**SPOILER** Jerez Race

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Mar 26 2007, 12:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Whatever Roger,when someone from your country makes the field,then you can show your ....


Oh dear, Rogers touched a nerve....

Rogers point wasnt that Hayboy is American, his point was that for the last 2 races he has been crap. Personally, I dont care where any rider is from, but if he rides like a donut, he rides like a donut.

And Hayboys last races he has ridden like a donut.


Pete

Why would Rog want to show you his ...?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (basspete @ Mar 26 2007, 11:11 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Why would Rog want to show you his ...?

Maybe Rogers got a nice ...?

Well, the race didnt really live up to expectations for me - especially considering how close qual was.

Rossi obviously played a blinder, and crushed everyone - it's a shame Dani boy wasnt quicker - a last show down would have been cool (Wheres Gibernau when you need him!!??).

Dani & Colin both rode solid races............nowt special imo, although it was nice to see Colin higher up than normal.

Gutted for Hopper, he looked like he had a really good set-up and was putting in some quick laps before he binned it.

Elias was superb, knife through hot butter Checca & Stoner both had solid races too.

Hayden really shocked me. When he blasted from 11th to 4th.........I though hell, this is gonna make the race interesting & the forum busy! But it didnt materialise unfortuntaley, and he dropped like a lead ballon.

Best quote was from Hayden, "somthing was wrong with my fuel, but I dont want to go making excuses"..................WTF.............thats a contridiction if I ever heard one! Tell you, he;s got a copy of 101 Excuses, by Max Biaggi.

4 freaking weeks to wait now

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BEN @ Mar 26 2007, 11:51 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Best quote was from Hayden, "somthing was wrong with my fuel, but I dont want to go making excuses"..................WTF.............thats a contridiction if I ever heard one! Tell you, he;s got a copy of 101 Excuses, by Max Biaggi.
now that's funny

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Maybe Rogers got a nice ...?
yes i do

It was a very tough race for everyone, never have I seen such close grid times. I've also never seen Rossi push so hard, his back tyre has never lifted off the ground so much. Hopper looked so promising but it was the same old ...., Elias and Stoner showed great character, Hayden really needs to adapt or he will be eaten alive.

It seems it will be a very tough season for everyone. The racing is so close in terms of lap times and I cant wait to see the races at the tracks that have been known for tight racing.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BEN @ Mar 26 2007, 11:51 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Maybe Rogers got a nice ...?

Hmmm.....

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Mar 26 2007, 12:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'> now that's funny
yes i do
Prove it!

No way it's nicer than Nicky boy's......

One boring race, especially from the top 3. Was expecting more from Pedrosa, since it was in front of his home crowd.
Good ride by Elias and Checa. Stoner is showing great improvement so far. Hopper........well, for a moment I thought he was gonna give his bike another karate lesson........thank god it didn't happen.
Hayden.........i'm at lost for words. But must say the most disappointing for me so far is Loris Capirossi. C'mon Capi, we know you gonna be a daddy soon but we miss seeing you fighting up front. So better buck up for the next race.
Congrats to all 3 podium finishes.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ros @ Mar 26 2007, 12:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>One boring race, especially from the top 3. Was expecting more from Pedrosa, since it was in front of his home crowd.
Good ride by Elias and Checa. Stoner is showing great improvement so far. Hopper........well, for a moment I thought he was gonna give his bike another karate lesson........thank god it didn't happen.
Hayden.........i'm at lost for words. But must say the most disappointing for me so far is Loris Capirossi. C'mon Capi, we know you gonna be a daddy soon but we miss seeing you fighting up front. So better buck up for the next race.
Congrats to all 3 podium finishes.

Question for the Haydonettes...


Why is it that when Edwards gets his arse kicked by the other Yamaha, he's crap and shouldnt be there, but when Hayden is made to look a total .... by the other Honda's (<u>note the plural</u>) then a. the bike was designed for Pedrosa b. His clutch is crap. c. there was a problem with the fuel.

Nevermind lifting his own game, Hayboys gonna have to hope that the others dont lift their game and guys like Hopper et all can stay on, coz if they do all stay on, they will be in front of him consistantly (theres a word coming back to haunt him) this year.

Wake up call for Hayboy, an HRC Honda is very rarely crap, and when your team mate is banging in the results, it's not a good omen.


Pete

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (basspete @ Mar 26 2007, 01:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Question for the Haydonettes...
Why is it that when Edwards gets his arse kicked by the other Yamaha, he's crap and shouldnt be there, but when Hayden is made to look a total .... by the other Honda's (<u>note the plural</u>) then a. the bike was designed for Pedrosa b. His clutch is crap. c. there was a problem with the fuel.

