Who deserved to be champion?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (somedamnwriter @ Oct 30 2006, 08:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>^ ahh..you were referring to the pronunciations. Ben, we should start installing audio systems in the site...err, kidding...

Anyway, I get it now.

Hey, I'm ordering a new set of speakers so when you install the audio.

(umh, who is Ben?), are you talking about the guy with that cool yellow spidi-helmet?

^ Ben: The Don. The one who speaks with the voice like god. kidding! There's only one Ben in the site, and that's him alright!

Hi, first post and havn't done the intro thread yet but reading this made me think. This would have been a question with more validity if it was asked going into the last race. At that point most everyone would say the best man will have the most points after the last race thinking it would be Rossi and in this way, if your choice of Rossi or Hayden doesn't come through you can't play shoulda, coulda woulda. Few would have guessed that it would be Hayden coming from the second row rubbing leather with Rossi and then as he is poised to go into the lead after 5 laps Rossi bins it with a Stoner like move back in the pack.. Rossi is the best rider ever IMHO but as the title is determined by Rider, Team, Tire, not just the rider, most points wins! I think it will seem like a short off-season with the testing of the 800's. Oh yeah, going to the 800's, I wouldn't be surprised if Stoner is a contender.

^ Hi! Welcome to the forum!

Agree with your post. That's why everything's theoretical right now. May be the poster was just playing some thoughts in mind and would like to ask our opinion regarding the matter.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Racejumkie @ Oct 30 2006, 11:22 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I agree with Dan here, it’s a silly topic. But I will play the game. First of all, I must say this thread by 4..louzi is really a ‘lousy’ and thinly veiled attempt to just say you love/adore Rossi. It became evident very quickly by your several replies when the responder was not saying what you wanted to hear. You could have saved yourself the multiple responses and just said that you can’t accept anybody other than Rossi.

So lets play along:

Hayden is the Champion because he DESERVED to be the champion. That’s what you asked and that is my answer.

Now I will elaborate on why he deserved it.

First of all he ‘deserved’ it because that is how MotoGP championships are won, based on points; at the end of the season Hayden had the most. (Now if this was another event, say Dancing with the Stars, then they might award points for fan popularity, where you make it plenty obvious that you would vote for Rossi). But we are talking about MotoGP.

This is the short answer of course. But then you weren’t really satisfied with those responders that said he deserved to win because he got the most points, so you restated your question as if the responder didn’t know what the word: “deserved” meant.

So let me try to answer your question this way since you allocate a special “biased” meaning to the word “deserved.”

Again my answer is the same: Hayden DESERVED to be the champion. Here is why.

Hayden fought back from adversity just as much as Rossi did, and then some. Rossi was helped by his teammate, unlike Hayden who was taken out by his. They both suffered through mechanical problems, poor performances, and other misfortune. But at the end of the season, when the pressure was most high, Hayden performed like a true champion by any stretch of the word, simultaneously, Rossi cracked under the pressure (un-champion like) and subsequently crashed resulting in him relinquishing the championship. By the way, that pressure was applied by Hayden, who was poised to win the race at Valencia.

I suspect from your multiple responses that my answer will not be satisfactory to you; however, I will just make a few more comments on the question you posed.

If you mean by the word “deserved” you are asking who is ‘worthy of’ the championship. Then absolutely my answer is Nicky Hayden. If you mean by the word ‘deserved’ who you like most, then my answer is Hayden again, because you see that is just an opinion. Which is how you have tried to re-frame the question. Who is the best rider? Well on any given race it can fluctuate, but over a MotoGP season, the best rider is called the Champion. For this year, that person is Nicky Hayden. Therefore, Hayden is DESERVING of being the champion.



erm...excuse me..i wasnt tryin 2 say rossi is the best, i woz just interested in other peoples views on the topic. To me, i think Rossi did deserve it, but if it wasnt him or Hayden, it has to be Capirossi. It wasn't to make everyone adore Vale like you tried to say, i was wondering after this season, who pushed themselves so much and worked soo hard to win the championship, then who do you think 'deserved' it. Like i already said, all my respect to Hayden for winning. It's just a bit of fun

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (V8GUZZI @ Oct 31 2006, 03:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>the title is determined by Rider, Team, Tire, not just the rider, most points wins!

Hey, welcome to the site. Your spot on here, and I'd like to add that there's an element of luck involved too. Of course, Hayden had the best luck this year, but Rossi has had his fair share of luck over the last half a decade, too. That's not to say Rossi or hayden don't deserve their titles, that's just the way it is. To be a champion (according to the books) you need things like luck, consistency, a good bike/team, brains and the like. Both Hayden and Rossi have had these when they won their respective championships. Things like a high race win count, and a cool personality look good, but they don't help too much.

