Agostini is NOT better than anyone

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Mar 15 2008, 07:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So there it is boys and girls. The guy who has won the most ever, "is a joke."

Need I say more?
It took me about 4-5 minutes before I could post to that, and frankly, my stomach was numb from the laughing.
not often am i left speechless, unbelievable

Great replies!!!

Thanks Noodle for the ridiculous post, I haven't laughed this hard in a long time

Wasn't Ago also riding in 2-3 different classes a weekend too? Huge set of testicals anyone that could do that with the saftey measures they had.

Hands down this is the craziest ....... thread I've ever read on here.

I fully expect a "Mike Hailwood was gay because he had a moustache" thread by tomorrow.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Goatboy @ Mar 15 2008, 02:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Wasn't Ago also riding in 2-3 different classes a weekend too? Huge set of testicals anyone that could do that with the saftey measures they had.

Hands down this is the craziest ....... thread I've ever read on here.

I fully expect a "Mike Hailwood was gay because he had a moustache" thread by tomorrow.
Anybody who has ever raced with a "mustache" is in fact "gay", the real question is of course, did he deserve all those titles? Well of course not, since we have establish that he was "gay". And to add to that, he was probably pretty slow, considering that he's one of the only men to have won every class and roadracing discipline of his time.

Ago=Hailwood=joke

>>>>>A brief reminder of Ago's career:<<<<<<

- In 1965 Ago began racing in GP as teammate of Mike Hailwood at MV Agusta. The more experienced Hailwood won the title.
- In 1966 Hailwood left MV for Honda. The Honda was not yet reliable enough and so Ago could win his first title, beating also Jim Redman.
- In 1967 the battle was between Hailwood and Ago. The two finished the season with the same points! They also had the same number of victories but Ago had more second places, so he won his second title.

Up to this moment Ago had won 2 premier class titles against the strongest opposition. But at the end of 1967, due to a bad economic crisis in Japan, Honda retires from the competitions leaving Ago and MV Agusta to race practically alone against a bunch of privateers.

In 1968, 1969, 1970 1971 and 1972 Ago wins most of his 15 titles, in 350 and 500. These were a little too easy.

- In 1973 Phil Read joins Ago at MV, it is a formidable team - but Jarno Saarinen on a Yamaha 2-strokes wins the first 2 races in his very first 500cc season, before his tragic crash at Monza the same year. At the end of the season the 500cc title goes to Phil Read.
- In 1974 Ago leaves MV for Yamaha, but MV is still the dominant force and Phil Read wins the title again.
- In 1975 Ago regains the 500cc title on the Yamaha. It is the first premier class title ever won by a Japanese bike.
- In 1976 the era of Suzuki and Barry Sheene begins. Ago retires at the end of the season after winning his last race at Nurburgring, in which he rides a MV Agusta again. It is the last victory for Ago and for MV (and for a 4-strokes machine against the already dominant 2-strokes).

So even discounting the easy string of titles from 1968 to 1972, still Ago did win multiple titles against the strongest riders of his time. Is that enough to declare him the greatest of all times? I'm afraid not. But one of the greatest, yes, certainly.

Note: In the late 60's and early 70's 500cc GP bikes were already VERY FAST even compared with today, they could reach speeds in excess of 260 Kmph during a race. Frames, brakes and tyres were NOT up to those speeds, unfortunately. There was no safety around the tracks. Racing motorcycles was a VERY dangerous sport, requiring HUGE skills just to finish a season in one piece.

It was normal enough to race in 2 classes - there were 5 classes, 50cc. 125cc, 250cc, 350cc and 500cc. Ago used to race in 350 and 500, Hailwood for some time raced in 250, 350 and 500...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Mar 15 2008, 07:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Ghosts are some vicious little mothatfukers. damn fuckhead kids, you gave me a good laugh there rj ( still chuckling )...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Mar 15 2008, 07:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So there it is boys and girls. The guy who has won the most ever, "is a joke."i especially like the NOT in the title, clever touch.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (J4rn0 @ Mar 16 2008, 12:43 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>

>>>>>A brief reminder of Ago's career:<<<<<<

- In 1965 Ago began racing in GP as teammate of Mike Hailwood at MV Agusta. The more experienced Hailwood won the title.
- In 1966 Hailwood left MV for Honda. The Honda was not yet reliable enough and so Ago could win his first title, beating also Jim Redman.
- In 1967 the battle was between Hailwood and Ago. The two finished the season with the same points! They also had the same number of victories but Ago had more second places, so he won his second title.

Up to this moment Ago had won 2 premier class titles against the strongest opposition. But at the end of 1967, due to a bad economic crisis in Japan, Honda retires from the competitions leaving Ago and MV Agusta to race practically alone against a bunch of privateers.

In 1968, 1969, 1970 1971 and 1972 Ago wins most of his 15 titles, in 350 and 500. These were a little too easy.

