Engine upgrade vital for Yamaha, says Jerry Burgess

just copy and paste from MCN

and I think there has a point in JB say that Yamaha will lack of engine speed but still have a better chassis and corner turn on the other there have a Honda that right now it's look like have a better Bike and Ducati which we already know have a beast power and right now is under develop Burgress and Rossi



So Juat want to know what do you guy's think about it?



"Yamaha’s domination of the 800cc MotoGP era could end in 2011 unless major improvements are made to the performance of its factory YZR-M1 engine.



Valentino Rossi’s legendary crew chief Jerry Burgess reckons the Japanese factory will need to improve horsepower and acceleration to have a chance of winning the last 800cc crown in the face of stiff competition from Ducati and Honda.



Yamaha has claimed the title for three years in succession and dominated MotoGP with Rossi and new world champion Jorge Lorenzo since the beginning of 2008.



But towards the end of the 2010 campaign Lorenzo urged Yamaha make big improvements to its YZR-M1 engine, which was slower than rivals Ducati and Honda.



The Spaniard is also looking or better acceleration to improve rear grip next season after a golden 2010 saw him claim nine victories.



Burgess told MCN: “Jorge has said that if he doesn't get a faster bike it will be very difficult for him next year. The Honda has been working extremely well and so for the first time perhaps not having Valentino on song for the whole year is already starting to hurt the development of the Yamaha.



"The Ducati outright speed is only a couple of kilometres higher than the Yamaha but the acceleration is very good."



Burgess has moved to Ducati with Rossi, who quit Yamaha at the end of the season after winning the MotoGP crown four times for the Japanese factory."

As we all know, Rossi gave Yamaha that ultimatum to improve the M1 or he would leave. They did what he wanted.

Would Jorge have the same kind of clout?, Would Yamaha be prepared to go all out for the last 800cc season?

I presume they would want to try and retain their perfect record, but how far they would go by throwing money at the M1 is debatable.

In my opinion, they will do what they can to perform well through the season, but the main focus will be getting ready for 2012.

cygnus88 said:

Burgess told MCN: “Jorge has said that if he doesn't get a faster bike it will be very difficult for him next year. The Honda has been working extremely well and so for the first time perhaps not having Valentino on song for the whole year is already starting to hurt the development of the Yamaha.

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What a shame that a sore shoulder has such an impact on Rossi's ability to improve intricate race engine designs

SprogTheDog said:

As we all know, Rossi gave Yamaha that ultimatum to improve the M1 or he would leave. They did what he wanted.

Would Jorge have the same kind of clout?, Would Yamaha be prepared to go all out for the last 800cc season?

I presume they would want to try and retain their perfect record, but how far they would go by throwing money at the M1 is debatable.

In my opinion, they will do what they can to perform well through the season, but the main focus will be getting ready for 2012.

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I guess Rossi not ultimatum to improve M1 Or He leave , The reason rossi leave is because of JL. the last time I remember is end of 2007 when Rossi ultimatum to improve M1

right now I guess that Yamaha is stay on current engine because of 2012, but 1000cc will be just like 800cc because of electronic.

cygnus88 said:

I guess Rossi not ultimatum to improve M1 Or He leave , The reason rossi leave is because of JL. the last time I remember is end of 2007 when Rossi ultimatum to improve M1

right now I guess that Yamaha is stay on current engine because of 2012, but 1000cc will be just like 800cc because of electronic.

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That was the ultimatum I was referring to.

When is valentino ungagged? This sounds like mind games by proxy, although I guess he has got jerry involved in such things previously even when not gagged.

michaelm said:

When is valentino ungagged? This sounds like mind games by proxy, although I guess he has got jerry involved in such things previously even when not gagged.

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Yes. Looking forward to Rossi's own verdict of things to come.

SprogTheDog said:

Yes. Looking forward to Rossi's own verdict of things to come.

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Rossi gagged or unplugged - he never criticized Honda as a bike after he left them - just their people skills

Doesn't alter the fact that the M1 is the RossiYam.

