Pedrosa improves on first outing on B-stones

M.Soekirman · Sep 1, 2008

So Pedrosa is immediately faster on his first outing on the stones. SEE HERE. I'm wondering how much of that is part of the placebo effect and was the michelins being bad just something between the ears. Lorenzo's 2nd place kinda seems to support that. All I know is, if a rider THINKS he has bad equipment e.g tyres, he will be cautious and hold back on his efforts to push to the max. So Dani thinking that he has sticky feet now may be reason for him to push again. To find out, you'd have to deliberately switch the stones for the michelins (sans badges) and wait to see what happens.

chopperman · Sep 1, 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Screamer46 @ Sep 1 2008, 10:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So Pedrosa is immediately faster on his first outing on the stones. SEE HERE. I'm wondering how much of that is part of the placebo effect and was the michelins being bad just something between the ears. Lorenzo's 2nd place kinda seems to support that. All I know is, if a rider THINKS he has bad equipment e.g tyres, he will be cautious and hold back on his efforts to push to the max. So Dani thinking that he has sticky feet now may be reason for him to push again. To find out, you'd have to deliberately switch the stones for the michelins (sans badges) and wait to see what happens.
good point,
one thing ive learned over the past few races is, it doesnt matter how fast your lap time are but can you go the distance

Anders · Sep 1, 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Screamer46 @ Sep 1 2008, 09:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So Pedrosa is immediately faster on his first outing on the stones. SEE HERE. I'm wondering how much of that is part of the placebo effect and was the michelins being bad just something between the ears. Lorenzo's 2nd place kinda seems to support that. All I know is, if a rider THINKS he has bad equipment e.g tyres, he will be cautious and hold back on his efforts to push to the max. So Dani thinking that he has sticky feet now may be reason for him to push again. To find out, you'd have to deliberately switch the stones for the michelins (sans badges) and wait to see what happens.
It's in his mind ofcourse,because now he needs to prove something.Nakano and Gresini data has maybe made his Honda all suited to them already,and just needs a final ajustment to him.I wouldn't be surprised.
I think the extra edge grip they seem to have is going to come to good use.

Kez_91 · Sep 1, 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Screamer46 @ Sep 1 2008, 10:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So Pedrosa is immediately faster on his first outing on the stones. SEE HERE. I'm wondering how much of that is part of the placebo effect and was the michelins being bad just something between the ears. Lorenzo's 2nd place kinda seems to support that. All I know is, if a rider THINKS he has bad equipment e.g tyres, he will be cautious and hold back on his efforts to push to the max. So Dani thinking that he has sticky feet now may be reason for him to push again. To find out, you'd have to deliberately switch the stones for the michelins (sans badges) and wait to see what happens.

I agree with you on the placebo!! Other riders can make them work, look at Lorenzo, then there is Edwards. . .he sometimes gets near the top of the field

Anders · Sep 1, 2008

I just read this:
http://www.crash.net/motorsport/motogp/new..._pneumatic.html
It seems he was about as fast on Michelin and Bridgestone.The big difference was the pneumatic engine.
He sais he didn't prefer the pneumatic engine because it's not so gentle.I wonder what his current bike is like.A little girl probarbly could ride it .

With that big difference in laptime there should be no doubt what to use.Gentle or not in my opinion.

ROCKGOD01 · Sep 1, 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Screamer46 @ Sep 1 2008, 09:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So Pedrosa is immediately faster on his first outing on the stones. SEE HERE. I'm wondering how much of that is part of the placebo effect and was the michelins being bad just something between the ears. Lorenzo's 2nd place kinda seems to support that. All I know is, if a rider THINKS he has bad equipment e.g tyres, he will be cautious and hold back on his efforts to push to the max. So Dani thinking that he has sticky feet now may be reason for him to push again. To find out, you'd have to deliberately switch the stones for the michelins (sans badges) and wait to see what happens.
YEah isn't it funny how Jorge was second on the Michelins and did very well. Now Fagdrosa has to cry some more about it, put some ...... races together and BAM he now has stones in the MIddle of the season. SO funny. IT is a shame that it was allowed to go through. HE should have been made to wait til the 09 season.

mylexicon · Sep 1, 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Anders GUZZI @ Sep 1 2008, 02:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I just read this:
http://www.crash.net/motorsport/motogp/new..._pneumatic.html
It seems he was about as fast on Michelin and Bridgestone.The big difference was the pneumatic engine.
He sais he didn't prefer the pneumatic engine because it's not so gentle.I wonder what his current bike is like.A little girl probarbly could ride it .

With that big difference in laptime there should be no doubt what to use.Gentle or not in my opinion.

Yes good catch. The stones aren't making much difference, the pneumatic engine is though. If you read the article it also says they didn't do any race simulations. HRC were simply making short runs of 6-8 laps.

I'm not sure this lap time is at all reliable b/c the pneumatic engine is unbelievable when it has enough fuel. I wonder if the short tests have anything to do with fuel regulations?

M.Soekirman · Sep 1, 2008

So now there's 3 possible reasons for him improving:

1. Placebo effect
2. Combination with pneumatic valve engine
3. Pre-existing data for pneumatic valves+b-stones combo

I'll introduce a 4th reason: The threat of HRC boss Hamane shoving an imperial arrow (similar like the one Rossi once got from Furusawa) up his bum, if he doesn't perform. Cause it's obvious that HRC had to pull some serious strings to supply Pedrosa with Bridgestones.

