The Silly Season Commences....NOW

(Citing Australian Motorcycle News Volume 58 No.1 (Current edition) at page 119) Article by Colin Young.

AMCN states as an absolute that the following is to occur (i.e. not a rumour).

Melandri's contract has been declared finished (part performed) and he will be paid for 11 races. The 11th race is Laguna Seca and the 12th is the Czech Grand Prix in August 2008. At this time he will line up on a third Kawasaki, which pretty much gives Anthony West the boot from 2009. In the short term he will ride the third machine that Olivier Jacque has been testing on.

Sete Gibernau is riding the Ducati from the Czech Grand Prix until the end of the season.

This was the easy part I guess but what it states is that it is "expected" that Nicki Hayden will take the seat on the second factory Ducati. It's the rumour that won't go away, and is now in part confirmed. I am guessing that Nicki will watch Sete on the bike and if he can show it isn't a Casey only mount then I imagine he will sign on the dotted line for a couple of years.

I am also intrigued by the Ducati factory not looking for an Italian (this is how Melandri got it in the first place - great basis for a decision that) and is looking for another dirt tracker.

AMCN is normally spot on with these things and every team in motogp has an Australian in it somewhere so I give this an admiralty score of B2 - not perfect but able to be reasonably expected to occur.

Hayden for Ducati ’09 it would seem

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andy Roo @ Jul 15 2008, 11:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>(Citing Australian Motorcycle News Volume 58 No.1 (Current edition) at page 119) Article by Colin Young.

AMCN states as an absolute that the following is to occur (i.e. not a rumour).

Melandri's contract has been declared finished (part performed) and he will be paid for 11 races. The 11th race is Laguna Seca and the 12th is the Czech Grand Prix in August 2008. At this time he will line up on a third Kawasaki, which pretty much gives Anthony West the boot from 2009. In the short term he will ride the third machine that Olivier Jacque has been testing on.

Sete Gibernau is riding the Ducati from the Czech Grand Prix until the end of the season.

This was the easy part I guess but what it states is that it is "expected" that Nicki Hayden will take the seat on the second factory Ducati. It's the rumour that won't go away, and is now in part confirmed. I am guessing that Nicki will watch Sete on the bike and if he can show it isn't a Casey only mount then I imagine he will sign on the dotted line for a couple of years.

I am also intrigued by the Ducati factory not looking for an Italian (this is how Melandri got it in the first place - great basis for a decision that) and is looking for another dirt tracker.

AMCN is normally spot on with these things and every team in motogp has an Australian in it somewhere so I give this an admiralty score of B2 - not perfect but able to be reasonably expected to occur.

Hayden for Ducati ’09 it would seem
make me laugh that they say its an absolute then say "at this time". although i can see the above happening. still not sure about hayden to ducati tho.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andy Roo @ Jul 15 2008, 12:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I am also intrigued by the Ducati factory not looking for an Italian (this is how Melandri got it in the first place - great basis for a decision that) and is looking for another dirt tracker.

Is that a fact? Really? How many seasons of GP have you actually followed? True Ducati like to have an Italian on board, but that's not how 'melandri got it in the first place'. Melandri was picked by Ducati back at the end of 2006 but Gresini refused to release him for the 2007 season so Ducati signed up Melandri for 08 and 09 back then...and brought in Stoner to fill in a 1 year gap as a last resort (after they couldn't get melandri and Hayden turned them down)...now THAT's a great basis for a decision isn't it? And look how well it worked...
Really, before spouting that kind of drivel you should ideally have been following the sport for more than half a season. Humph!!!!
And for your information, the silly season started a good while ago. To be precise at the end of the 07 season when Valentino said he wouldn't renew with Yam if they didn't get their act together to be precise.

Bikergirl - I started following motogp in the 80's, just before Wayne Gardner won the 500cc title in 1987. Thanks for asking. The silly season occurs every year (how long have you been following this?) when riders without contracts for the following years begin the negotiations with the various teams. Vale is now contracted for 2 years (he doesn't get to participate in this years silly season - nor does Casey, Jorge, Dani...and so on)

Ducati have always said they wanted an Italian rider and their No.1 choice was Valentino Rossi, don't blame them for that, Vale is an absolute legend.

They approached Vale and he knocked them back so they searched for another rider to partner or replace Loris and put Casey in as a stop gap (agreed that this was fateful).

At this point instead of recognising that Casey was a certain style of rider (ex dirt tracker) and his success on the bike may have been attributable to this they put Marco on who doesn't have that type of background. He rode some junior motocross but it was not his forte, he didn’t achieve any great results in dirt riding. There was an interim period where they went ahead despite having contrary information.

My point is they made a decision with their heart and not their heads and Marco’s wretched time with Ducati resulted. I’ve only been on this forum a short time but I’ve espoused the virtues of Nicki as a potential Ducati rider for some time (on other sites), based on his excellent past as a dirt tracker.

