AMA Heartland Park race thread

[Mr. Shupe]

The voices in the booth alluded to the safety concerns of the weekend; Russell frequently touched on the quality of the track surface. Many bikes seemed to twitch and buck, an indicator of a poor racing surface? Also, Sheheen pointed out a portion of the track surface that was painted, indicating a "hole" in the racing surface.

Josh Hayes and Roger Edmondson spoke kind words about Mladin as part of discussions surrounding his impending retirement. After that, however, the shot changed to Larry Pegram on the grid. Greg White asked Pegram for his opinion on Mat's retirement. Pegram answered by saying he had lost respect for the Yoshimura racer, claiming Mat cursed at him and threatened to punch him in the nose, angry over the support Larry expressed for the Heartland Park venue.

Cheap shot by DMG? Or should riders be exposed for issuing threats of violence, just as DMG has been accused of attempting to quell dissent among riders?

Good effort from Pegram to dominate race 1. Interestingly, after being held up by lappers on more than one occassion, Larry did not blame the slower riders, stating that he never saw any blue flags.

Congrats to Eslick for his charge from 10th to 1st; the Buell racer now has an 18 point lead over Martin Cardenas, who battled hard with Eslick and crashed with three laps to go.

The racing in DSB was excellent, particularly among the 600s. As for the battle for 1st, I don't know what to think of it. Eslick passed both Graves bikes in one trip down the front strait. The overall lap times were close, as Cardenas was able to climb from 4th to 2nd and reel in Eslick, who at one point had a one-second lead. Martin got into the lead at one point, but was re-passed by the Buell on the front strait with seemingly little effort.

Did I see the best rider win? If not, was it down to the team? Did RMR draw inspiration from its recent loss and give their rider the best bike? Was the manufacturer the deciding factor? Did Erik Buell build the best bike for the circuit and conditions? Or, finally, was it the rulebook?

If DMG plans to take AMA Road Racing to new heights of prosperity, fans need to be able to take the racing at face value. What I just saw was without question a great race; however, I don't feel good about it.

 

[Mr. Shupe]

I think White's question to Pegram was clearly bait, an effort to get something on TV. IIRC, Pegram's first response, before telling the story, was "didn't I tell you?"

 

[mylexicon]

Pegram was on another planet today at Heartland. The race wasn't even close. He had the bike dialed in and the extra 200cc gave him a big advantage in the slower corners. He rode brilliantly as well.

DSB was an interesting race. I don't know whether to be gutted for Martin or whether to laugh. I've never really cared for his reckless style (prior to HPT, Cardenas was the safety problem in the AMA) but watching him self destruct as Buell hit their stride is pretty sad. Buell have left their braking issues behind and it is getting increasingly more difficult for the 600s to compete. Personally, I think Buell need another 5lbs put on the bike, but then I don't know if we can change the rules without people losing their minds.

I also heard Larry's remarks about Mat, and I'm not surprised. I've always found Mladin's remarks about DMGs Gestapo tactics to be somewhat hypocritical (even though I agreed) b/c it has been obvious for some time that he uses intimidation tactics against other AMA riders.

One of Pegram's first remarks after his win at Road America was about what Mladin was going to say. It was something like "Mat will probably say my bike was faster than his, and it was, but his bike didn't look to be running that good today". When Pegram goes out of his way to preempt Mladin's vociferous reaction to the race, it becomes clear that Mladin's toxic rants are considered to be a threat by riders within the paddock.

Obviously, Mladin has a brain (unlike many racers) so I think a lot of his tyrannical behavior is somewhat calculated, but I still think people are just as afraid of his bipolar behavior as they are of DMG's vindictive behavior. I think it's obvious that Mladin has a good side when he's not in racing mode, but when he goes into racing mode, he becomes a flaming ........ He a true jekyll and hyde in my opinion.

 

[povol]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mr. Shupe @ Aug 2 2009, 01:12 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The voices in the booth alluded to the safety concerns of the weekend; Russell frequently touched on the quality of the track surface. Many bikes seemed to twitch and buck, an indicator of a poor racing surface? Also, Sheheen pointed out a portion of the track surface that was painted, indicating a "hole" in the racing surface.