My bet is there won't be a successful HoGaYam. - Just whining about lack of power/ speed from HoGay

The next 2 seasons will be a Honda - Ducati fight.

2012 wouldn't surprise me to see Spies on a Honda.

SprogTheDog said:

As we all know, Rossi gave Yamaha that ultimatum to improve the M1 or he would leave. They did what he wanted.

Would Jorge have the same kind of clout?, Would Yamaha be prepared to go all out for the last 800cc season?

I presume they would want to try and retain their perfect record, but how far they would go by throwing money at the M1 is debatable.

In my opinion, they will do what they can to perform well through the season, but the main focus will be getting ready for 2012.

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With all due respect Sprog, the ultimatum was Rossi or Lorenzo. They chose both, which was unacceptable for Rossi, so he left.



About Yamaha's commitment, well I think it would NOT have been different with or without Rossi. Why? Well lets take a look at their logic and vested interest, they wanted both riders, which means their commitment to the program was not questionable. So Rossi decides to abandon ship, how might this effect their commitment to the project? Unless I don't understand the dynamic, I thought Yamaha management were the shot callers. Wouldn't it serve them to continue their commitment, especially now that Rossi has gone?



Also, I take issue with Burgess saying Yamaha is screwed (indirectly) now that Rossi (and indirectly saying himself) is gone. This smacks a bit vindictive if not at very least mild spite. I'd even file it under mind game attempt. I've said this before, but my respect for Burgess as a person who I thought was beyond the ego dramas played out in GP were beyond him, but after his little digs at Stoner and his continued self-promotion of his abilities, is a bit smug to much.

Burgess told MCN: “... so for the first time perhaps not having Valentino on song for the whole year is already starting to hurt the development of the Yamaha.

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michaelm said:

When is valentino ungagged? This sounds like mind games by proxy, although I guess he has got jerry involved in such things previously even when not gagged.

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Its the exact thought I had.

I'm no engineer but this just has the stench of complete ......... No doubt some will claim it as further "evidence" of Rossi's "development abilities" though....

I think the power issue is probably correct regarding the Yamaha but I'm not reading much else into the rest of it.

off season mental salvos...mind games.

woody996 said:

I think the power issue is probably correct regarding the Yamaha but I'm not reading much else into the rest of it.

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Of course you're not "reading to much else", and why would you, it would require you to admit the man plays mind games. I guess its no coincidence that in his letter of departure to Yamaha, as part of the central theme he pointed out how he had practically single handedly, or as he put it, under his direction, had made the M1 great but now it would be ending with his departure. I think him saying this in what amounts to be a letter of resignation was to throw a little dart at Yamaha to link their success as tied to himself. And now, the dart via Burgess is to say, you see, I told you so, you should have got rid of Lorenzo instead.

Rossi and Co did make the yam what it is.. get over it Jesse Ventura

xx CURVE xx said:

Rossi and Co did make the yam what it is.. get over it Jesse Ventura

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Yes, I agree, but you missed the point, didn't you. Surely, even Jesse Ventura could have followed the logic sucka.



Btw, cute name, is this an upgrade from the Mr. Garison?

Jumkie said:

With all due respect Sprog, the ultimatum was Rossi or Lorenzo. They chose both, which was unacceptable for Rossi, so he left.



About Yamaha's commitment, well I think it would NOT have been different with or without Rossi. Why? Well lets take a look at their logic and vested interest, they wanted both riders, which means their commitment to the program was not questionable. So Rossi decides to abandon ship, how might this effect their commitment to the project? Unless I don't understand the dynamic, I thought Yamaha management were the shot callers. Wouldn't it serve them to continue their commitment, especially now that Rossi has gone?



Also, I take issue with Burgess saying Yamaha is screwed (indirectly) now that Rossi (and indirectly saying himself) is gone. This smacks a bit vindictive if not at very least mild spite. I'd even file it under mind game attempt. I've said this before, but my respect for Burgess as a person who I thought was beyond the ego dramas played out in GP were beyond him, but after his little digs at Stoner and his continued self-promotion of his abilities, is a bit smug to much.