Anyway, Marco is team green from round 12 and Sete will be back.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andy Roo @ Jul 15 2008, 10:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>(Citing Australian Motorcycle News Volume 58 No.1 (Current edition) at page 119) Article by Colin Young.

AMCN states as an absolute that the following is to occur (i.e. not a rumour).

Melandri's contract has been declared finished (part performed) and he will be paid for 11 races. The 11th race is Laguna Seca and the 12th is the Czech Grand Prix in August 2008. At this time he will line up on a third Kawasaki, which pretty much gives Anthony West the boot from 2009. In the short term he will ride the third machine that Olivier Jacque has been testing on.

Sete Gibernau is riding the Ducati from the Czech Grand Prix until the end of the season.

This was the easy part I guess but what it states is that it is "expected" that Nicki Hayden will take the seat on the second factory Ducati. It's the rumour that won't go away, and is now in part confirmed. I am guessing that Nicki will watch Sete on the bike and if he can show it isn't a Casey only mount then I imagine he will sign on the dotted line for a couple of years.

I am also intrigued by the Ducati factory not looking for an Italian (this is how Melandri got it in the first place - great basis for a decision that) and is looking for another dirt tracker.

AMCN is normally spot on with these things and every team in motogp has an Australian in it somewhere so I give this an admiralty score of B2 - not perfect but able to be reasonably expected to occur.

Hayden for Ducati ’09 it would seem
I read this also and part of it was stated as bald fact with no equivocation. They are quite likely well informed; I guess casey stoner would know for one although isn't his column in another magazine?. I still can't see how they can state it as fact which is why I didn't rush to the defence of a fellow countryman on another thread who cited them as being much more reliable than a certain similarly named international source.
EDIT
I think bikergirl is very well informed particularly in matters italian including ducati and marco both together and separately. It is certainly my understanding that they had signed marco for 2008/2009 well before they signed casey but gresini would not release him for 2007. It is rumoured they approached hopkins as well as nicky hayden before signing casey to a one year only deal. Even casey fans thought signing marco was a good move as recently as the end of last season. I agree that their criteria for the type of rider they need have changed now; the dirt track thing may well be helpful but I think balls and willingness to wrestle with a bike, both qualities nicky possesses might also be helpful.

I really like marco and am saddened by his current predicament.

I'm not declaring this as gospel, just putting it out there as a discussion point

MichaelM - I like the guy and in hindsight (the wisdom of fools) we can see that he wasn't the rider for the bike,

Just trying to get a bit of discussion started on the silly season, not start WWIII.

These discussion posts can become rather ad hominem and adversarial

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andy Roo @ Jul 15 2008, 01:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Bikergirl - I started following motogp in the 80's, just before Wayne Gardner won the 500cc title in 1987. Thanks for asking. The silly season occurs every year (how long have you been following this?) when riders without contracts for the following years begin the negotiations with the various teams. Vale is now contracted for 2 years (he doesn't get to participate in this years silly season - nor does Casey, Jorge, Dani...and so on)

Ducati have always said they wanted an Italian rider and their No.1 choice was Valentino Rossi, don't blame them for that, Vale is an absolute legend.

They approached Vale and he knocked them back so they searched for another rider to partner or replace Loris and put Casey in as a stop gap (agreed that this was fateful).

At this point instead of recognising that Casey was a certain style of rider (ex dirt tracker) and his success on the bike may have been attributable to this they put Marco on who doesn't have that type of background. He rode some junior motocross but it was not his forte, he didn’t achieve any great results in dirt riding. There was an interim period where they went ahead despite having contrary information.

My point is they made a decision with their heart and not their heads and Marco’s wretched time with Ducati resulted. I’ve only been on this forum a short time but I’ve espoused the virtues of Nicki as a potential Ducati rider for some time (on other sites), based on his excellent past as a dirt tracker.

Anyway, Marco is team green from round 12 and Sete will be back.
For someone who's been following motogp for so long I'd expect a better grasp of the facts. Valentino was in talks with Ducati in the 2003 silly season. He then chose to go to Yam. Nothing to do with this at all.
And no they did not make a decision with their hearts rather than their heads (already a departure from your previous comment that they made a decision based on nationality) simply because Marco was contracted to Ducati for two years BEFORE Stoner actually joined on for what was initially supposed to be one year. True Casey's riding style is perfect for the Duc, but Ducati had already made their bed by then and therefore had to sleep in it.

Bikergirl

I think choosing on nationality - not riding background is a heart (not head decision)

I believe a contract entered into but not commenced is easier to escape than one part performed however this is not a time for a dissertation on contract law.

I stand corrected.

HOWEVER, I threw this out not to be tested on the subject area, really I just like moidaboikes and didn't do my PhD in the subject, I guess I thought comments along the lines of, "Marco will do good things at Kawasaki or he's going from the frying pan to the fire" were what I was looking for - Not roasted Andy.