Josh Hayes and Roger Edmondson spoke kind words about Mladin as part of discussions surrounding his impending retirement. After that, however, the shot changed to Larry Pegram on the grid. Greg White asked Pegram for his opinion on Mat's retirement. Pegram answered by saying he had lost respect for the Yoshimura racer, claiming Mat cursed at him and threatened to punch him in the nose, angry over the support Larry expressed for the Heartland Park venue.

Cheap shot by DMG? Or should riders be exposed for issuing threats of violence, just as DMG has been accused of attempting to quell dissent among riders?

Good effort from Pegram to dominate race 1. Interestingly, after being held up by lappers on more than one occassion, Larry did not blame the slower riders, stating that he never saw any blue flags.

Congrats to Eslick for his charge from 10th to 1st; the Buell racer now has an 18 point lead over Martin Cardenas, who battled hard with Eslick and crashed with three laps to go.

The racing in DSB was excellent, particularly among the 600s. As for the battle for 1st, I don't know what to think of it. Eslick passed both Graves bikes in one trip down the front strait. The overall lap times were close, as Cardenas was able to climb from 4th to 2nd and reel in Eslick, who at one point had a one-second lead. Martin got into the lead at one point, but was re-passed by the Buell on the front strait with seemingly little effort.

Did I see the best rider win? If not, was it down to the team? Did RMR draw inspiration from its recent loss and give their rider the best bike? Was the manufacturer the deciding factor? Did Erik Buell build the best bike for the circuit and conditions? Or, finally, was it the rulebook?

If DMG plans to take AMA Road Racing to new heights of prosperity, fans need to be able to take the racing at face value. What I just saw was without question a great race; however, I don't feel good about it.
What you saw is why a couple of hunderd fans were at the track. A bike with a CLEAR performance advantge made possible by the sanctioning bodies manipulation of the rules. I have been around racing for a long time and i know sandbagging when i see it and im seeing it in maybe it most purest form. I find it really hard to believe that Eslick gets so excited after winning a race when he knows he is riding a ringer.He should be embarrassed, as should Buell. And that track,jeez,whats next Hallet,Talladega,an old airport with cones,shopping mall parking lots. I think im going to go outside and see if i cant find some 12 year olds to beat the .... out of on the basketball court so i can feel like i am king. Im 6'5" and 250 lbs but im old so it should be fair since they are young and nimble right!

 

[mylexicon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Aug 2 2009, 09:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>What you saw is why a couple of hunderd fans were at the track. A bike with a CLEAR performance advantge made possible by the sanctioning bodies manipulation of the rules. I have been around racing for a long time and i know sandbagging when i see it and im seeing it in maybe it most purest form. I find it really hard to believe that Eslick gets so excited after winning a race when he knows he is riding a ringer.He should be embarrassed, as should Buell. And that track,jeez,whats next Hallet,Talladega,an old airport with cones,shopping mall parking lots. I think im going to go outside and see if i cant find some 12 year olds to beat the .... out of on the basketball court so i can feel like i am king. Im 6'5" and 250 lbs but im old so it should be fair since they are young and nimble right!

What are you talking about. The Buell had an unfair advantage and then DMG dynoed the bikes and added weight. According to the rule book the weight for twins is 385lbs. According to our estimates the Buell was already over the weight limit, but DMG obviously added weight anyway and Eslick suddenly got a lot slower.

By all reports the Buell didn't have enough stopping power with the ZTL system and the extra ballast so DMG allowed them to homologate better brakes (I don't know if it was calipers or just the new Buell racing pads) for Mid Ohio. The new brakes have given Buell a bit of an edge over the field.

Buell are not sandbagging. Cardenas closed Eslick down without any problems at all. Getting around Danny proved to be difficult, but Cardenas probably would have won race 1 if he had managed to stay upright.

In other news, Eslick was penalized ten championship points for passing under yellow and he's going to be fined for rules/safety violations. Maybe he should have been DQ'ed like they did to the other riders, but then Hacking should have been suspended for using profanity in a press area. Of course, Bostrom just swore at JRP on the record in a press conference and he's not getting fined. DMG have either lost control (what people wanted) or they have decided they've got bigger fish to fry these days.