Nevermind lifting his own game, Hayboys gonna have to hope that the others dont lift their game and guys like Hopper et all can stay on, coz if they do all stay on, they will be in front of him consistantly (theres a word coming back to haunt him) this year.

Wake up call for Hayboy, an HRC Honda is very rarely crap, and when your team mate is banging in the results, it's not a good omen.
Pete

Agree with you Pete...somehow some people can do no wrong. Even when they do. Hang on...why does this remind me of something??

Hey Roger,Italy and the Uk have virtually identical population and they dont seem to have any problem fielding riders.Dont make excuses,you dont like Hayden because of where he is from.Someday when your country gets a rider in the field i will say bad things about him for no reason.Hang in there buddy,there is allways soccer

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (basspete @ Mar 26 2007, 08:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Question for the Haydonettes...

I see you quoting me there...........do i sound like a Haydonette?

Well, well, well. It is good to see Valentino on such good form. It is still very early in the season and anything can happen, at least he seems to have a decent bike this year. Pedrosa rode valiantly, but Rossi was not to be denied. Colin Edwards finally put in the performance I knew he was capable of (about time ). Nicky hayden jumped to fourth position and I thought "here we go, Nicky's showing some testicular fortitude!". Nicky's fourth place position lasted until he felt the heat from Hopper and he slowly faded backward. Sometimes playing it safe just wont cut it. I think he just doesnt like to fight for the position he wants. Sometimes you need to do the decent thing and push hard and if you happen to crash then so be it. I read in other discussions where Hayden should have gone to Ducati and I disagree. If you watch Ducati's choice in riders they tend to go for guys that will push and go for results even when they clearly do not have the bike to win. The point being they can take some crashing (and even expect it from time to time) as long as the rider shows he has some speed and a passion for racing. Rossi showed his quality today, I think last year he was forced to mix it up too often (front end chatter) and his season' results reflected this. There is no doubt in my mind that Rossi is the best rider in the modern era. We have seen what he can do on superior machinery, then when he left Honda he still won on the same yamaha that Biaggi declared unrideable. When Yamaha delivered the 2006 bike it was an absolute disaster, that prompted them to switch to the 2005 chassis, and he still came within a hairsbreath of winning. The Rossi haters will make all sorts of accusations and claim that the Yamaha has been as good as the Honda, and they are all full of rubbish. It takes a winner to do what he did last year and come close to winning the title. The true measure of a man is not how he wins, but how he responds after he experiences defeat. We see how Rossi has responded so far. Hopefully for Hayden' sake he can respond better than he has but it seems unlikely.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Mar 26 2007, 01:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Hey Roger,Italy and the Uk have virtually identical population and they dont seem to have any problem fielding riders.Dont make excuses,you dont like Hayden because of where he is from.Someday when your country gets a rider in the field i will say bad things about him for no reason.Hang in there buddy,there is allways soccer
who's making excusses ?
and where have i said i dont like americans ?
and you can say what you like about the english, am i bovvered....nah

1458:attachment]

and good points frome basspete and ogunski

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Mar 26 2007, 09:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>who's making excusses ?
and where have i said i dont like americans ?
and you can say what you like about the english, am i bovvered....nah

1458:attachment]

and good points frome basspete and ogunski


^^^^Cheers matey! That's a very impressive finger you have there. Let me guess, you are either a proctologist, or a gynechologist. Am I right?

on the face of it, pretty boring race but interesting to watch rossi up the pace several times and pedrosa responding on the next lap, i think the wee man ran out of tyres or strength or something, more than likely rossi just rode better on worn tyres.

rossi - perfect, masterful from the start, the doc's back. loved the bowling stunt.

pedrosa - anyone who says dani could've rode better needs their head looked at. frustatingly close and tenacious in pursuit, just not enough tyre/fitness at the end but a truly great ride. needs to work on his braking

edwards - best gp ride ever from him apart from donny 04, can he maintain that sort of performance though?

elias - too ragged, too little too late but still a solid ride. another guy i get frustrated with because i think he could've got on the podium.

stoner - well i called it totally wrong, still he rode sensibly and he should still be encouraged by 5th considering the circumstance.

checa - good result, that'll do his confidence no harm, only problem is with carlos when he gets too confident he pushes very hard and can be a bit crashey.

hayden - poor nicky, you gotta feel for the guy if you've got an ounce of humanity in you. he came out fighting and made a better start than anybody, he's been having problems with confidence in the front and i think after trying to over-ride the thing in the early stages of the race his tyres were basically scrap. nicky's in big trouble.

outside these seven guys nobody really impressed me that much.

what a long wait we've got till the next one

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ros @ Mar 26 2007, 01:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I see you quoting me there...........do i sound like a Haydonette?


Not with that name mate!

Pete

An interesting turn this thread has taken, suggesting that Hayden can apparently do no wrong. I don't know what forum those who think that are reading...