I really think Nicky Hayden deserved a championship win but not like that. He keeps going on about how much he's tried all year and how much he's spent and he thought it would be a waste and then he always starts crying which gets on my nerves a little...but Rossi would of beaten him quite comfortably if it hadn't of been for all his bad luck this year. Owell, next year holds another action-packed season for us to look forward to!

i think vale because hes tried so hard and picked himself up when at times u thought hayden would have won be 105 points. He made 50 points more than hayden since laguna as the commentator pointed out...who would u rather win the championship some1 who plods along and doesnt really fight or someone that doesnt give up.
Hayden may be world champion for now bt next year he'll definately not be. After everything as well hes still won the most races everybody knows rossi is possibly one of the gratest riders of all time whereas in 10 / 15 years hayden will be forgotten. Theyve been head to head before but not for the lead really and rossi has always slid past hayden on his way to a win x

Hey RaceJumkie!

I've been trying to stay out of this one but I feel Junkie's getting an overly hard time here. There is an overwhelming amount of support for Rossi on this forum. This has been an unpredictable season. As a result, there have been many times this year when emotions run high, and what could have happened, or depending how you look at it, should have happenned, gets in the way of what actually did take place. I admire you junkie for attempting to 'play the game' as you put it, spot on there, heads up but I'm outta this one. It was a sure thing that Nicky coming out on top was going to spark some frenzied posts of what could have been.

I think it's funny that some people just can't accept the fact the Nicky Hayden (an American) won the GP title. All the Rossi fans on all the different bike forums are pretty much all the same.....Well, "if" Rossi didn't crash, "if" his motor help up....blah blah blah....NH won the title getting the most points he could get out of every race except Estoril. You guys seem to think that NH was just tooling around looking for the finish line. Funny thing is, the clutch on his bike was not designed properly and the clutch basket was actually set TOO DEEP and there was nothing that HRC could about it. So, NH had to race with what he had.

NH was the best rider this year....That is why he has title. No if's, please. Look at the season as a whole. Lok at what DID transpire. You will see that NH had a more consistent season that VR.

BTW....Where's Danno???

Dont worry Racejunkie many people agree with you here, there's a huge Rossi fan base here.

I think its silly that all people want to say is "Nicky doesn't desrve it" "He didn't fight" "He's always whining". If I remember correctly, at the begining of the season Marco Melandri was absolutly poor on the development bike, so poor that he even went back to the 05 bike whilst Nicky, on the same bike gained more impressive results, But that doesn't matter does it? What did Rossi do that was so special? he won from poor position at Germany? So what! Marco won from 14th, finished 3rd at donington with a broken collarbone and won at Philip Island in the wet and finished in dramatic style. Elias won at portugal in the best race of the season and all Rossi did was win at tracks that everyone expected him to win. Le Mans, Errrrr..... YAMAHA TRACK! Catalunya, Rossi wins surprise suprise, Muggelo, Suprise Suprise, Germany, Yeah! that was impressive. So whats all this talk about Rossi being the best rider all season? he only won 5 races! Last season he won 12 didn't he? he's only won 3 more than Nicky and only 2 more than Marco and Caparossi who have been plauged with broken body parts. And whats all this talk of Nicky benefitting from other riders crashing? the way I see it he's only benifited 3 times from riders crashing out, one at Turkey another at Motegi and Rossi crashing out in the final race. I dont know if anyone noticed this but all the times Caparossi, Melandri, Stoner crashed out, Hayden was already of them so it doesn't matter. Oh yeah and Rossi crashed out at Jerez! Im sure he would of hit a problem anyway. And about Rossi's bad luck, there's a saying and it goes.... YOU CREATE YOUR OWN BAD LUCK! Isn't it strange how Rossi was the only michelin rider to have a failure?

So my point is, Rossi fans! sorry to break it to you but your man underperformed! There's a reason why he's started training for the first time ever and it aint because he wants to win Mr Universe.

And to the Hayden fans! Your boy deserved, he got the most points because he raced better than everyone else over the whole season.

Well Just my 2 pence.

Silly topic??? No I do no think so everyone is entitled to start a thread no matter how silly, naive they think it is, remember there are some very new members to the sport, so we all need to make allowances for such discussions from time to time.

Plus look how many pages into the thread we are at now??? excellent thats what its all about.

Back to the topic in hand.

The last race reminded me very much of the MS/Alonso situation where MS fought back to level the score in China only to have an engine blow the following week in Japan leaving a 10 point defecit between himself and Alonso. Ok it was a tall order for Schumi to win the race and Alonso was required to either DNF or finish outside of the points to lose his title, but in this case Rossi was simply beaten by Rossi...

Yes if he had not broken down on numerous occassions, whilst leading, we may have witnessed a different end result to this season.

If Dani had not taken out Nicky at Estoril, yet again things may have been different and we would have seen Nicky with a small points cushion over Rossi going into the last race with Rossi having it all to do, which may have lead to even more exciting race.

I like both riders and I respect all riders on the grid, but Nicky proved he has what it takes, think of the intensity and bags of pressure he must have been under those last few laps.