In even more other news, Herrin survived a run off into the ditch. He's fine, he even rejoined the race to score second place.

There was also another unsafe incident when a rider crashed in the final turn and no one obeyed the red flags. The more things change, the more they stay the same. This reminds me of the old AMA all over again. On a long enough time table, everything in the AMA trends towards anarchy no matter who is in charge. I laugh whenever I hear people slag DMG b/c this looks EXACTLY like the old AMA but with a few new bikes and better racing. Just another discombobulated season with very little funding for the AMA

 

[Mr. Shupe]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Aug 2 2009, 03:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Buell are not sandbagging. Cardenas closed Eslick down without any problems at all. Getting around Danny proved to be difficult, but Cardenas probably would have won race 1 if he had managed to stay upright.

"Probably" might be overrating Martin's chances. He would have had to pass Eslick, stay in front of him on the front strait, then pull out a healthy gap to mitigate the damage Eslick does on the front straitaway.

I too noticed JRP getting beat up in the press conference, there were words about him at Mid Ohio too. Sounds like Luddington didn't exactly .... all over a saint.

Did anybody else notice, in DSB race 1, the guy with the broom on the inside of the final turn?

 

[DaddiiKong]

What was the swearing at the press conference?

 

[povol]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Aug 2 2009, 05:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>What are you talking about. The Buell had an unfair advantage and then DMG dynoed the bikes and added weight. According to the rule book the weight for twins is 385lbs. According to our estimates the Buell was already over the weight limit, but DMG obviously added weight anyway and Eslick suddenly got a lot slower.

By all reports the Buell didn't have enough stopping power with the ZTL system and the extra ballast so DMG allowed them to homologate better brakes (I don't know if it was calipers or just the new Buell racing pads) for Mid Ohio. The new brakes have given Buell a bit of an edge over the field.

Buell are not sandbagging. Cardenas closed Eslick down without any problems at all. Getting around Danny proved to be difficult, but Cardenas probably would have won race 1 if he had managed to stay upright.

In other news, Eslick was penalized ten championship points for passing under yellow and he's going to be fined for rules/safety violations. Maybe he should have been DQ'ed like they did to the other riders, but then Hacking should have been suspended for using profanity in a press area. Of course, Bostrom just swore at JRP on the record in a press conference and he's not getting fined. DMG have either lost control (what people wanted) or they have decided they've got bigger fish to fry these days.

In even more other news, Herrin survived a run off into the ditch. He's fine, he even rejoined the race to score second place.

There was also another unsafe incident when a rider crashed in the final turn and no one obeyed the red flags. The more things change, the more they stay the same. This reminds me of the old AMA all over again. On a long enough time table, everything in the AMA trends towards anarchy no matter who is in charge. I laugh whenever I hear people slag DMG b/c this looks EXACTLY like the old AMA but with a few new bikes and better racing. Just another discombobulated season with very little funding for the AMA

Even the other riders say he is sandbagging,its is called Danbagging in the pits.Even after qualifying 10th, Cardenas said in an interview that he expected Danny to come straight to the front,which he did,picking off sometimes 2 bikes at a time in the straights. The Buell had a 2.65 pound per hp compared to the best 600 at 2.94 pounds per hp. at the Barber Dyno If that wasnt bad enough,it had 40 more ft lbs of torque,which is never brought up for some reason. Also your timelines are screwed up i think, and the weight itself is 380lbs. The weights were changed in April and the Dyno was in May, it didnt matter though since the 600 couldnt get to the lowered weight with the parts on the list and Buell was never under 380 so it stayed the same.What kills me is the fact that after seeing the dyno results with their own eyes,not one change has been made.

 

[Mr. Shupe]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Cankles @ Aug 2 2009, 06:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>What was the swearing at the press conference?

Ben Bostrom called JRP a name. My guess is "......." or the popular variant "....... ........"

http://www.onthethrottle.com/content/view/266/1/

BTW, real smart ... stuff from Young.