If it's not one of of the holy trinity (basspete, roger-m and baldylocks for those playing at home), then someone with some kind of variation on the "Vale you are my God, can I fellate you now?" handle is always around to take Hayden to task and quick to point out his shortcomings. Take a look through the Qatar and Jerez practice and race threads. Sometimes it's the only comment in the post and is nothing more than "suck .... Hayden (and Hayden fans)." Everyone is well aware of the .... start to the season that Hayden's having, but thanks for reminding us all again and again and again, if, on the off chance, it might have slipped our minds...

As for basspete's ABC of Haydonette excuses:

a. has been soundly debunked by Bikergirl's list of rider sizes, etc. and should be called out by anyone and everyone as a crackpot theory; more to the point it was always a loony conspiracy theory. Puig maybe a heavyweight at Repsol, and in Spanish circles, but at the boardroom level in HRC Japan he's just another gaijin to smile uncomfortably at, while the Japanese go on doing their thing. In a sport where accidents like Doohan's, Rainey's and Kato's can happen, why would you put all your eggs in one basket anyway? (Yamaha do, but that's another story.)

b. the clutch that almost cost him the 2006 championship? or something about 2007? Now I'm hardly one to be lecturing about resurrecting old topics (apparently), but let's put 2006 to bed, shall we? If there's a problem in 2007 with the clutch it's the first I've heard of it...

c. the fuel line? Ben called this one right. Can Nicky spell contradiction? However, ALL riders do this, to a greater or lesser extent--and usually Hayden isn't guilty of such double talk. To be honest, I think Max's manual of excuses has been passed on to another Italian...

Because the guy who apparently can do no wrong is Melandri: only 9th after being fastest in the warm-up, having your teammate--who made a terrible start--pass you and finish fourth on a lesser bike. The only response on the forum so far has been puzzlement, and excuses... nothing critical.

Capirossi (only 3 world championship points for the year?) seems to be getting a free pass at the moment for the ridiculous reason that he's going to be a father (Can't focus 100% on your racing? If that's really the case--and I doubt it--he should stay off the track until he stops thinking about 2:00am feedings and buying Wiggles CDs at inoppurtune moments, like, say, going 270km/h and braking 10cms behind another rider).

Hopkins throwing away fourth place (because of his obssession with a podium) has everyone expressing sorrow, but nothing critical, is another that springs to mind.

I guess some guys are just a lightning rod for criticism.

So, do I think you're all being unfair on Hayden? Yes, and... no. Yes, because he's far from the only guy underperforming and/or not making the most of his opportunities. No, because, he is underperforming. Just remember he's not the only one.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Rising Sun @ Mar 26 2007, 12:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>An interesting turn this thread has taken, suggesting that Hayden can apparently do no wrong. I don't know what forum those who think that are reading...

If it's not one of of the holy trinity (basspete, roger-m and baldylocks for those playing at home), then someone with some kind of variation on the "Vale you are my God, can I fellate you now?" handle is always around to take Hayden to task and quick to point out his shortcomings. Take a look through the Qatar and Jerez practice and race threads. Sometimes it's the only comment in the post and is nothing more than "suck .... Hayden (and Hayden fans)." Everyone is well aware of the .... start to the season that Hayden's having, but thanks for reminding us all again and again and again, if, on the off chance, it might have slipped our minds...

As for basspete's ABC of Haydonette excuses:

a. has been soundly debunked by Bikergirl's list of rider sizes, etc. and should be called out by anyone and everyone as a crackpot theory; more to the point it was always a loony conspiracy theory. Puig maybe a heavyweight at Repsol, and in Spanish circles, but at the boardroom level in HRC Japan he's just another gaijin to smile uncomfortably at, while the Japanese go on doing their thing. In a sport where accidents like Doohan's, Rainey's and Kato's can happen, why would you put all your eggs in one basket anyway? (Yamaha do, but that's another story.)

b. the clutch that almost cost him the 2006 championship? or something about 2007? Now I'm hardly one to be lecturing about resurrecting old topics (apparently), but let's put 2006 to bed, shall we? If there's a problem in 2007 with the clutch it's the first I've heard of it...

c. the fuel line? Ben called this one right. Can Nicky spell contradiction? However, ALL riders do this, to a greater or lesser extent--and usually Hayden isn't guilty of such double talk. To be honest, I think Max's manual of excuses has been passed on to another Italian...

Because the guy who apparently can do no wrong is Melandri: only 9th after being fastest in the warm-up, having your teammate--who made a terrible start--pass you and finish fourth on a lesser bike. The only response on the forum so far has been puzzlement, and excuses... nothing critical.