- In 1973 Phil Read joins Ago at MV, it is a formidable team - but Jarno Saarinen on a Yamaha 2-strokes wins the first 2 races in his very first 500cc season, before his tragic crash at Monza the same year. At the end of the season the 500cc title goes to Phil Read.
- In 1974 Ago leaves MV for Yamaha, but MV is still the dominant force and Phil Read wins the title again.
- In 1975 Ago regains the 500cc title on the Yamaha. It is the first premier class title ever won by a Japanese bike.
- In 1976 the era of Suzuki and Barry Sheene begins. Ago retires at the end of the season after winning his last race at Nurburgring, in which he rides a MV Agusta again. It is the last victory for Ago and for MV (and for a 4-strokes machine against the already dominant 2-strokes).

So even discounting the easy string of titles from 1968 to 1972, still Ago did win multiple titles against the strongest riders of his time. Is that enough to declare him the greatest of all times? I'm afraid not. But one of the greatest, yes, certainly.

<span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:100%Note: In the late 60's and early 70's 500cc GP bikes were already VERY FAST even compared with today, they could reach speeds in excess of 260 Kmph during a race. Frames, brakes and tyres were NOT up to those speeds, unfortunately. There was no safety around the tracks. Racing motorcycles was a VERY dangerous sport, requiring HUGE skills just to finish a season in one piece.

It was normal enough to race in 2 classes - there were 5 classes, 50cc. 125cc, 250cc, 350cc and 500cc. Ago used to race in 350 and 500, Hailwood for some time raced in 250, 350 and 500...

thank you j4rn0! ...just to add to that, in 1967, ago averaged almost 109mph around iom tt course with those same ...... grooved tyres, ...... brakes and ...... suspension, i know fast guys who've been racing for years that are delighted to do a near 120mph lap today, 40 years later, on a very trick superbike. if any of you non believers get the chance, take a good long look at a 60's racebike.

my old man was at the tt a few years ago with a pal of his who sponsored a british national 125 rider. this guy knew the guys from micron exhausts really well, they had a mobile workshop at the races with a couple of dynos. my old fella got talking to one of the micron guys about the old days as he always does, yawn. but get this, the micron guys were able to tell him they had dyno'd a few classic racebikes the year before, one of them being a 500 mv, according to these guys the mv was putting out just over 100bhp. so noodles, put drum brakes and bicycle tyres on a cbr600, do a lap of the tt and tell me how you get on, eh?

btw phil read is one of my all time heroes

Thanks for the boring facts Jarno and Skid. Oh brother, just when we had all agreed that these guys were worthless racers who got their titles at some gum-ball machine. You guys are total buzz kills.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (basspete @ Mar 16 2008, 05:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Sorry, am I really reading this??????????

Please tell me someone is having a laugh here, it's sarcasm, yeah?

Pete
You couldnt have been around then or you would know his only opposition was british singles for the majority of his championships, he could have given everyone a lap start and still won.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pepik128 @ Mar 16 2008, 07:00 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You couldnt have been around then or you would know his only opposition was british singles for the majority of his championships, he could have given everyone a lap start and still won.


Actually, I was around, young but around. To dismiss Ago is just beyond comprehension.

Pete

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Mar 16 2008, 06:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Thanks for the boring facts Jarno and Skid. Oh brother, just when we had all agreed that these guys were worthless racers who got their titles at some gum-ball machine. You guys are total buzz kills.

Boring?!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (J4rn0 @ Mar 16 2008, 01:43 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>

>>>>>A brief reminder of Ago's career:<<<<<<

- In 1965 Ago began racing in GP as teammate of Mike Hailwood at MV Agusta. The more experienced Hailwood won the title.
- In 1966 Hailwood left MV for Honda. The Honda was not yet reliable enough and so Ago could win his first title, beating also Jim Redman.
- In 1967 the battle was between Hailwood and Ago. The two finished the season with the same points! They also had the same number of victories but Ago had more second places, so he won his second title.

Up to this moment Ago had won 2 premier class titles against the strongest opposition. But at the end of 1967, due to a bad economic crisis in Japan, Honda retires from the competitions leaving Ago and MV Agusta to race practically alone against a bunch of privateers.

In 1968, 1969, 1970 1971 and 1972 Ago wins most of his 15 titles, in 350 and 500. These were a little too easy.

- In 1973 Phil Read joins Ago at MV, it is a formidable team - but Jarno Saarinen on a Yamaha 2-strokes wins the first 2 races in his very first 500cc season, before his tragic crash at Monza the same year. At the end of the season the 500cc title goes to Phil Read.
- In 1974 Ago leaves MV for Yamaha, but MV is still the dominant force and Phil Read wins the title again.
- In 1975 Ago regains the 500cc title on the Yamaha. It is the first premier class title ever won by a Japanese bike.
- In 1976 the era of Suzuki and Barry Sheene begins. Ago retires at the end of the season after winning his last race at Nurburgring, in which he rides a MV Agusta again. It is the last victory for Ago and for MV (and for a 4-strokes machine against the already dominant 2-strokes).