 

[mylexicon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Aug 2 2009, 03:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Even the other riders say he is sandbagging,its is called Danbagging in the pits.Even after qualifying 10th, Cardenas said in an interview that he expected Danny to come straight to the front,which he did,picking off sometimes 2 bikes at a time in the straights. The Buell had a 2.65 pound per hp compared to the best 600 at 2.94 pounds per hp. at the Barber Dyno If that wasnt bad enough,it had 40 more ft lbs of torque,which is never brought up for some reason. Also your timelines are screwed up i think, and the weight itself is 380lbs. The weights were changed in April and the Dyno was in May, it didnt matter though since the 600 couldnt get to the lowered weight with the parts on the list and Buell was never under 380 so it stayed the same.What kills me is the fact that after seeing the dyno results with their own eyes,not one change has been made.

You're right. The weight was added about 1 month before the dyno testing and Buell were still substantially above and beyond the rest. In any event, the parity concept was upheld when DMG slowed the Buell down. I'm inclined to believe they definitely added weight not only because the Buell got slower but also b/c they started having braking problems.

I don't think "Danbagging" is a strategy, I think it is in Eslick's nature to horse around and miss his lines. In the race, he's all over the place but he uses the torque to make up for his mistakes and he uses the raw power to pass people down the straight and stop them from breaking away. In qualifying and practice he can't interfere with people's lines so he often ends up in the mid pack somewhere. It's not often that Danny can get in front and run away with it. He's easily caught from behind by the 600 riders who have a clear track. The Buell has no advantage until the riders start battling with one another--that's when the Buell's power appears to be most "unfair".

The 1125R has caused a majority of the problems between fans and DMG. The 1125R really isn't that controversial. It has been demonstrably faster than everything on the grid just one time (Fontana Race 1). Hacking blew up in race 1 at Mid Ohio and Cardenas crashed in race 1 at Topeka. If Cardenas hadn't crashed so many times, he would be walking off with the winners trophy. Unfortunately, he's had 3 crashes in the last 5 races and he now finds himself tied with Eslick.


With some luck, DMG will throw the Buell out of DSB next year now that they have the 1125RR to race in SBK.

 

[povol]

[quote name='mylexicon' post='203244' date='Aug 2 2009, 09:35 PM']You're right. The weight was added about 1 month before the dyno testing and Buell were still substantially above and beyond the rest. In any event, the parity concept was upheld when DMG slowed the Buell down. I'm inclined to believe they definitely added weight not only because the Buell got slower but also b/c they started having braking problems.

I don't think "Danbagging" is a strategy, I think it is in Eslick's nature to horse around and miss his lines. In the race, he's all over the place but he uses the torque to make up for his mistakes and he uses the raw power to pass people down the straight and stop them from breaking away. In qualifying and practice he can't interfere with people's lines so he often ends up in the mid pack somewhere. It's not often that Danny can get in front and run away with it. He's easily caught from behind by the 600 riders who have a clear track. The Buell has no advantage until the riders start battling with one another--that's when the Buell's power appears to be most "unfair".

The 1125R has caused a majority of the problems between fans and DMG. The 1125R really isn't that controversial. It has been demonstrably faster than everything on the grid just one time (Fontana Race 1). Hacking blew up in race 1 at Mid Ohio and Cardenas crashed in race 1 at Topeka. If Cardenas hadn't crashed so many times, he would be walking off with the winners trophy. Unfortunately, he's had 3 crashes in the last 5 races and he now finds himself tied with Eslick.


With some luck, DMG will throw the Buell out of DSB next year now that they have the 1125RR to race in SBK.[/quote

Once Danny is in front,it is extremely hard for the 600's to repass him unless he makes a mistake like he did today. He can virtually run any pace he wants within reason and basically park the Buell in a corner,guard the line and run away on the exit of the turn. The 600 guys are crashing all over the place because they are riding over their head trying unorthodox manuevers to make up for their lack of performance. The overwhelming performance advantage of the Buell has actually created a safety problem. If a 600 is leading.they have to try and break away in the corners because they know what is coming in the straights.If it wasnt for the radiator falling off in Daytona and rain at Road America and a red flag at Atlanta,those are races i fell certain he would have won also. The other riders are biting their lips to keep from saying what they want about the Buell out of fear.From what im hearing,its about to boil over.One more thing,you dont think the bike has a performance advantage when a rider,in your words, can horse around,miss his lines and just use the massive torque advantage and raw horsepower to make up for his mistakes.And then the next thing out of your mouth is the Buell really isnt that controversial.Are you scyzophrenic or do you play both sides of an argument so you will never be wrong

