Marc Marquez faces six-month layoff after third surgery on arm

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I remember the current HRC principal hanging out fake signs in regard to his gap to the second rider when Dani Pedrosa was leading a wet race at the Sachsenring by 7 seconds. Dani eventually crashed out. I am not sure I would rely on Puig in regard to rider safety either.

Colin Edwards might have started this, he rode 9 days after shattering his clavicle which was considered superhuman at that time.

I think Ex-races/ex-athletes fall into the 'well I did it, so why should I stop them doing it/why shouldn't they do it if I was able to to etc.' Puig seems to be an extremely driven individual who experiences winning vicariously in the same manner he did when he was the one winning. I'm not saying that's a bad thing but it clouds his judgement in what it best for the rider in the long term. If the rider is only contracted for the season then the teams want to win may be more important to them than the long term health and safety of the rider but in the Marquez case his long term health and safety was the key for Honda's success going forward given he had another 4 years remaining on his contract.
I think part of the problem with MotoGP is that interests aren't separated as much as they are in other sports. It seems that Dorna dictates to the FIM rather than the FIM dictating to Dorna, as governing bodies do in many other sports. Don't get me corruption is rife in all sports on one level or another so Grand Prix racing is hardly alone in that sense. But the partnership (which I believe is an official partnership) between Dorna and the FIM means that the FIM will never make any rules etc that will harm Dorna's and their own bottom line.
 
I remember the current HRC principal hanging out fake signs in regard to his gap to the second rider when Dani Pedrosa was leading a wet race at the Sachsenring by 7 seconds. Dani eventually crashed out. I am not sure I would rely on Puig in regard to rider safety either.

Colin Edwards might have started this, he rode 9 days after shattering his clavicle which was considered superhuman at that time.

I remember that race, is that what happened? Hells bells that's bad.

At the time I was wondering why he was racing like a madman that day in those conditions.
 
It appears Marquez is aiming for the Qatar GP. I really hope he isn't stupid enough to rush and more importantly his team doesn't allow him to. If Mick can put a championship run together while in his 30's so can Marquez IMO. No need to rush back.
 
My trusted source, autosport.com

Marquez out of Qatar MotoGP test as return date still unknown

""Yeah, of course step-by-step I feel much better, and the recovery is going in a good way," Marquez said.

"Every time I go to the doctor, normally we have good news.

"That is really important because last year was quite long and tough. But now just we try to follow my body, with the physio, with the doctor, try to increase a little bit the work at home.

"But I don't know and the doctors don't know when I will be ready.

"The most important thing is every week - not every day - but every week I feel a bit better and I'm optimistic to be on the bike as soon as possible.

"But I don't know exactly when will be the day."

When asked by Autosport if he had a goal in mind for when he thinks he can return, Marquez hasn't ruled out racing in the Qatar GP - but will take it race by race and base his ambitions on advice from doctors and how this will affect his training."


That sounds more like it. They were not ruling out Marc racing for a lot of last season and kept saying he was not racing soon before the time to race. That approach has not changed, it would seem.
 
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From social media...

155860960_285251716290921_7982156980600258934_n.jpg


You can draw your own conclusions. He has more plates in the hand of his injured arm.
 
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Well, it's like speeding or gambling. We do it thinking we will come out OK. If a disaster occurred every time, we would not take the risk since it wouldn't be a risk anymore, but just plain stupidity. Surgeon and team took a risk thinking they had a bailout if things didn't work out. They didn't expect problems to escalate as they did. Marc, who takes a risk every time he jumps on that bike, did what he is so accustomed to doing once he got the nod to go ahead. This is why he said that he depends on the team and doctors to help him decide. Once he's allowed, he will be going on the bike.... gotta love him for his tenacity. That's part of his training and conditioning. He's a gladiator.

Now that a disaster has occurred, the blame game starts. Someone has to be held fully accountable. This latest one about the initial operation being doomed to failure from the get go is one example.

With good, even reasonable, fixation, there's no need to wear a cast or sling. What he shouldn't be doing is heavy training and riding at MotoGP speeds as if there's no fracture trying to heal. It boggles my mind what they were thinking taking such a risk. The doctors and teams have been pushing the envelope with allowing riders to ride injured and they've been getting away with it. I was amazed at Lorenzo's early comeback after fracturing his clavicle and having it plated. He got away with it but it set an interesting precedent. Others would follow suit and try to push the envelope even further. The system of determining fitness for riding needs an overhaul and sadly, it takes events as these to prompt such change since otherwise, the teams and riders will be complaining.

It's the up to the governing body to legislate regulations that protect the riders from the teams and also, the riders from themselves. Not only rules that discourage cheating, dangerous or irresponsible riding, but also rules that ensure riders are properly recovered from injuries. A long bone fracture heals relatively predictably. The governing body's mistake is to buy into the notion that an internally fixated long-bone fracture that allows for early mobilisation and faster rehab, should be allowed to undergo the stresses of riding and worse, the risk of falling off the bike and stressing the fixation in an uncontrolled way.

