Sepang....

Next week the BS stops and we start prepping for a great new season. Best of luck to everyone.

Suzuki have been winter champs a couple of times and it has rarely produced anything. Don't get too amped about Sepang, they looked really good at Sepang last year.

Wait for the 1000s to return. Suzuki will be in much better shape in 2012.

Yes and no. They now have a fairly decent GP rider and the bike tested well last fall. History shows they field a decent bike in the spring test and then develop it into a loser.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Jan 30 2010, 11:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Yes and no. They now have a fairly decent GP rider and the bike tested well last fall. History shows they field a decent bike in the spring test and then develop it into a loser.

IMO Suzuki just let the rest of them keep inching ahead, as soon as they get close they seem to stop development or go backwards. Big shame, they may surprise though as history tends to repeat and the Suzuki 500 in 1999-2000 came out of nowhere as the one to beat.

Suzuki has sucked .... in motogp since day one..they will continue to suck .... im sad to say.

Well I didn't start the Sepang test topic to talk about Suzuki just so you know that is sure to be a dead end. That part is just a bit of a joke. I'm interested in the whole thing. How the new riders show and everything else. I'm pumped about hearing the bikes on the track and I just dropped 20 E on the video pass.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Jan 30 2010, 09:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Well I didn't start the Sepang test topic to talk about Suzuki just so you know that is sure to be a dead end. That part is just a bit of a joke. I'm interested in the whole thing. How the new riders show and everything else. I'm pumped about hearing the bikes on the track and I just dropped 20 E on the video pass.


im waiting for the 2010 pac to come up.. 20E for a couple hours vid aint worth it.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xx CURVE xx @ Jan 30 2010, 09:32 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>im waiting for the 2010 pac to come up.. 20E for a couple hours vid aint worth it.

Agreed... I'll wait for the Season's pack. Even 'Classics' pack is not worth it because it expires, was great idea to revive old amazing racing, but crappy greed from Duhrna.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Jan 30 2010, 10:18 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Agreed... I'll wait for the Season's pack. Even 'Classics' pack is not worth it because it expires, was great idea to revive old amazing racing, but crappy greed from Duhrna.

yeah thats some ........ right there...at one time on the site you could go back many years to recap on races and that was included with the season pass.. now you have to pay for just one race..dorna sucks .....

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Jan 30 2010, 07:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Well I didn't start the Sepang test topic to talk about Suzuki just so you know that is sure to be a dead end. That part is just a bit of a joke. I'm interested in the whole thing. How the new riders show and everything else. I'm pumped about hearing the bikes on the track and I just dropped 20 E on the video pass.

The thread is titled "Sepang.........and a return to competitiveness of Suzuki???", right?

Sepang =

Suzuki's never-ending tribulations =

Maybe you meant for it to be about Sepang, but Suzuki is much more interesting.

Though, I am looking forward to Sepang for 2010 b/c I want to see if the new firing order has really helped Nicky get his head around the Ducati. I've been down on him a lot over the last 3 years b/c his performance has been dreadful, but he's always been a quality rider on a 600 so I'm kind of hoping that he has been dealing with bike/tire issues. Honda 2007 RC212V was awful. Michelins weren't quite up to snuff in 2008, plus Hayden was developing the underachieving pneumatic engine. In 2009 he was attempting to tame the bike no one could tame (he failed).

If the big surprise for 2010 is that Hayden and Dovi finally find speed, I will consider this upcoming season a great success. In all honesty, since they announced the return to 1000cc, I've been trying to convince myself just to tune in and countdown the races. If 2010 offers real entertainment I'll be over the moon.

If the 990 trend continues, the 800s will be awesome to behold in their final season, then we will all cry about their untimely demise.

I for one really hope to see Hayden back to form. People forget he is a really good rider. We all know the basic four will be up there in the times but I think the important thing is to see whom will be the X factors this year. I for one really hope we have a barnburner of a season and that means also to see Suzuki get up there in the mix as well. Although I am doubtful they will but ya just never know.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Jan 30 2010, 06:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The thread is titled "Sepang.........and a return to competitiveness of Suzuki???", right?

Sepang =

Suzuki's never-ending tribulations =

Maybe you meant for it to be about Sepang, but Suzuki is much more interesting.

Though, I am looking forward to Sepang for 2010 b/c I want to see if the new firing order has really helped Nicky get his head around the Ducati. I've been down on him a lot over the last 3 years b/c his performance has been dreadful, but he's always been a quality rider on a 600 so I'm kind of hoping that he has been dealing with bike/tire issues. Honda 2007 RC212V was awful. Michelins weren't quite up to snuff in 2008, plus Hayden was developing the underachieving pneumatic engine. In 2009 he was attempting to tame the bike no one could tame (he failed).

