Stoner Retiring!

stiefel said:

It's a rather big leap from clinical psychology (which to my opinion very much follows the scientific method) to HRM (where I would wholeheartedly agree the lable 'pseudoscience' applies more often than not).



Fact is, clinical psychology deduces testable hypothesis from standing theories and applies quite rigorous empirical testing. The discipline as a whole has some problems (both in the good and the bad sense) but I would not agree with your opinion about it being pseudoscience.



HRM and what you call 'management theory'...well, let's just say I know more of it than I would like to. It's not all bad, there enough subdisciplines in the management field that use the scientific method. There is also a lot of post-modern, deconstructivist rubbish which I readily admit could be very well classified as pseudo-science.

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basspete said:

All 3?

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michaelm said:

My prejudice against psychology is decades old and against one particular university department with which 2 of my siblings who are rather intelligent were not impressed. If you are a psychologist things have obviously changed. I actually didn't mind the psychology subject in my undergraduate degree, long ago though that was.

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JohnnyKnockdown said:

Somehow, poking a beehive with a stick never gets old for me.





Your orb is working once again



I did understand your Pavlov reference.

What you were trying to say is that all dogs lick their balls because they can, but the proverbial wonder dog refuses to lick his balls even though he can. He resists the warmth of his tongue lapping across his taint even though it is infinitly pleasurable because he possesses free will and feels no need for warm balls, or conforming like the rest of the ball lappers.



I find the reference personally amusing (and blasphemous for a raised Catholic. A dog with free will? Thats poking Dogma with a stick)



The reason I find it amusing is that I believe the old adage that men are dogs. We humans do possess free will unlike other creatures who act only on instinct. As I watch the behavior of men I realize that we act mostly upon instinct and that we are not much different then dogs. Observe a ..... in heat around male dogs and compare that to a scantily clad woman that walks into a room full of men.

The results are similar yet more subtle for us 2 legged creatures.

You point out that we should respect and understand his reasons for retiring. But what are the reasons behind his reasons. We all use our own sensibilities and passions to try to understand. Most of us are so stupidly passionate about the sport we spend hours on the internet discussing it and cannot fathom why he would walk away.

The Aussies defend it because they are emulating their countries largest population, sheep. Their is not a critical thought amongst them.

I believe the reasons behind the reasons are what Jumkie said. Casey is an introvert. Its common knowledge that hes pretty reserved and has few friends in the paddock.

An introvert hates the limelight,hates being around too many people, hates having to deal with people,hates confrontation. An introvert has comfort zones, some are physical places, some are people.

Hes pushed his own boundaries perhaps his entire career. Im not saying his personality is requiring him to quit, rather that he has won enough to be content with his legacy to retreat to his comfort zone.

Im not saying I agree with his decision 100%.

Im ok with him quitting racing because he feels he has rounded off his career. I just dont think retreating into obscurity is the healthiest enviornment for an introvert, and I hope he finds some other way to continue to push his personal boundaries.

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Keshav said:

Been to London a few times and haven't forgotten the all-pervading smell of car exhaust. NY air is cleaner by far. Probably has something to do with the fact that our subway (and all other public transportation) runs 24 hours a day, unlike London where it shuts down at 11:00 pm.

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Jumkie said:

Good post 22. We do get carried away. Chalk it up to the nature of a forum.

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Mental Anarchist said:

If that is the case, if Stoner wasn't riding it who could have won a championship on it? I will let you pick from any rider who has ever raced Motorcycles competitively.

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chopperman said:

London is a .... hole with lots of pollution. Thankfully i don't live anywhere near London !

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chopperman said:

Loris Capirossi was on the road to a championship on the duc before he was taken out and injured !

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birdman said:

Someone needs to crap on CRT, they are crap. They are poor mans Superbikes atm. The problem is not the CRT teams themeselves, its the un-imaginative bean counters in charge of motogp. Strict four cylinder rules are boring. Is a single one of them even a motorcycle enthusiast? Could've fooled me, they act like politicians. The solution to every problem is a stupid new rule.



I very rarely agree with Chopperman, but I have to admitt he was right about something. CRT would be much more interesting if they allowed turbo-charging and super-charging while they are at it. Also allow two strokes up to 1000cc. Then its one rule for all, they all must run under 21 Litres and 6 engines per year. Absolutely no confusion then , its a true prototype series.



Chopperman how would that work out? Turbo's chew through more fuel and wear faster I assume. Would a turbo 1000 and a pnuematic valve 1000 bassically end up with similar power because of the fuel limit and engine limits or is the turbo going to kill it? Also the two stroke would have to be around 600cc I assume, again due to the fuel, firing at twice the rate etc.