When Marc withdrew from the race, I was relieved but further damage already been done. Enough to lead to the chain of events we are still witnessing unfold after almost a year, rather than 6-8 weeks.
Yes I understand what you are saying. Yet, Mick Doohan was quite critical of the doctor who performed the initial operation on his leg, with good reason from his standpoint. Marquez? Motogp is not lacking those who are more concerned with profit rather than well-being.
 
Yes I understand what you are saying. Yet, Mick Doohan was quite critical of the doctor who performed the initial operation on his leg, with good reason from his standpoint. Marquez? Motogp is not lacking those who are more concerned with profit rather than well-being.

I don't know Doohan's story that well and may actually end up agreeing with Doohan. Who knows? I don't see what his experience has to do with Marquez's specifically and how one can even try to extrapolate anecdotally.
 
From social media...

155860960_285251716290921_7982156980600258934_n.jpg


You can draw your own conclusions. He has more plates in the hand of his injured arm.

Very hopeful. He is not doing that exercise with real plates unless they are confident that bony union is well in progress.
 
I haven’t read the article you linked to yet, but iirc the situation was a little different. Mick nearly lost the leg with intimations the initial surgery was botched, I don’t think there was any suggestion corners were cut in the hope of an early return to racing by Mick.
(EDIT Read it now. So partly Mick’s decision to try to get back to win the championship, so you are correct as is usually the case, quite a parallel with MM as you said. I was aware he lost by only 4 points so another 2 weeks recuperation would just about have done it since he was more competitive in the second race back. I don’t recall him asking the riders other than Rainey who were not in contention for the title not to try to beat him either. I always surmised that the botched initial surgery led to a compartment syndrome which compromised the blood supply to the leg as the article more or less says).
 
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Interesting story. Not sure how to comment on that one since it's a news article. Having been on the receiving end, or directly witnessing colleagues being accused of 'botched' operations or being responsible for complications, while being privvy to the inside story which clearly demonstrates no fault, I've learnt to be careful about these things.

Of course, I've also seen where mistakes have clearly been made leading to severe consequences, some lifelong and even deaths, as a direct result of mistakes, oversites, poor decisions and 'botched' operations. Mistakes that patients and relatives are unaware of because of their lowered expectations considering the severe circumstances or problems with which they presented. They are often thankful, considering it all, just unfortunate. What does 'botched' surgery mean anyway? A rational person would perhaps propose that it means surgery that results in complications that are not recognised/expected/understandable given the pathology and procedure that was undertaken. It's not surprising that emotions and poor communication on the part of surgeons interfere with this insight producing expectations way above the reality of the given situation.

The frustrating thing is that the truth isn't always so easily evident on the surface or is often denied because it's difficult to accept. When emotions are flaring for those who are directly affected and more importantly, not familiar with the details, the focus is on what is to be done to save the situation and not also, on the scale of the problem the surgeon is presented with, the likelihood of success, as well as the importance of the aftercare that involves everyone's input and co-operation. It all seems easy and straightforward in principle, but it can be really difficult/challenging for both parties involved.

When something does go wrong that is unexpected, and where there is serious loss involved, the blame game can be frustrating and unfortunately, the one with the most dramatic contribution, typically the surgeon, is saddled with the responsibility. Investigations are therefore essential and I tend to give the benefit of the doubt without an investigation being done. I've been been inappropriately presumptuous on enough occasions to have learnt my lesson. The story may seem obvious as presented, only for a vital piece of information to come to light that throws the implications either in favour of or against the surgeon. So my input is typically heavily qualified with 'based on what I know or what you say.... etc.' or we cannot conclude anything without more information.

I'm more interested in whether or not Doohan's initial care was investigated formally investigated through a lawsuit and whether or not he got compensated for his complications and mishaps. If so, then this implies a botched operation or mismanagement at some point. If not, then we can only speculate. I can assure you that the surgeon is on the backfoot in court hearings. There is no sympathy and the judge is typically on the side of the patient who needs to be protected while the surgeon's care needs to be scrutinised and critiqued without mercy. All understandable. :D

In Marc's case, I see a potential chain of errors. The initial operation was questionable. The decision for him to ride and declaring him fit to ride is where I think THE blatant error was made.... I still feel my emotions flaring up at the thought of it with special mention of this decision being downplayed by placing the focus on the initial operation, trying to give it full credit for Marc's current situation. The second operation and what was done.... this hasn't been looked at. The third operation was aggressive but seemed appropriate anyway. As aggressive as preventing him from competitively riding, i.e., taking part in a full race weekend, for at least 8 weeks after the initial operation.

I fully expect the lawsuit.
 
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Very hopeful. He is not doing that exercise with real plates unless they are confident that bony union is well in progress.