Capirossi (only 3 world championship points for the year?) seems to be getting a free pass at the moment for the ridiculous reason that he's going to be a father (Can't focus 100% on your racing? If that's really the case--and I doubt it--he should stay off the track until he stops thinking about 2:00am feedings and buying Wiggles CDs at inoppurtune moments, like, say, going 270km/h and braking 10cms behind another rider).

Hopkins throwing away fourth place (because of his obssession with a podium) has everyone expressing sorrow, but nothing critical, is another that springs to mind.

I guess some guys are just a lightning rod for criticism.

So, do I think you're all being unfair on Hayden? Yes, and... no. Yes, because he's far from the only guy underperforming and/or not making the most of his opportunities. No, because, he is underperforming. Just remember he's not the only one.

^^^I understand what you are saying about Hayden receiving criticism. I am not a Hayden fan, I am a Rossi fan, however I do want to see Hayden do better that he has this season. So far he has not delivered at all. There was talk during the off season of him being more motivated than ever before but I don see it. The talk is that his tires went off, well the truth of the matter is that everyones tires went off not just his. He just doesnt seem to have the ability or desire to fight back when someone passes him.

The criticism has to be expected because he wears the number one plate. When you are number one you should expect criticism when all you can manage during the first two races of the season is a seventh and an eighth place finish when you ride the factory Honda bike. Everuone has had to adjust their riding styles to suit the smaller lighter machines. You cannot always look for an engineer when things dont work exactly as you wish, he needs to ride around problems. A prime example of this is my main man "steady" Eddie Lawson. The legendary tuner Erv Kanemoto called Eddie his favorite rider because he would simply ride around the bikes existing problems.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (basspete @ Mar 26 2007, 01:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Question for the Haydonettes...
Why is it that when Edwards gets his arse kicked by the other Yamaha, he's crap and shouldnt be there, but when Hayden is made to look a total .... by the other Honda's (<u>note the plural</u>) then a. the bike was designed for Pedrosa b. His clutch is crap. c. there was a problem with the fuel.

...because hayden is fit


no, hayden was consistent last year despite problems with the bike. edwards tends to do well in practise and just go backwards in the race, despite the bike not having major problems, such as the clutch or whatever it may be.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ogunski @ Mar 27 2007, 01:36 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The criticism has to be expected because he wears the number one plate.
I figured someone would bring this up. As defending world champion there should be an expectation that you mount a credible defence of your title, so I agree with this to a some extent--and I did say that I thought Hayden's performances warranted criticism.

But shouldn't that only go so far? You don't get any points in 2007 for being number one in 2006. Everyone starts (in theory) on equal ground at the beginning of a season.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ogunski @ Mar 27 2007, 01:36 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Everyone has had to adjust their riding styles to suit the smaller lighter machines.
The two who seem to be having the most problem with this are Hayden and Capirossi. [After testing the 800cc bike in Motegi last year, Capirossi said the new bikes were going to require a significant change in riding style, and he's obviously still struggling with it.] But look at the differing response from the forum... I would've thought Capirossi was expected to be as serious a title contender for this year (if not more) than Hayden.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ogunski @ Mar 27 2007, 01:36 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You cannot always look for an engineer when things dont work exactly as you wish ... The legendary tuner Erv Kanemoto called Eddie his favorite rider because he would simply ride around the bikes existing problems.
Lawson is a legend, no doubt, but I'm not so sure this was a good example for your point!

Eddie might have ridden around the problems on the unwieldy beast that was the '89 Honda, but he didn't start winning on it until he and Erv had worked their combined magic.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ogunski @ Mar 26 2007, 05:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>^^^I understand what you are saying about Hayden receiving criticism. I am not a Hayden fan, I am a Rossi fan, however I do want to see Hayden do better that he has this season. So far he has not delivered at all. There was talk during the off season of him being more motivated than ever before but I don see it. The talk is that his tires went off, well the truth of the matter is that everyones tires went off not just his. He just doesnt seem to have the ability or desire to fight back when someone passes him.

The criticism has to be expected because he wears the number one plate. When you are number one you should expect criticism when all you can manage during the first two races of the season is a seventh and an eighth place finish when you ride the factory Honda bike.


Very well put mate, the Haydonettes had great fun with the whole "Rossi folded under pressure" stuff last year, so you can bet were gonna have some fun watching Hayboy fold under the pressure of having the No1 plate.

Anyone who reads my, Rog, Baldy or Jumkies posts can surely see that theres an element of having a laugh at each others expense, and I think calling Me Rog and Baldy the holy trinity is a compliment.

Plenty of us on here have said that Hayboy doesn't appear to have the fight of the other guys, just as ogunski has pointed out, he doesn't seem to fight back when attacked. And at the time (last season) I got some stick from the less consistant (ie dissapeared after a few weeks) hayboy fans.


Pete