Please, anyone, feel free to add to that list.

ROCKGOD01 · Sep 1, 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Screamer46 @ Sep 1 2008, 10:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So now there's 3 possible reasons for him improving:

1. Placebo effect
2. Combination with pneumatic valve engine
3. Pre-existing data for pneumatic valves+b-stones combo

I'll introduce a 4th reason: The threat of HRC boss Hamane of shoving an imperial arrow (similar like the one Rossi once got from Furusawa) up his bum, if he doesn't perform. Cause it's obvious that HRC had to pull some serious strings to supply Pedrosa with Bridgestones.

Please, anyone, feel free to add to that list.
Puig suckin some ....!

#46 · Sep 1, 2008

Well at least look at the brightside, hopefully we're gonna see him battles at the front with Rossi & Stoner. That's good news for the show..

ROCKGOD01 · Sep 1, 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#46 @ Sep 1 2008, 11:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Well at least look at the brightside, hopefully we're gonna see him battles at the front with Rossi & Stoner. That's good news for the show..

YEah I guess. Ho hum. He just doesn't make it exciting for me at all. I just can't stand the entitled little .... one bit and really could care less if this last race was the end of his career. .... him I say.

Duc999 · Sep 1, 2008

So... The Pneumatic is not a bad bike after all Dani. I hope that you give Hayden an apology.
Now if the Pneumatic bike all of a sudden starts to have max power for the full race - it will go to show that hayden is nothing to HRC. They will have once again only sort out a problem if Pedrosa suffers from it.

I hope Nicky dusts Pedrosa next year.

basspete · Sep 2, 2008

I dont think the new engine or tyres are what dani really needs. Until he can actually RACE with the others, he's on a hiding to nothing. Stoner and Vale are fighting too hard at the front for Dani to make any impression on them at the moment.

From the holeshot, he's awesome, head to head is a different story.

Pete

babelfish · Sep 2, 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Duc999 @ Sep 2 2008, 04:13 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So... The Pneumatic is not a bad bike after all Dani. I hope that you give Hayden an apology.
Now if the Pneumatic bike all of a sudden starts to have max power for the full race - it will go to show that hayden is nothing to HRC. They will have once again only sort out a problem if Pedrosa suffers from it.

I hope Nicky dusts Pedrosa next year.

Jeezz, you might have heard of a thing called development? And FYI that thakes time. If the pnematic suddenly starts to have max power for the full race it proves that Honda has had a continous development of the engine to benefit any HRC rider.
It's obvious that Hayden isn't on top of the pecking order but when you Hayden fans try to suggest they deliberatly sabotage/halt development/ give hayden .... material... it gets too much.

citadina · Sep 2, 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#46 @ Sep 2 2008, 12:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Well at least look at the brightside, hopefully we're gonna see him battles at the front with Rossi & Stoner. That's good news for the show..

Battles? Pedrosa? I assume that you do jest.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (basspete @ Sep 2 2008, 09:33 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I dont think the new engine or tyres are what dani really needs. Until he can actually RACE with the others, he's on a hiding to nothing. Stoner and Vale are fighting too hard at the front for Dani to make any impression on them at the moment.

From the holeshot, he's awesome, head to head is a different story.

Pete
So true Pete, Dani likes to ride alone. His aproach to passing is:
Pass only when the rider in front of you goes wide, brakes, puts up his hand and waves you by.

#46 · Sep 2, 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (citadina @ Sep 2 2008, 04:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Battles? Pedrosa? I assume that you do jest.

.......
....Vrooooommmm!!!!!!.......Dani Pedrosa will start from the grid like the flash, taking everybody out on the very first corner, leading the race until the next lap, before letting Rossi & Stoner pass him and ......finally become a high-speed-do-nothing spectator.....

#46 · Sep 2, 2008

Double post

Austin · Sep 2, 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Duc999 @ Sep 1 2008, 08:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So... The Pneumatic is not a bad bike after all Dani. I hope that you give Hayden an apology.
Now if the Pneumatic bike all of a sudden starts to have max power for the full race - it will go to show that hayden is nothing to HRC. They will have once again only sort out a problem if Pedrosa suffers from it.

I hope Nicky dusts Pedrosa next year.
Realistically Hayden hasn't done much for the pneumo. He's giving feedback when he can but I feel engine development is really something that's headed up back at the factory. But agreed about next season.

VTtwinner · Sep 2, 2008

From Motogp.com....

"...The necessity of gathering tyre information meant that a bruised Randy de Puniet was required to return to action in post-race testing at Misano. The Frenchman was the sole Michelin rider on track for the Monday session, completing fifty laps despite a badly bruised arm."

Thats a scary thought! The only rider testing for Michelin @ Misano, and he's injured to boot!

leon_nerd · Sep 2, 2008

I m wondering something, maybe I am wrong. Lorenzo was on Michelins too but is it right to compare him with Dani since they were on different bikes? The traction control, bike's ergonomics and the rider's comfort should be few of the factors to make one bike good on one Tyre while other to bow down. I don't say that you cannot ride fast on Michelin. Maybe Yamaha can go fast on Michelin and Honda not.

But, definitely I am not ignoring the mental comfort or psychological effect that Stones will bring in Dani's mind. But, I guess it is about trust and believing. You can do great things if you believe in something. And I guess Dani has more belief in Stones rather than Michelins.

Pedrosa improves on first outing on B-stones

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