I find it interesting that a motorsport writer that has gone to the trouble of producing what in many ways is a very entertaining & informative article, manages to rewrite history again. Has the columnist ever heard of Micheal Doohan or Giacomi Agostini?
Anyway that's my 2 cents worth so now I'll duck for cover & hope that I don't get shot down in flames!!
Why duck and cover? it wasn't like you said anything terrible. Unfortunately, writing about Nicky probably fell to someone to someone who didn't know MotoGP. "Unprecedented" is one of those great infotainment cliches Americans use pretty wrecklessly. However, it could be argued his five world titles are unprecedented; he is the only man to win on 2 different grand prix machines and for 2 different manufacturers.
I think the reason you know about our government and our way of life is because you have a vested interest in keeping an eye on us. We are the most powerful country with the largest government. While the machine is largely under control now (it's not a psuedo-......... dictatorial regime or a fundamental terroristic hotbed) it is not exactly ideal either, so we have an interest in keeping an eye on us too. Plus, many major media providers in english speaking countries are at least somewhat controlled by an American company so we get lots of press globally.
As far as our sports go, you have to keep in mind America is all about new. New world, new continent, new country, New York, New Jersey, new government, new music, new leaders, new houses, new cars, new ideas. When we showed up and began to prosper it was inevitable we would make new sports, too. And we are always developing new sports think about how big and global snowboarding and skating have become.
Australians know they have to keep Aussie rules football alive, we know we have to keep playing football, baseball, and basketball. We aren't avoiding global sports we just have too many cultural alternatives.
As far as the world titles are concerned, that's just what they called them for marketing reasons. We were the only country that played baseball so if you won in the MLB you were the best baseball team in the world. Don't read anything more into it than that.
And to quote the article, see below:
"His son Kenny Jr. was the last American before Hayden to win a title. That was in 2000, a year that is especially notable because it marked the end of the pre-Rossi era. Rossi arrived the next season after winning championships in both lower classes and went on to win five straight G.P. titles, an unprecedented feat that has made him one of the world's most popular and highest-paid athletes, at an estimated $30 million a year."
I find it interesting that a motorsport writer that has gone to the trouble of producing what in many ways is a very entertaining & informative article, manages to rewrite history again. Has the columnist ever heard of Micheal Doohan or Giacomi Agostini?
Anyway that's my 2 cents worth so now I'll duck for cover & hope that I don't get shot down in flames!!
Why duck and cover? it wasn't like you said anything terrible. Unfortunately, writing about Nicky probably fell to someone to someone who didn't know MotoGP. "Unprecedented" is one of those great infotainment cliches Americans use pretty wrecklessly. However, it could be argued his five world titles are unprecedented; he is the only man to win on 2 different grand prix machines and for 2 different manufacturers.
I think the reason you know about our government and our way of life is because you have a vested interest in keeping an eye on us. We are the most powerful country with the largest government. While the machine is largely under control now (it's not a psuedo-......... dictatorial regime or a fundamental terroristic hotbed) it is not exactly ideal either, so we have an interest in keeping an eye on us too. Plus, many major media providers in english speaking countries are at least somewhat controlled by an American company so we get lots of press globally.
As far as our sports go, you have to keep in mind America is all about new. New world, new continent, new country, New York, New Jersey, new government, new music, new leaders, new houses, new cars, new ideas. When we showed up and began to prosper it was inevitable we would make new sports, too. And we are always developing new sports think about how big and global snowboarding and skating have become.
Australians know they have to keep Aussie rules football alive, we know we have to keep playing football, baseball, and basketball. We aren't avoiding global sports we just have too many cultural alternatives.
As far as the world titles are concerned, that's just what they called them for marketing reasons. We were the only country that played baseball so if you won in the MLB you were the best baseball team in the world. Don't read anything more into it than that.