If the big surprise for 2010 is that Hayden and Dovi finally find speed, I will consider this upcoming season a great success. In all honesty, since they announced the return to 1000cc, I've been trying to convince myself just to tune in and countdown the races. If 2010 offers real entertainment I'll be over the moon.

If the 990 trend continues, the 800s will be awesome to behold in their final season, then we will all cry about their untimely demise.

Well I'll talk about Suzuki's state of affairs any time but it seems to just bring one liners from the rest of the crew.

The Ducati is going to be even better this year. I am always amazed by Ducati's success for such a small company.

Dovi and Hayden have to fight for points this year with a good crop of new comers. That is what makes Sepang so interesting. How will the 250 guys place? To think that Spies is just going to fight for top ten is crazy. Simoncelli will be strong. Depending on the GS Bautista will be up there. There is a lot of stuff to shake out this test.

Honda have taken a lot of tech help from Yamaha and now use Magneti Marelli (something Suzuki could take a lesson from). I think their bike will be top notch this year.

http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/racing/mot...maha-engineers/

So Yamaha lose out to Honda there big-time so to see whether that really affects the Rossi magic will be interesting. It will affect Spies, Lorenzo and Edwards also.

It all makes for a season where everyone will be fairly close I hope. And I think you may be right about the demise of the 800's. It may just be another stupid mistake. I think it will be. Back to dragsters...just isn't right.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Jan 30 2010, 05:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Well I'll talk about Suzuki's state of affairs any time but it seems to just bring one liners from the rest of the crew.

The Ducati is going to be even better this year. I am always amazed by Ducati's success for such a small company.

Dovi and Hayden have to fight for points this year with a good crop of new comers. That is what makes Sepang so interesting. How will the 250 guys place? To think that Spies is just going to fight for top ten is crazy. Simoncelli will be strong. Depending on the GS Bautista will be up there. There is a lot of stuff to shake out this test.

Honda have taken a lot of tech help from Yamaha and now use Magneti Marelli (something Suzuki could take a lesson from). I think their bike will be top notch this year.

http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/racing/mot...maha-engineers/

So Yamaha lose out to Honda there big-time so to see whether that really affects the Rossi magic will be interesting. It will affect Spies, Lorenzo and Edwards also.

It all makes for a season where everyone will be fairly close I hope. And I think you may be right about the demise of the 800's. It may just be another stupid mistake. I think it will be. Back to dragsters...just isn't right.

I've been crunching the <u>theoretical</u> horsepower numbers, and it appears that the 800s and the 1000s will be roughly equal. In fact everything between 1000cc and 800cc will produce very similar peak power. Assuming 81mm will allow an 800cc 4-cylinder engine to breathe at 20,000rpm, and assuming an 800cc engine can meet the engine life requirements, and assuming they raise fuel capacity enough to allow an 800cc engine to finish the race at 20,000rpm, an 800cc engine will theoretically be competitive.

The rotational forces of the engine will be significantly more, and the engine parts will be under far more stress. Plus, the engine will need better cooling and pneumatic/desmo valves.....but it would <u>theoretically</u> be competitive.

The old GP horsepower maxim said that anything over 230 was wasteful. If the 230-240hp maxim stays true, teams may not need to ditch the 800s unless they are looking to cut costs.

Hiroshi Aoyama & Hector Barbera are the rookie riders to watch this year. Expecting big things from the new GP10 Ducati.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Jan 31 2010, 01:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Depending on the GS Bautista will be up there.
I'm afraid to say, he won't

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Jan 31 2010, 07:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I've been crunching the <u>theoretical</u> horsepower numbers, and it appears that the 800s and the 1000s will be roughly equal. In fact everything between 1000cc and 800cc will produce very similar peak power. Assuming 81mm will allow an 800cc 4-cylinder engine to breathe at 20,000rpm, and assuming an 800cc engine can meet the engine life requirements, and assuming they raise fuel capacity enough to allow an 800cc engine to finish the race at 20,000rpm, an 800cc engine will theoretically be competitive.
So in common with most of your conjectural posts Lex, this'll be entirely subject to your own assumptions.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Jan 31 2010, 07:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The old GP horsepower maxim said that anything over 230 was wasteful. If the 230-240hp maxim stays true, teams may not need to ditch the 800s unless they are looking to cut costs.
This is the entire raison d'être behind the proposal

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Arrabbiata1 @ Jan 31 2010, 01:43 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I'm afraid to say, he won't


So in common with most of your conjectural posts Lex, this'll be entirely subject to your own assumptions.