 

[mylexicon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Aug 2 2009, 06:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Once Danny is in front,it is extremely hard for the 600's to repass him unless he makes a mistake like he did today. He can virtually run any pace he wants within reason and basically park the Buell in a corner,guard the line and run away on the exit of the turn. The 600 guys are crashing all over the place because they are riding over their head trying unorthodox manuevers to make up for their lack of performance. The overwhelming performance advantage of the Buell has actually created a safety problem. If a 600 is leading.they have to try and break away in the corners because they know what is coming in the straights.If it wasnt for the radiator falling off in Daytona and rain at Road America and a red flag at Atlanta,those are races i fell certain he would have won also. The other riders are biting their lips to keep from saying what they want about the Buell out of fear.From what im hearing,its about to boil over.One more thing,you dont think the bike has a performance advantage when a rider,in your words, can horse around,miss his lines and just use the massive torque advantage and raw horsepower to make up for his mistakes.And then the next thing out of your mouth is the Buell really isnt that controversial.Are you scyzophrenic or do you play both sides of an argument so you will never be wrong

The Buell is not faster than the 600s in terms of lap times, that's my point. The bike wins b/c one kid from Oklahoma is willing to override the bike in order to get in front of the pack and block/barge his way to victory. The strategy has had very limited affect this season, and if not for the brake upgrade, Buell would be languishing in the midpack and causing even more danger in the braking zones. The Buell can make up for Danny's mistakes---the mistakes he must make in order to push his way to the front so he isn't left for dead. The only time it is "unfair" is when the riders are battling very closely. I can understand the frustration from the guys who race on the 600s, but really, if they get out in front and single file around for a few laps, Danny isn't a factor in the race. I don't remember the riders complaining when the Buell was outclassed at most of the venues during the middle of the season. The Buell is in their head, and that's why tempers are boiling. It doesn't have any lap time advantages.

There is a very simple formula in DSB. If Danny is at the front during qualifying, he has a very good chance of winning the race. If he's stuck in the midpack somewhere, he probably doesn't have the pace to win. He got lucky yesterday.

The 600 riders are not crashing all over the place in a bid to pass the Buell. Cardenas crashed yesterday trying to beat Danny, that's it. Most of the "crashing all over the place" has involved riders binning it from the front or near the front like Zemke at Road Atlanta or DiSalvo at Road Atlanta or Cardenas at Laguna, or Hacking at Infineon, etc etc etc.

 

[Mr. Shupe]

What is up with the flagging this year? The commentators pointed out the red flags at around turn 4, but the riders kept racing. They didn't show any signs of slowing until four turns from where the accident happened.

And why did they finally slow down? Because there was an ambulance cruising on the track. The riders were visibly upset with the vehicle on course, waving their hands at the driver.

I am aware of the flag stand issues, but why did the riders miss the corner flags today? Thinking of past red flag situations, I don't remember any major issues with the field slowing down. Has DMG changed the corner flagging spots, making it harder for the riders to see the flags? Were the flag areas at HPT poorly placed for motorcycles? Why did this happen again?

The DSB race was close, but once again I wasn't that entertained. It was a joke how Cardenas had to work so hard to make a pass, only to have Eslick accelerate back by out of the corner or down the front stretch.

I can't say I'm looking forward to VIR, a track with a long front straitaway and narrow turns.

 

[mylexicon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mr. Shupe @ Aug 2 2009, 10:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>What is up with the flagging this year? The commentators pointed out the red flags at around turn 4, but the riders kept racing. They didn't show any signs of slowing until four turns from where the accident happened.

And why did they finally slow down? Because there was an ambulance cruising on the track. The riders were visibly upset with the vehicle on course, waving their hands at the driver.

