Joined Oct 2006
3K Posts | 34+
Tar Heel State
fixed.
and in typical racer fashion, Spies, and Stoner....in the exact same damn spot!
Hayden's string of crashes would indicate he is trying damned hard - he isn't likely to be crashing through some rookie error, but because he is pushing past the bikes' limit.
He isn't someone I regularly root for, but there is no denying he is a team player and gives it everything he has in testing, qualifying and during the race.
I have known other, talented racers that have been in the same position. Great riders, great team-players, but the bike just isn't good enough to be in the top three.
I think people forget that the lap times between Lorenzo/Stoner/Pedrosa and Hayden are well under a second a lap in the race. That, for somewhere like Laguna, works out to around 5cm/lap. That means over 11 corners and straights, he is giving away less than a half a centimetre for each one. Less than 2/10 of an inch.
Perhaps when people consign riders to the 'crap' category they might want to remember that the margin between 'success' and 'failure' is the width of a paperback book.
The difference between the guys on the podium and the rest is down to precision, lap after lap, no mistakes, everything working right. A missed gear change can blow ten seconds off your lap time. A bobble in a corner by being forced out onto the marbles can be five seconds lost. A coming together between two riders can blow your rhythm for a sequence of corners bad enough to put you ten seconds back. A kamikaze move up the inside and a block pass can do the same.
At the speeds these guys are averaging, every second is 5-6cm.
He isn't someone I regularly root for, but there is no denying he is a team player and gives it everything he has in testing, qualifying and during the race.
I have known other, talented racers that have been in the same position. Great riders, great team-players, but the bike just isn't good enough to be in the top three.
I think people forget that the lap times between Lorenzo/Stoner/Pedrosa and Hayden are well under a second a lap in the race. That, for somewhere like Laguna, works out to around 5cm/lap. That means over 11 corners and straights, he is giving away less than a half a centimetre for each one. Less than 2/10 of an inch.
Perhaps when people consign riders to the 'crap' category they might want to remember that the margin between 'success' and 'failure' is the width of a paperback book.
The difference between the guys on the podium and the rest is down to precision, lap after lap, no mistakes, everything working right. A missed gear change can blow ten seconds off your lap time. A bobble in a corner by being forced out onto the marbles can be five seconds lost. A coming together between two riders can blow your rhythm for a sequence of corners bad enough to put you ten seconds back. A kamikaze move up the inside and a block pass can do the same.
At the speeds these guys are averaging, every second is 5-6cm.
Joined Sep 2006
3K Posts | 4+
Leading
Don't be getting comfortable now, I'm sure I will piss you off shortly.
I would like to see Hayden at another team - but I suspect his work ethic wouldn't allow him to give up on the project and the chance of another factory ride is slim.
Given what I just read in Furusawa's interview, it may be that the tide will turn for Ducati in the near future. I believe they have a solid basis for a race bike, but there is something not right in the way it is put together. Furusawa's doctrine regarding suspension harmonics - that has served Yamaha so well in the handling department - should be greedily taken aboard by Preziosi and worked - it seems that they have approached each technical problem as a discrete item and maybe Furusawa's approach is more homogenous.
Joined Sep 2006
3K Posts | 4+
Leading
Joined Sep 2006
3K Posts | 4+
Leading
I think they know what they have to do to change, it is just getting their ASAP that is the problem. Be nice if it was with Nicky.Don't be getting comfortable now, I'm sure I will piss you off shortly.
I would like to see Hayden at another team - but I suspect his work ethic wouldn't allow him to give up on the project and the chance of another factory ride is slim.
Given what I just read in Furusawa's interview, it may be that the tide will turn for Ducati in the near future. I believe they have a solid basis for a race bike, but there is something not right in the way it is put together. Furusawa's doctrine regarding suspension harmonics - that has served Yamaha so well in the handling department - should be greedily taken aboard by Preziosi and worked - it seems that they have approached each technical problem as a discrete item and maybe Furusawa's approach is more homogenous.
Joined Aug 2008
6K Posts | 748+
Thailand
For an engineer your maths seem to be a little loopy zoot....
