ducati patents semi-monocoque motogp frame for roadbbikes

I think the idea is great to utilize the engine more than before. Aesthetically it is not there (yet) so how knows how this will accepted by us Duck heads.

The main problem I see from a consumer standpoint would have to be cost for engine work. From the diagram above it looks like the whole bike would need to be disassembled in order to go into the engine block.

The main problem for consumers is cost of insurance which will be the unobtainium. I'd love an 848 but I won't pay the 5g/yr cost no matter how good it is.

GSfan.. what? 5g/yr!!!
How old are you and how many tickets...

That is incredibly high..



I don't see how it will cost any more to get work done on the bike. Maintenance is high as it is on the Duke. I ride mine now only occasionally because of the expense. I don't see the engine being the majority of the frame cost any more or less.

I was looking around for insurance this year and a few sites have black listed every Ducati and they want surcharges that are 5 times more than what I am paying yearly and that is just the beginning. Then you have to pay the insurance. I've been riding for over 30 years and have a spotless record. I just love the 848 but the old SV is cheap....and so am I.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Duc999 @ Feb 23 2010, 05:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>GSfan.. what? 5g/yr!!!
How old are you and how many tickets...

That is incredibly high..



I don't see how it will cost any more to get work done on the bike. Maintenance is high as it is on the Duke. I ride mine now only occasionally because of the expense. I don't see the engine being the majority of the frame cost any more or less.
It looks to be quite trickie to remove a cylinder without taking off the head. I know they can make brace$ or design the cases to remove this problem, than again all that you and I have to go by is the photos above. That is what I'm basing my opinion on.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Feb 23 2010, 06:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The main problem for consumers is cost of insurance which will be the unobtainium. I'd love an 848 but I won't pay the 5g/yr cost no matter how good it is.
Your problem is living in ontario.

Slightly off topic:
Interesting to see how long the swingarm has become. More or less half the wheel base are now swingarm and you could fit two rims inside the length of that arm.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mattsteg @ Feb 24 2010, 08:07 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Your problem is living in ontario.

Good and bad. Better than Quebec where you can not even change your exhaust (legally). Not a bad place all around really. One day I will buy an 848 and maybe just do track days or something.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Feb 24 2010, 12:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Good and bad. Better than Quebec where you can not even change your exhaust (legally). Not a bad place all around really. One day I will buy an 848 and maybe just do track days or something.
Yeah, I was going to say Canada but all of the canadian motorcyclists I know are from Ontario so I didn't have any other points of comparison. I agree it's a nice enough place (as much as a province that large is a "place") but you get killed on bike insurance prices.

A new 848 with full comprehensive/collision and a $500 deductible is a bit less than 2k to insure here. If you're in a position where you can take on monetary risks covered by comprehensive/collision you can be on the road for around a hundred bucks a year. There's no doubt you pay a heavy premium to cover a Duc against damage, theft, etc., and Canadian dates just make that worse.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Traverser @ Feb 24 2010, 08:26 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Aesthetically it is not there (yet) so how knows how this will accepted by us Duck heads.

Got to say, 3/4 the appeal of Duc. to meis the "ole" Trelis frame. I kinda wonder how they will replace just that look. Cos. Duc's have always shown an evoloution even an incorporation of "retro style" to some extent.

And then there's "the feel of Steel" they will have to hope future customers want to part with

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mattsteg @ Feb 24 2010, 09:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Yeah, I was going to say Canada but all of the canadian motorcyclists I know are from Ontario so I didn't have any other points of comparison. I agree it's a nice enough place (as much as a province that large is a "place") but you get killed on bike insurance prices.

A new 848 with full comprehensive/collision and a $500 deductible is a bit less than 2k to insure here. If you're in a position where you can take on monetary risks covered by comprehensive/collision you can be on the road for around a hundred bucks a year. There's no doubt you pay a heavy premium to cover a Duc against damage, theft, etc., and Canadian dates just make that worse.

Insurance is expensive here because of people screwing insurance companies and living off benefits which they don't really need. It's just some kind of a windfall to them. So every year the comp goes up and people just don't make the connection. Money grows on trees don't ya know. I was paying $1100 yr no collision but had fire and theft last year. I looked around and got a quote for mid 600's w/o collision but then again I'm not insuring a Ducati. For a while there we had a "law" where if you got caught >50kms over the limit it was instant $10,000 fine and license suspension. The cops were cashing in big-time. Insurance .... soon followed. It has been overturned now and don't get me wrong 50 over is a bit fast for the road but everyone does it now and again. Since it got beat in court they are just back to lurking around any dark place they can with their g-damn lazers. Track days seem to be the only option for a good time since I refuse to ride a cruiser.