If you live in Australia I have a mate who is a doctor who will prescribe you some "chill pills". You need to settle down.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bikergirl @ Jul 15 2008, 01:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>For someone who's been following motogp for so long I'd expect a better grasp of the facts. Valentino was in talks with Ducati in the 2003 silly season. He then chose to go to Yam. Nothing to do with this at all.
And no they did not make a decision with their hearts rather than their heads (already a departure from your previous comment that they made a decision based on nationality) simply because Marco was contracted to Ducati for two years BEFORE Stoner actually joined on for what was initially supposed to be one year. True Casey's riding style is perfect for the Duc, but Ducati had already made their bed by then and therefore had to sleep in it.

the ducati-melandri marriage was only iron-clad after MM finished on the podium at laguna seca '07.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andy Roo @ Jul 15 2008, 08:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>If you live in Australia I have a mate who is a doctor who will prescribe you some "chill pills". You need to settle down.

we need lots of those here

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andy Roo @ Jul 15 2008, 02:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>HOWEVER, I threw this out not to be tested on the subject area, really I just like moidaboikes and didn't do my PhD in the subject, I guess I thought comments along the lines of, "Marco will do good things at Kawasaki or he's going from the frying pan to the fire" were what I was looking for - Not roasted Andy.

If you live in Australia I have a mate who is a doctor who will prescribe you some "chill pills". You need to settle down.
settle down??? moi? really...any more settled and i'd be in a coma. nah...just picking on newbies is my new hobby.
So if your phd isnt in 'moidaboikes', what's it in??

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andy Roo @ Jul 15 2008, 12:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Bikergirl
I believe a contract entered into but not commenced is easier to escape than one part performed however this is not a time for a dissertation on contract law.
I gather you are well-informed in these matters. I had not realised how malleable these contracts seem to be until the recent marco situation; there seem to be all sorts of get-out clauses, bonus clauses and penalty clauses. I am definitely not a lawyer, and I am not sure even which country's laws if any apply and whether this varies according to the nationality of the team and/or rider. As you say, probably not the most interesting topic for this forum.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Jul 15 2008, 10:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I gather you are well-informed in these matters. I had not realised how malleable these contracts seem to be until the recent marco situation; there seem to be all sorts of get-out clauses, bonus clauses and penalty clauses. I am definitely not a lawyer, and I am not sure even which country's laws if any apply and whether this varies according to the nationality of the team and/or rider. As you say, probably not the most interesting topic for this forum.


.........
You used the word Malleable and can spell it apparently.
You must be a lawyer.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Frizzle @ Jul 15 2008, 02:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>.........
You used the word Malleable and can spell it apparently.
You must be a lawyer.
No he's not. My lawyer radar doesn't beep when Michaelm is around (though I do sometimes go up in a rash...hmmm....)

I think there's gonna be quite a lot of shuffling at the end of the grid. Melandri is gonna be on green bike until end of year, and if he does well he'll stay, but what if he sucks as much as with the red bike? all his victories and titles are worth squat now, he's back to zero.

The Nicky to Ducati might happen, but what if Gibernau does well, will they keep ole Gibs or take the chance with a new rider??

West will be out, and Elias and Guintoli maybe also. There's new guys knocking on the door, Bautista, Simoncelli, Spies ...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teomolca @ Jul 15 2008, 02:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think there's gonna be quite a lot of shuffling at the end of the grid. Melandri is gonna be on green bike until end of year, and if he does well he'll stay, but what if he sucks as much as with the red bike? all his victories and titles are worth squat now, he's back to zero.

The Nicky to Ducati might happen, but what if Gibernau does well, will they keep ole Gibs or take the chance with a new rider??

West will be out, and Elias and Guintoli maybe also. There's new guys knocking on the door, Bautista, Simoncelli, Spies ...
True enough about Melandri, which is why he needs to get out of Duc NOW, even if he ends up bikeless till the end of the season. Each race is a further nail in his coffin at this point. Poor M.
If Gib does well it doesn't change the fact he's bloody old and has a clapped out shoulder. Don't forget that Ducati have Canepa. Whether they throw him at Motogp or SBK remains to be seen.
As for West, he's gotta go. "Aspar" wants a duc for Bautista though with D'antin out of the picture it seems Ducati will be keeping a tight rein on the Alice team, using it as a 'junior' team to bring on younger riders. They have talked to Kallio. They have considered Aoyama. They have talked to Simoncelli (who has also apparently been considered for the Yam Tech 3) although Valentino thinks his young friend would do better to stay in 250 for a while yet, mainly based on the assumption that it's better to win a title than not win it. Though with the way he's going it seems Sic is on the fast lane to Motogp without letting Vale down

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bikergirl @ Jul 15 2008, 12:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>No he's not. My lawyer radar doesn't beep when Michaelm is around (though I do sometimes go up in a rash...hmmm....)
Sprung. Although if I tried to treat a skin rash I would very likely get sued now.

Go Spies!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xx CURVE xx @ Jul 15 2008, 02:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Go Spies!
And you like ham. Yes. We know

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bikergirl @ Jul 15 2008, 07:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>And you like ham. Yes. We know

i LOVE a women that knows me