I am aware of the flag stand issues, but why did the riders miss the corner flags today? Thinking of past red flag situations, I don't remember any major issues with the field slowing down. Has DMG changed the corner flagging spots, making it harder for the riders to see the flags? Were the flag areas at HPT poorly placed for motorcycles? Why did this happen again?

The DSB race was close, but once again I wasn't that entertained. It was a joke how Cardenas had to work so hard to make a pass, only to have Eslick accelerate back by out of the corner or down the front stretch.

I can't say I'm looking forward to VIR, a track with a long front straitaway and narrow turns.

It's the same old same old. Poorly placed flags at a new venue the rider's aren't accustomed to mixed with understaffed corner personnel and riders who really couldn't care less about what race direction are trying to communicate to them.

It is as old as time I'm afraid.

 

[povol]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Aug 2 2009, 11:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The Buell is not faster than the 600s in terms of lap times, that's my point. The bike wins b/c one kid from Oklahoma is willing to override the bike in order to get in front of the pack and block/barge his way to victory. The strategy has had very limited affect this season, and if not for the brake upgrade, Buell would be languishing in the midpack and causing even more danger in the braking zones. The Buell can make up for Danny's mistakes---the mistakes he must make in order to push his way to the front so he isn't left for dead. The only time it is "unfair" is when the riders are battling very closely. I can understand the frustration from the guys who race on the 600s, but really, if they get out in front and single file around for a few laps, Danny isn't a factor in the race. I don't remember the riders complaining when the Buell was outclassed at most of the venues during the middle of the season. The Buell is in their head, and that's why tempers are boiling. It doesn't have any lap time advantages.

There is a very simple formula in DSB. If Danny is at the front during qualifying, he has a very good chance of winning the race. If he's stuck in the midpack somewhere, he probably doesn't have the pace to win. He got lucky yesterday.

The 600 riders are not crashing all over the place in a bid to pass the Buell. Cardenas crashed yesterday trying to beat Danny, that's it. Most of the "crashing all over the place" has involved riders binning it from the front or near the front like Zemke at Road Atlanta or DiSalvo at Road Atlanta or Cardenas at Laguna, or Hacking at Infineon, etc etc etc.
And when was the last time you saw so many professional riders crash out of the lead or near the front.Its because they are pushing so hard to open up a small advantage so the dont get the paint sucked off on the next straight.And any body who knows anything about racing knows that the leader can control lap times,actually run slower laps than his pursuers and keep the lead. The DMG and Buell apologist always want to bring up the fact that the Buell doesnt always post the fastest lap time during the race,thats info for the sheep,not real race fans who understand whats going on. Scott Russell said last night,over and over how easy it was for the Buell to bide its time and blow past bikes in the straights.The advantage the Buell has in the straights is more than the 600's have in the corners.On another topic, Mladin might have saved Josh Herrins life this weekend. When Herrrin and Eslick got together and Herrin went off road down into the drainage ditch,was that not the place they removed concrete barriers that exposed the hole Herrin somehow made it thru.

 

[mylexicon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Aug 3 2009, 06:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>And when was the last time you saw so many professional riders crash out of the lead or near the front.Its because they are pushing so hard to open up a small advantage so the dont get the paint sucked off on the next straight.And any body who knows anything about racing knows that the leader can control lap times,actually run slower laps than his pursuers and keep the lead. The DMG and Buell apologist always want to bring up the fact that the Buell doesnt always post the fastest lap time during the race,thats info for the sheep,not real race fans who understand whats going on. Scott Russell said last night,over and over how easy it was for the Buell to bide its time and blow past bikes in the straights.The advantage the Buell has in the straights is more than the 600's have in the corners.On another topic, Mladin might have saved Josh Herrins life this weekend. When Herrrin and Eslick got together and Herrin went off road down into the drainage ditch,was that not the place they removed concrete barriers that exposed the hole Herrin somehow made it thru.

The observation about lap times is not information for the sheep.

DMG monitor the performance characteristics of the bikes routinely, and I'm sure they have a target performance level set for the Buell. Danny almost never turns the fastest lap b/c the Buell is not the fastest bike out there. The Buell is the best bike in a dogfight, and since DMG are trying to create dogfights at the front, the Buell is one of the best bikes to have under DMG's new rules. The Suzuki is the other bike that runs well.