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I hear ya Jum, but the ultimatum I was referring to was at the end of 2007 when Rossi threatened to leave Yamaha if they didnt give him a competitive package, not the whole Rossi / Lorenzo thing.





JB always struck me as a private sort of guy, never very forthcoming when asked questions in the pits or on the grid. Do you feel him making little digs, as you put it, is something new?, particularly since they all moved to Ducati?

SprogTheDog said:

I hear ya Jum, but the ultimatum I was referring to was at the end of 2007 when Rossi threatened to leave Yamaha if they didnt give him a competitive package, not the whole Rossi / Lorenzo thing.





JB always struck me as a private sort of guy, never very forthcoming when asked questions in the pits or on the grid. Do you feel him making little digs, as you put it, is something new?, particularly since they all moved to Ducati?

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Oops, yeah, I just read your clarification above.



Uhm, about Burgess, I guess I was like most everybody, and thought he was a no-nonsense kinda guy. That is until I heard him take a dig at Stoner saying he looked like he was already riding for Honda based on what he thought was Casey's unwillingness to push the Ducati (echoing Rossi who also questioned Stoner's commitment to ride the Ducati at 100%). I actually asked him to clarify this when I met him at Indy. He said, what's to clarify, he riders and just follows people around, specifically he mentioned he followed Rossi. I reminded him that Stoner had recently had some front end tucks and was probably pushing the limit already but didn't want to suffer a crash. I told him maybe he was giving all he could to just keep up with Vale, as oppose to being able to pass him on a bike that had very documented front end issues. He shook his head in disagreement and said, well, I see him riding behind Valentino and not even showing him a wheel, surely his Ducati has to be better than the Yamaha in some corners. I was actually annoyed with his answer, as it was incredible to me that he would take part in the ........ mindgames and publicly question Stoner's integrity.



I'd say he really did believe himself too since he said he would fix the Ducati in 80 seconds. Now we have a situation where the team is scrambling to fix that front end. When I see him again, I'm gonna remind him of our little conversation and ask him if he still thinks it was fair to question Stoner's willingness to push and try to pass Rossi on what was a .... front end.

michaelm said:

When is valentino ungagged?

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When Uccio decides to take his .... out of his mouth?

Jumkie said:

Oops, yeah, I just read your clarification above.



Uhm, about Burgess, I guess I was like most everybody, and thought he was a no-nonsense kinda guy. That is until I heard him take a dig at Stoner saying he looked like he was already riding for Honda based on what he thought was Casey's unwillingness to push the Ducati (echoing Rossi who also questioned Stoner's commitment to ride the Ducati at 100%). I actually asked him to clarify this when I met him at Indy. He said, what's to clarify, he riders and just follows people around, specifically he mentioned he followed Rossi. I reminded him that Stoner had recently had some front end tucks and was probably pushing the limit already but didn't want to suffer a crash. I told him maybe he was giving all he could to just keep up with Vale, as oppose to being able to pass him on a bike that had very documented front end issues. He shook his head in disagreement and said, well, I see him riding behind Valentino and not even showing him a wheel, surely his Ducati has to be better than the Yamaha in some corners. I was actually annoyed with his answer, as it was incredible to me that he would take part in the ........ mindgames and publicly question Stoner's integrity.



I'd say he really did believe himself too since he said he would fix the Ducati in 80 seconds. Now we have a situation where the team is scrambling to fix that front end. When I see him again, I'm gonna remind him of our little conversation and ask him if he still thinks it was fair to question Stoner's willingness to push and try to pass Rossi on what was a .... front end.

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Wow!

You have actually met and talked to Burgess about those things!

That's heavy stuff!

What he said to you was not what i thought he would.I thought he would be just a litte bit more respectful towards Stoner.Followed Rossi,bla,bla?Did you have an "I hate Valentino T-shirt on or something?



I would see it the same way you did probarbly.



But on the other hand,that Burgess said about fixing bad behaving bike in 80 sec. I got the imression he meant -I would fix Rossi's bike (The Yamaha) in 80 sec. if it was moving around that much.As he said it during the season.