I agree. I'm cautiously optimistic that this is a hugely positive sign that he is doing these types of exercises already. Obviously it doesn't speak to how he is going to handle getting back astride a motorcycle, or rather a grand prix motorcycle. At this point, given everything that's happened, I don't see him being allowed to start putting stress on the arm unless they are confident things have progressed in the direction they've needed to. Fingers crossed he can come back close to his old self...because whether you love him, or hate him, his presence on the grid is better for the entire sport as a whole. I think I might have said it on here a few years ago, but it's easy to sometimes take guys of his caliber for granted when they are actively racing. I want to enjoy every second he gives us out there because guys like this come along only once every few generations.
 
Sure, even if he missed this year entirely to absolutely ensure full healing including removing the fixation device and waiting for healing after same he would still be 29 next season, the age at which Mick Doohan started his 5 title run. I suspect he wants to ride this season though.
 
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Interesting story. Not sure how to comment on that one since it's a news article. Having been on the receiving end, or directly witnessing colleagues being accused of 'botched' operations or being responsible for complications, while being privvy to the inside story which clearly demonstrates no fault, I've learnt to be careful about these things.

Of course, I've also seen where mistakes have clearly been made leading to severe consequences, some lifelong and even deaths, as a direct result of mistakes, oversites, poor decisions and 'botched' operations. Mistakes that patients and relatives are unaware of because of their lowered expectations considering the severe circumstances or problems with which they presented. They are often thankful, considering it all, just unfortunate. What does 'botched' surgery mean anyway? A rational person would perhaps propose that it means surgery that results in complications that are not recognised/expected/understandable given the pathology and procedure that was undertaken. It's not surprising that emotions and poor communication on the part of surgeons interfere with this insight producing expectations way above the reality of the given situation.

The frustrating thing is that the truth isn't always so easily evident on the surface or is often denied because it's difficult to accept. When emotions are flaring for those who are directly affected and more importantly, not familiar with the details, the focus is on what is to be done to save the situation and not also, on the scale of the problem the surgeon is presented with, the likelihood of success, as well as the importance of the aftercare that involves everyone's input and co-operation. It all seems easy and straightforward in principle, but it can be really difficult/challenging for both parties involved.

When something does go wrong that is unexpected, and where there is serious loss involved, the blame game can be frustrating and unfortunately, the one with the most dramatic contribution, typically the surgeon, is saddled with the responsibility. Investigations are therefore essential and I tend to give the benefit of the doubt without an investigation being done. I've been been inappropriately presumptuous on enough occasions to have learnt my lesson. The story may seem obvious as presented, only for a vital piece of information to come to light that throws the implications either in favour of or against the surgeon. So my input is typically heavily qualified with 'based on what I know or what you say.... etc.' or we cannot conclude anything without more information.

I'm more interested in whether or not Doohan's initial care was investigated formally investigated through a lawsuit and whether or not he got compensated for his complications and mishaps. If so, then this implies a botched operation or mismanagement at some point. If not, then we can only speculate. I can assure you that the surgeon is on the backfoot in court hearings. There is no sympathy and the judge is typically on the side of the patient who needs to be protected while the surgeon's care needs to be scrutinised and critiqued without mercy. All understandable. :D

In Marc's case, I see a potential chain of errors. The initial operation was questionable. The decision for him to ride and declaring him fit to ride is where I think THE blatant error was made.... I still feel my emotions flaring up at the thought of it with special mention of this decision being downplayed by placing the focus on the initial operation, trying to give it full credit for Marc's current situation. The second operation and what was done.... this hasn't been looked at. The third operation was aggressive but seemed appropriate anyway. As aggressive as preventing him from competitively riding, i.e., taking part in a full race weekend, for at least 8 weeks after the initial operation.

I fully expect the lawsuit.
I am old enough to have been an avid follower of the sport in 1992, although coverage was pretty much restricted to pieces from journalists mainly in the motor bike press and the TV commentary, with no wall to wall internet and social media back then obviously.

I have to confess to not knowing Mick himself pushed for surgery which would enable him to return early as I said. The narrative about the quality of his initial surgery at the time was pretty much the same as the article birdman linked to, Dr Costa got him out and saved his leg, the surgery was botched/ the surgeon was a butcher etc. No law suit ever as far as I am aware though, and I gather Mick walks reasonably well now after multiple corrective surgeries post his retirement.

I am no surgeon, but obviously agree a suboptimal outcome does not always indicate surgical error.
 
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All I can say is. For those who have not won last year, need to get it done before Marc is back. As for Pol if he wins against Marc, it will be more worthy than a win at ktm.
 
All I can say is. For those who have not won last year, need to get it done before Marc is back. As for Pol if he wins against Marc, it will be more worthy than a win at ktm.

Really sounding hopeful he will make a definite return. I agree this may put the title out of play for others from next year at least. I hope he doesn’t do anything premature/push too hard too soon trying to win this year’s title unless and until he really is completely recovered, Mick Doohan won 5 on the bounce after a year of recovery/getting back to his best at a similar age as has been said.
 

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