This is the entire raison d'être behind the proposal

The mere fact that my post contains assumptions is irrelevant. The substance is present. Besides, I wasn't insinuating that a manufacturer would run an 800cc engine, only that they could run an 800cc engine.

Cost cutting might be the reason MotoGP has adopted the 81mm rule, but I'm not convinced by the MSMA's show of support for the 81mm 1000cc engines. At the inception of the 990cc era, Honda were too bored to build another V4. Kawasaki and Suzuki got bored with spring-valves in 2004 and 2006 respectively. Yamaha got bored with the screamer config after 2 seasons. Aprilia were apparently bored by the prospect of winning or even finishing races. I doubt the engine people will be content to play with piston rings and cylinder treatments to reduce friction.

Furthermore, Dorna originally requested new rules for a mixed 1000cc/800cc formula. Fixed bore is the easiest way to normalize power between various displacements.

Well,i say the same thing i said last year before the season:I hope it doesn't turn out to be a Yamaha-championship this year.

Dovisioso hopes to get some saying into developement.I think he is too slow compared to Pedrosa for that,so Pedrosa might be fast and Dovi not.
I suspect Simoncelli will be the new De Angelis this year,not speed and determination-wise ,but taking out other riders-wise.

Spies is probarbly going to shine,but right behind Edwards in the tests.
Ducati riders might do well in tests and races but as they need a completely new setup and probarbly new approach out of corners they need time.Kallio,Barbera,Espargaro ought to be among the last in this test with that new bike.

Suzuki-After that interview with Capirossi,where he said they don't even have a testtrack.They only have a small indoors-thing to see if roadbikes roll straight,more or less.
No wonder the GP team is having troubles with chassi and developing traction!!!!
They only have the tests to decide everything.
So,they might do well on the tests but,so what.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ROCKGOD01 @ Jan 30 2010, 04:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I for one really hope to see Hayden back to form. People forget he is a really good rider. We all know the basic four will be up there in the times but I think the important thing is to see whom will be the X factors this year. I for one really hope we have a barnburner of a season and that means also to see Suzuki get up there in the mix as well. Although I am doubtful they will but ya just never know.

Bless your soul. If I hear the phrases 'the aliens' 'four aliens', 'extraterrestres' or any other lame tag phrase one more time then I'll punch a wall.

Basic four sounds much less cheesy. Lets agree on calling them something besides the aliens from now on. The Basic Four, Big Four, The Four Horsemen, pretty much anything else please. Okay, I had to let that out.

As for the topic at hand, Bautista is an interesting rider. He was never able to beat pedrosa, lorenzo, and co when they were all in 250s, so why should we expect anything out of him now? But then you realize that stoner never came out on top of the 250s championship against those guys either. Thats the beauty of GP. If suzuki get it just right, and it gels with Bautista, things could get interesting. Most likely not but stranger things have happened.

Although he never raced pedrosa in 250s, I simply meant to use him and lorenzo as a metaphor for the 250cc champions.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (yello13 @ Feb 1 2010, 12:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Bless your soul. If I hear the phrases 'the aliens' 'four aliens', 'extraterrestres' or any other lame tag phrase one more time then I'll punch a wall.

Basic four sounds much less cheesy. Lets agree on calling them something besides the aliens from now on. The Basic Four, Big Four, The Four Horsemen, pretty much anything else please. Okay, I had to let that out.

As for the topic at hand, Bautista is an interesting rider. He was never able to beat pedrosa, lorenzo, and co when they were all in 250s, so why should we expect anything out of him now? But then you realize that stoner never came out on top of the 250s championship against those guys either. Thats the beauty of GP. If suzuki get it just right, and it gels with Bautista, things could get interesting. Most likely not but stranger things have happened.

Although he never raced pedrosa in 250s, I simply meant to use him and lorenzo as a metaphor for the 250cc champions.
I am not sure that beating people in the lower classes is that much of a guide to premier class success;rossi is the exception as he is in many things. Biaggi and capirossi won multiple lower class titles but I guess had the misfortune to have careers coincidental with those of doohan and rossi. Stoner as well as pedrosa did beat lorenzo when all three raced together in the 250 class but people can be at different stages in their careers and all were (and continue to be for that matter in historical terms) quite young. Bautista will have to be quite exceptional one would think to do much on a suzuki though.

Would Suzuki finally abandon their 'lacking' V4 and switch to I4 when 1000's come out and play? Didn't they have the reputation back in the 990's as having a great chassis with 'anemic' lump?