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chopperman said:

Loris Capirossi was on the road to a championship on the duc before he was taken out and injured !

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mylexicon said:

Everyone is susceptible to stress. Whether or not someone perseveres through a stressful career depends on the nature of stress. Is it good stress that releases endorphines and gives someone a sense of satisfaction? or is it bad stress from interpersonal conflict and institutional conflict that eats away at individual well-being? The psychological, physical, and emotional stimuli that sustained Stoner through the first six years of his MGP career have disappeared. He has an uncommon view of life and the world around him, which means his moods will ebb and flow differently than everyone else.



Pretty much everyone in the paddock is just money, wins, power, crumpet, and fame. Predictable. Under-35 male demographic, we never really grow out of it completely. Casey is obviously not motivated by money, wins, power or fame (he's got crumpet), which makes him uncontrollable.



When Pavlov rings the bell, Casey doesn't salivate. Is that weakness? If he only salivates for caviar, not dogfood, I'd say he is spoiled and weak. If he has no respect for Pavlov and the degredation of his fellow dogs, I'd not classify him as weak. Casey clearly functions according to the latter scenario, and the result is predictable: BAD DOG, CASEY! HOW DARE YOU NOT RESPOND TO OUR BUSINESS MODEL?!



Since everyone perceives him to be just another talented rider, and b/c they project their own attributes or conventional attributes on to him, their reasoning about him is suspect, from his alleged mental weakness to his alleged need for "caviar" technical regulations. Everyone should stop with the projection, and simply listen to the words coming out of his mouth. He hates the game. He feels it has become corrupt and dehumanizing. In 2013, when the GPC rings the bell, Casey will not show.

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#22 said:

I did once, NEVER again!!!!!









Thats a point, but wasn't the 800 Ducati a bit of a different animal to the 990? I;ve noticed that most riders like Bayliss, Gib, Checa etc all seemed 'fairly' competitive on the 990, but when it went to 800's no-one but Stoner could ride it

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chopperman said:

Loris Capirossi was on the road to a championship on the duc before he was taken out and injured !

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michaelm said:

Not on a 2007 ducati he wasn't. Speculation and hypothesis are also obviously only a problem when indulged in by stoner fans.

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Mr Squiggle said:

Great example....in 2007 he finished 7th in the championship 200 points shy of Stoner on exactly the same bike....how exactly would that qualify him as someone who could win the 2007 championship on a Ducati?

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chopperman said:

didn't think the question was about the 07 bike exclusively. Thought it just said the Ducati !

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mylexicon said:

Everyone is susceptible to stress. Whether or not someone perseveres through a stressful career depends on the nature of stress. Is it good stress that releases endorphines and gives someone a sense of satisfaction? or is it bad stress from interpersonal conflict and institutional conflict that eats away at individual well-being? The psychological, physical, and emotional stimuli that sustained Stoner through the first six years of his MGP career have disappeared. He has an uncommon view of life and the world around him, which means his moods will ebb and flow differently than everyone else.



Pretty much everyone in the paddock is just money, wins, power, crumpet, and fame. Predictable. Under-35 male demographic, we never really grow out of it completely. Casey is obviously not motivated by money, wins, power or fame (he's got crumpet), which makes him uncontrollable.



When Pavlov rings the bell, Casey doesn't salivate. Is that weakness? If he only salivates for caviar, not dogfood, I'd say he is spoiled and weak. If he has no respect for Pavlov and the degredation of his fellow dogs, I'd not classify him as weak. Casey clearly functions according to the latter scenario, and the result is predictable: BAD DOG, CASEY! HOW DARE YOU NOT RESPOND TO OUR BUSINESS MODEL?!



Since everyone perceives him to be just another talented rider, and b/c they project their own attributes or conventional attributes on to him, their reasoning about him is suspect, from his alleged mental weakness to his alleged need for "caviar" technical regulations. Everyone should stop with the projection, and simply listen to the words coming out of his mouth. He hates the game. He feels it has become corrupt and dehumanizing. In 2013, when the GPC rings the bell, Casey will not show.

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mad mick said:

A bitter bopper with his blinkers and fluorescent yellow thong on will never give up. They just can't bring themselves to admit that some farm boy (and not their flamboyant and glossy rock star) won the championship on a Duck fair and square. You can't just say the guy did a great job and deserved it. There's always excuses to cut the kid down and diminish his achievements. Dear oh dear. No wonder he wants out - sick of all the pathetic rock-star worshiping whores that thrive on image, rather than pure talent.

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