The province is huge but no one lives in 95% of it and there are no roads so really it is a kind of medium size place. A few big cities and lots of wide open spaces. I'm kind of used to it.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 24 2010, 09:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Got to say, 3/4 the appeal of Duc. to meis the "ole" Trelis frame. I kinda wonder how they will replace just that look. Cos. Duc's have always shown an evoloution even an incorporation of "retro style" to some extent.

And then there's "the feel of Steel" they will have to hope future customers want to part with

Surely they will keep the trellis for the monster, right? What would a naked carbon bike look like?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mr. Shupe @ Feb 26 2010, 09:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Surely they will keep the trellis for the monster, right? What would a naked carbon bike look like?

Well it will be hard to tell the difference when they go plastic frame:

Gp bike as a picture of Hayden, here on Stoners bike



and Stoner on the plastic framed Monster:



not my cup of tea at all


Actually yeah I don't see it happening for the nakeds.

The angle of the first pic almost makes it look like the little tike is "backing it in."

Could well be a subscriber of "kids skids" style bacling it in ( Arab and co.'s using the back brake style ). ButI strongly suspect he's not using a lot of power to back it in.



Still have a good laugh over Arab's, backing it in recipe.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 28 2010, 12:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Could well be a subscriber of "kids skids" style bacling it in ( Arab and co.'s using the back brake style ). ButI strongly suspect he's not using a lot of power to back it in.



Still have a good laugh over Arab's, backing it in recipe.
And this entire forums still having a good laugh at your gyroscope dementia from last year

Check out the supermoto thread in the petrolhead zone to see what the general opinion is about you Berry ya .....

Surely the main appeal of a Duc Berry, is the fact that even on something as gutless as a 749s, you can shut the throttle and their bikes magically slide into corners all by themselves you senile old fool.

Now stfu and ask the nursing staff if you can change the channel and watch your home round of WSBk, and afterwards maybe try and post a cogent thought for once. Either that, or take your medication, try not to piss yourself, have a nap, fantasize some more, and look forward to visiting time. Bunyip and the rest of the family will be along soon (while there's still something left of the inheritance that is - residential care isn't cheap these days).

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Arrabbiata1 @ Feb 28 2010, 11:37 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>And this entire forums still having a good laugh at your gyroscope dementia from last year

Let me guess, you thnk you can use gyro's to find a position on track too !!

Now why do I not think thats surprising


You can't use gyros to find your position on a track ...... there I'll say it again. Nobody has cured the drift problem with gyros even today. I fyou think they have post the "magic story" showing so.

Put your name to it all those "forum folk" that believe otherwise. We can have it on record once and for all.

Sadly known physics facts have aready disproved "Babels Gyro theories" many years ago.


Your "kids skids" theory is out there, so I need say no more. And like the "gyro theory" it is a laugh a minute

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 28 2010, 03:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Let me guess, you thnk you can use gyro's to find a position on track too !!

Now why do I not think thats surprising


You can't use gyros to find your position on a track ...... there I'll say it again. Nobody has cured the drift problem with gyros even today. I fyou think they have post the "magic story" showing so.

Put your name to it all those "forum folk" that believe otherwise. We can have it on record once and for all.

Sadly known physics facts have aready disproved "Babels Gyro theories" many years ago.


Your "kids skids" theory is out there, so I need say no more. And like the "gyro theory" it is a laugh a minute
I wasn't frequenting this site during the gyro conversation, but...

Yes, gyro's drift. Over time and, in Real-time.

I work in the aerospace industry and have written software for Secondary Fight Displays amongst other things. SFDs include an Artificial Horizon Indicator.

SFDs have 3 gyros and an accelerometer. At start-up an SFD screen shows a count down, eg for 60 seconds. This is so that the gyros/acc can be calibrated. Any movement of the aircraft or an inclination of greater than a few degrees will cause the countdown to reset. Once the calibration is complete, compensation data has been calculated for all 3 axes and the accelerometer. The software then uses this data in its algorithms, resolving any long term drift issues.

The system also includes two tilt sensors - horizontal and vertical. These are accurate within +/- 60 degrees dependent on the accelerations they are experiencing. The system resolves real-time drift in the gyros using the tilts together with the accelerometer and corrects towards "reality" (the tilts) whenever appropriate (ie when not under large accelerations). The software for the system is far from trivial, but definitely feasible for MotoGP.

Using such a system, together with an electronic odometer which is reset every time the bike crosses the finish line, will provide you with sufficiently accurate information to determine which corner you are in. This would allow engine maps per corner, a la GPS.

The "Magic Story" : Properly designed software can often be used to correct weaknesses in hardware.

Hallelujah!!! Yamaka, mon ami, where were you last April? You could have saved me gigabytes of wasted time and effort trying to explain this to BM (see here: http://www.powerslide.net/forum/index.php?...t&p=183578). Apparently BM was/is of the opinion that drift cannot be corrected for and as such has never been, and can never be used for location... even in a closed race circuit which should be simpler than your application.