So even discounting the easy string of titles from 1968 to 1972, still Ago did win multiple titles against the strongest riders of his time. Is that enough to declare him the greatest of all times? I'm afraid not. But one of the greatest, yes, certainly.

Note: In the late 60's and early 70's 500cc GP bikes were already VERY FAST even compared with today, they could reach speeds in excess of 260 Kmph during a race. Frames, brakes and tyres were NOT up to those speeds, unfortunately. There was no safety around the tracks. Racing motorcycles was a VERY dangerous sport, requiring HUGE skills just to finish a season in one piece.

It was normal enough to race in 2 classes - there were 5 classes, 50cc. 125cc, 250cc, 350cc and 500cc. Ago used to race in 350 and 500, Hailwood for some time raced in 250, 350 and 500...




Good bit of history there. One more point for those who would compare champions of different times. In 1978, Hailwood came out of retirement, and racing a privateer Ducati, he won the Isle of Man, which Kenny Roberts and the rest boycotted as being too dangerous, but two weeks after that, Hailwood then went to the British GP on his privateer Ducati and beat Roberts and all the rest on their vastly superior machines on their type of track. So it seems that the Ago and Hailwood types were a lot better and tougher riders than those of the Roberts and Sheene era.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Hyper @ Mar 17 2008, 01:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Hailwood then went to the British GP on his privateer Ducati and beat Roberts and all the rest on their vastly superior machines on their type of track.

No way man it was Ducati so it had Electrical Rider aids!! ...... only he had to wait a bit till the valves warmed up and it all worked.....only they called it RCA back then ( Radio Control Aids ) not TC like now ...... and also sometimes BBC sound would come out of the fuel tank ...... And there was speculation that if Hailwood bit down on his teeth fillings in a certain way ...... the brakes would come on!!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Hyper @ Mar 17 2008, 02:14 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Good bit of history there. One more point for those who would compare champions of different times. In 1978, Hailwood came out of retirement, and racing a privateer Ducati, he won the Isle of Man, which Kenny Roberts and the rest boycotted as being too dangerous, but two weeks after that, Hailwood then went to the British GP on his privateer Ducati and beat Roberts and all the rest on their vastly superior machines on their type of track. So it seems that the Ago and Hailwood types were a lot better and tougher riders than those of the Roberts and Sheene era.good point about the tt but didn't roberts win the '78 british gp?

Damn! I might have the temporary excuse of hormones to blame. What's yours?!?!?!??!!?
Besides..."not better than anyone"....in normal english syntax that means he can't beat anyone. Does that mean every other person in the world can ride a bike better than Ago? I bet he can kick a lot of ..... even now. Have some respect. Sheesh!

As my learned friend Curve would say....................S!!!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Hyper @ Mar 17 2008, 03:14 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Good bit of history there. One more point for those who would compare champions of different times. In 1978, Hailwood came out of retirement, and racing a privateer Ducati, he won the Isle of Man, which Kenny Roberts and the rest boycotted as being too dangerous, but two weeks after that, Hailwood then went to the British GP on his privateer Ducati and beat Roberts and all the rest on their vastly superior machines on their type of track. So it seems that the Ago and Hailwood types were a lot better and tougher riders than those of the Roberts and Sheene era.


I do remember Hailwood's 1978 victory at the TT on a Ducati 864cc, - and he won again the TT in 1979 on a Suzuki 500cc 2-strokes GP bike! -- but I have no recollection of him taking part in the British GP and beating Roberts & Co... (btw Ducati did not have a 500cc GP bike at that time, consider also that the 2 strokes were already dominating).

In 1979 after winning the TT again, he in fact did try to race at Donington with the same Suzuki 500 GP, but crashed during practice and that was the end of his formidable career as a rider. He was 39 years old.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (J4rn0 @ Mar 17 2008, 07:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I do remember Hailwood's 1978 victory at the TT on a Ducati 864cc, - and he won again the TT in 1979 on a Suzuki 500cc 2-strokes GP bike! -- but I have no recollection of him taking part in the British GP and beating Roberts & Co... (btw Ducati did not have a 500cc GP bike at that time, consider also that the 2 strokes were already dominating).

In 1979 after winning the TT again, he in fact did try to race at Donington with the same Suzuki 500 GP, but crashed during practice and that was the end of his formidable career as a rider. He was 39 years old.


Right you are mate,

it was not the Brit GP after IOM for Hailwood. However, since the Roberts and the others boycotted IOM, we have no way to compare them to the real "road" racers except to say they were missing in action. Too bad they didn't have the stomach to try the Island.

Certainly it is always difficult to compare riders of different times, but other than Rossi, haven't seen any in awhile that really seem to stand out. But Rossi has yet to show he can adapt to riding the new more complicated bikes so will be interesting to watch how he and Lorenzo fair against each other. Rossi's time may be past.

Hyper