Laguna is 3610 meters long. A very good lap is about 1 minute and 21 seconds (or 81 seconds), therefore:
3610meters = 81seconds or FOURTY FOUR POINT SIX meters per second not 5 - 6 cm. .... dude at your number over 81 seconds a motogp bike would travel 81 x 6 = 486 CENTIMETERS - less than half a meter!!
For as dude posting on multiple threads about all his engineering education, diplomas, certificates, team, track and riding experience you think you'd realise a mgp bike is a wee bit faster than your average snail WITHOUT having to do the math!
...., a turned on engineer such as yourself could have used the 2012 Laguna winners' 160kmph average single lap speed to calculate: 160kmph for 3610 meters equals 44.4 meters per second...
5 - 6 cm per second... Zoot that was just too freakin' funny after your "i'm an engineer" protestations!!!
Joined Jun 2007
10K Posts | 1K+
Norah Head
Joined Aug 2008
6K Posts | 748+
Thailand
Even if he was his maths are off...
Being a second behind at race pace means you are 44+ METERS behind not 2/10 of an inch. Half a second behind at race pace means 22+ METERS behind. Quarter second behind means 11+ meters behind... A tenth behind means 4+ meters... How does any of this relate to 5 -6 cm? Resident engineers - Barry, Zoot?
If indeed the Zoot was talking differential he is still wrong. Nicky finished 27 seconds behind Casey. It took him 44 minutes 12.763 seconds (or 2652.763 seconds) to complete 115,520 meters. That is 43.55 m/s or 1175.77 meters behind Casey. Or 36.74 meters per lap. Or 3.34 meters "per corner and straight"... not quite the differential of centimetres Zoot is talkin' about.
Mick D, I agree with the premise of your post except for this little bit. Seems you made the same mistake as Zoot. 486 cm is 4.86m.
Joined Aug 2008
6K Posts | 748+
Thailand
....!! And that's why I should never rant about maths!!! LOL! Five meters is still in snail range for 81 seconds though!
Joined Jun 2007
3K Posts | 309+
UK
I agree....and perhaps Nicky and Rossi had NO performance clauses in their contracts.....so half trying or trying 100% was irrelevant.....since they both have last and Ducati would want to keep them.....
I find it interesting that people say Rossi is half trying and yet is still performing (points wise and place in races) as well as Nicky who is rumoured to be trying 100=%....
So is half of Rossi as good as a all of Nicky?
Either way, Nicky and Rossi both get another year (or two) on a factory bike for performing worse than 4 satellite riders.....is it fair? NO doesnt matter if you are a Rossi or a Nicky fan, both benefit from politics......
Joined Oct 2008
6K Posts | 5K+
In Cider
No protestations. Merely a response to a call that I wasn't. And I have made a single, solitary reference to my qualifications, ever. Hardly your 'posting on multiple threads', but no doubt you are gleefully rubbing your hands waiting to find something else to rub my face in.
And yes, I was wrong. At an average of 161km/h, which is what they were doing at Laguna, they are covering 46.6M/sec, not the 46.6mm I calculated... some (many!) dropped decimal points there.
In my defence, I did have my wife whining in my earhole that 'we are going to be late' - I should have waited until I returned.
Thanks for the pick-up.
Joined Apr 2008
7K Posts | 3K+
Out of Nowhere
Sure about that?
[font=Helvetica Neue', Arial, Verdana, sans-serif][background=rgb(255, 255, 255)]
[/background][/font]
..as you know, this can be easily arranged
http://www.nd-center.com/
Nicky aint the best rider on the planet, but he pushes his bike to the limit - which is all anyone can ask, surely. However, an extra second (or a tad under) a lap may not sound much, but is a lot. 46 metres a lap is quite substantial. After 10 laps, that's 460 metres! After a race, that's over a kilometer. But at the speeds these guys travel, a kilometer really isn't much. So what's my point? Holy crap, I dont know! This thread is about Nicky being out for Brno, right? Yeah, I like Nicky. Sad he misses out this week.
Joined Oct 2008
6K Posts | 5K+
In Cider