So IMO Nicky deserves the title, but if it wasn't for the Barcelona incident, I would be certain that M & M and Capper would have been in the hunt at the end too.

As stated before, Rossi has never been in the position of fighting for the championship in the last race, this was a new experience for him and this time around it simply never went his way, but I am sure he has taken it on the chin like a True champion, and will come out with all pistons firing in 2007.

Nicky on the other hand may have a bad season, or he may simply be the Man to beat next year. Who knows...all I know is that I am going to be facing more difficulty when choosing my next " Fantasy Team.

Thats what I like most of all about this season.

It was simply unpredictable.......

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Best Man @ Oct 31 2006, 01:32 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>i think roger-m was just commenting on the basis of your response by saying you were a bit harsh by posting that to a young girl who has just joined the forum and is trying to actively join in discussions! and i agree with him.
that was exactly my point !!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Racejumkie @ Oct 31 2006, 02:36 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You said" and I agree with him." So you agree with his post. Now you try to narrow your response to say it was only one part of his post that you agree with? Ok.

I think you may want to re-read his entire post before you go agreeing with it. Or at least say, I agree with this part but this other part, not so much.

I just joined too. (two weeks ago), and do you know how old/young I am? And do you know my gender also? Are girl's any less accountable? What exactly does this have to do with the relevance of what we say as posters?
ok i will put it in a layman term. imo if you think a post is silly then dont respond to it, to launch a scathing attack on somebody who is only asking peoples opinions is not on in my book. i also noticed when i posted my opinion to your attack you were online yet you waited untill i was offline until you posted on what i said. ummm wonderfull things these time zones.
you were correct on one thing tho,i dont follow superbike,i only comment on baylis motogp rides.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Electric Mofo @ Oct 31 2006, 12:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So whats all this talk about Rossi being the best rider all season? he only won 5 races! Last season he won 12 didn't he? he's only won 3 more than Nicky and only 2 more than Marco and Caparossi who have been plauged with broken body parts.
Actually last season he won 11. 12 would have equalled Giacomo Agostini's record for wins in one season.
In my opinion - and it's something I'm perfectly entitled to like everyone else here - Rossi is still the best rider on the grid. He had broken body parts too. Or have you forgotten the broken wrist at Assen?
And if we're going to talk about consistency...for goodness' sake the guy won 5...count them...FIVE motogp championships in a row. That's more championships than Nicky's won races. Frankly I don't know why all Rossi fans are in such a tizz about this. .... happens. Bad luck happens and humans make mistakes. I don't dislike Nicky. I think he deserved this year because at closing time, he had the most points. That's how it works. But it remains to be seen whether his consistency will stretch to where Rossi has already left his indelible mark. If Nicky can equal that, or even repeat himself next year, my already significant respect for him will increase a thousandfold. Time will tell.

it seems that this is turning into a rossi -v- hayden thread ?

as has been stated - countless times above - the question asks 'who deserved to be champion ?'

perhaps the choice of words from lou wasn't the best but the sense of outrage from the hayden camp and the resulting 'verbal' assault is frankly childish.

when capt.snow & jumkie have quite finished kissing each others arses they might have time to read the post - (which if you bother to check out her profile - was posted by a YOUNG female FAN) - in the tone which was intended.

it is entirely possible for someone to win a championship without necessarily deserving it and equally so - it's possible for someone to lose out when they fully deserve to take the title.

i'm an un-ashamed rossi fan, so for me - i would have liked rossi to take the title because he proved the majority of people wrong (including ME) by coming back from trailing a seemingly impossible 50+ points (albeit with the help of pedrosa)

BUT

hayden rode well - and consistantly (despite honda giving him a clutch made of cheese etc) scored more points and for that - he's the champ

so good on him

i don't have disrespectfull undertones about hayden or any other rider in my posts - they're all heroes to me and far better on a bike than i could ever dream to be BUT i have a favourite - and it's ROSSI

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Electric Mofo @ Oct 31 2006, 10:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Dont worry Racejunkie many people agree with you here, there's a huge Rossi fan base here.

there's also many who dont. do we who disagree always get dismissed as being 'rossi's huge fan base' on here?? oh but of course, if you say you are a rossi fan you cant have an objective opinion can you. well i am a rossi fan, but i also give credit where its due which is why i have put a picture of hayden showing his emotions as my sig. i was truely happy to see hayden win because i think he has deserved it because, as a few people have IMO correctly pointed out, he finished No. 1 in the championship. and if you finish No. 1 then you deserve to be the champion. oh no, have i betrayed the rossi fan club on here now??

^^^ Completely agree with u Best Man. It's perfectly possible to admire one rider more than the rest and still have enough brain cells left over to form an unbiased fair opinion.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bikergirl @ Oct 31 2006, 02:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>^^^ Completely agree with u Best Man. It's perfectly possible to admire one rider more than the rest and still have enough brain cells left over to form an unbiased fair opinion.

thankyou bikergirl. we try our best dont we

Aye! That we do.