The race leader can set the pace at the front but an appropriate illustration would be Pegram in SBK. He opens a gap then he maintains it until he needs a little extra. Danny is not controlling a race from the front when Cardenas closed him down in 3 laps during race 1.

Mat Mladin didn't save anyone's life. Hayes and Ulrich oversaw the removal of the Turn 1 alpha wall and the promoters were working diligently with them. Mladin sat at home with his feet up and announced his retirement to rain on the event's publicity.

 

[povol]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Aug 3 2009, 11:33 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The observation about lap times is not information for the sheep.

DMG monitor the performance characteristics of the bikes routinely, and I'm sure they have a target performance level set for the Buell. Danny almost never turns the fastest lap b/c the Buell is not the fastest bike out there. The Buell is the best bike in a dogfight, and since DMG are trying to create dogfights at the front, the Buell is one of the best bikes to have under DMG's new rules. The Suzuki is the other bike that runs well.

The race leader can set the pace at the front but an appropriate illustration would be Pegram in SBK. He opens a gap then he maintains it until he needs a little extra. Danny is not controlling a race from the front when Cardenas closed him down in 3 laps during race 1.

Mat Mladin didn't save anyone's life. Hayes and Ulrich oversaw the removal of the Turn 1 alpha wall and the promoters were working diligently with them. Mladin sat at home with his feet up and announced his retirement to rain on the event's publicity.

Was that diligence before or after the riders had already arrived for the weekend and a certain rider said he was going home.Oh,and how did that race 1 end up, didnt Danny win that race despite Cardenas unbelievable closure rate.

Just another perfect example of controling the race from the front. Danny was going to win race 2 until he bobbled with a couple of corners to go. He was set up for the power pass coming out of the last corner and Cardenas would have been dead meat. Luck for him Danny made a mistake that not only cost him a sure win but cost him second also.

 

[Mr. Shupe]

Seems people are being relatively quiet over the ambulance so far...

Even if Eslick doesn't control the race, it is hard to deny that the rules have at least made things easier for him than the 600 riders. He can pass on the straits and slow the 600s in the turns during the race. When he gets passed, he powers back by out of the turn, since the overtaking 600 rider took a different, slower line to get by.

I thought the Aprilia mixed well with the 600s, at least this past weekend. Eslick shot past Davies on the front strait too. Why can't the Buell run like the RSV1000? Too heavy?

Not much participation in this thread. If the diehards who populate message boards aren't interested...

 

[mylexicon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Aug 3 2009, 09:37 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>[/b]

Was that diligence before or after the riders had already arrived for the weekend and a certain rider said he was going home.Oh,and how did that race 1 end up, didnt Danny win that race despite Cardenas unbelievable closure rate.

Just another perfect example of controling the race from the front. Danny was going to win race 2 until he bobbled with a couple of corners to go. He was set up for the power pass coming out of the last corner and Cardenas would have been dead meat. Luck for him Danny made a mistake that not only cost him a sure win but cost him second also.

Povol, please. First the Buell is causing people to crash and now Mladin is saving people's lives from his couch cushions. I think you're losing your grip on reality, regardless of the exact chronology.

 

[povol]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mr. Shupe @ Aug 3 2009, 03:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Seems people are being relatively quiet over the ambulance so far...

Even if Eslick doesn't control the race, it is hard to deny that the rules have at least made things easier for him than the 600 riders. He can pass on the straits and slow the 600s in the turns during the race. When he gets passed, he powers back by out of the turn, since the overtaking 600 rider took a different, slower line to get by.

I thought the Aprilia mixed well with the 600s, at least this past weekend. Eslick shot past Davies on the front strait too. Why can't the Buell run like the RSV1000? Too heavy?
Not much participation in this thread. If the diehards who populate message boards aren't interested...
I will tell you why, because its [the Buell} HP to weight ratio was by far the best of any bike and the Aprlia was even behind some of the 600's in HP to weight ratio. It is a heavy bike with an an aging engine,i believe it put out around 115 Hp stock to the rear wheel and a WERA crew chief for Davies hinted that it was about 137 hp and the Buell was a tad over 150