Jeremy Burgess Interview

povol · Mar 31, 2011

Talpa said:
Absolute rubbish.

Stoner himself will even admit that he didn't adapt to it last year at all, did you miss the last two years or something? Where is it coming out that he won the title in Spite of the bike? Most of the Races he won in 2007 he was half a lap ahead!!!

What did Rossi do on the M1 in 2004, spanked everyone on a bike that hadn't won a race for years? What did Rossi do with the M1 in 2008? Twice he, JB and Masao took it from a ordinary to all conquering. Mate your a serial Hater with no valid argument, your not supporting Casey just anyone who beats Rossi, which is very, very sad. It great that you are having 'Fun' in la la land.......you could have fun with this argument if even one part of it was legitimate.

Logically, Capirossi should have won the 07 championship going away on such a dominant bike. He is a 3 time world champion after all.At the absolute worst, he should have finished second in the championship with a bike that was finishing a half a lap ahead of the field.

inam22 · Mar 31, 2011

Frizzle said:
Wow, that's one big bulging yellow pair of glasses you have on there.

He could have stayed @ Yamaha & seen off the young Lorenzo & showed him who was boss.

Then he wouldn't be in the predicament with the bike he has now. But he chose to run.

I thought in 08 and 09 he showed young Lorenzo who was the boss, more so in 09 when they were both fit and healthy.

Keshav · Mar 31, 2011

spooky said:
Hehe.

Nah Jums, a lot of the Stoner fans are practically slagging off Rossi because he hasnt got on the Ducati and smoked everyone - seems a tad harsh expecting the guy to push to the same level as Stoner did last year, especially given the fact that Stoner binned it umpteen timesand Rossi is carrying an injury! i know alot of it is to get rise out the boppers (of which i am not) though... Who cares if Ducati have to transform the bike to make it more rideable for the non freaks - of which there is only 1 (and he doesnt ride for them!). Povol, a lot of fans probably do feel vindicated, i am not 1 of them though! You can only push hard on a bike you feel comfortable on - its the same with me and DH racing. I rode a different bike in 2009 and my results took a dip...its the way it is for most mere mortals!

Really and truly - you mis-read the dialog. It's not Rossi being slagged. It's all the the rabid Rossi-fans who from

2007 - 2010 denigrated Stoner's accomplishments in a perpetual flood of damned if he does, damned if

he doesn't, griping, saying Stoner only won (when he was doing so well) because of the way the Ducati

rode itself. It was four long years of listening to Rossi-fanatics, unhappy at Rossi having been beaten

by Stoner (the same way - the same people denigrated Hayden) going on endlessly about "The GOAT"

and how Stoner was nothing compared with Stoner. So naturally - when "The GOAT" jumps on Stoner's

old ride and can barely make it into 7th place - some of us are bound to point the hubris of those

who refused to concede the brilliance of Stoner and his capacity to ride a poorly designed bike to

so many victories.

Keshav · Mar 31, 2011

Nino said:
says random guy on the internet

Says all of us here who have been around for multiple years - to some

new face on the forum. Do you really even understand the meaning

of random?

Keshav · Mar 31, 2011

Talpa said:
Easy, Rossi is a faster Motorcycle Racer than Stoner.

To answer your question correctly we would have to put them on all types of Motorcycles and see. Which as they are only competing in one series, one very regulated series, it is impossible to determine completely.

Stoner has regularly been the fastest in one era, and has 1 800cc title, but not the most successful, nor does he have a 250cc title or a 125cc title. He also as yet does not have a title on another manufacture's bike.

At present the question should be more along the lines of, Is Jorge a better racer than Rossi? Jorge has 2 250cc titles and 1 800cc title on different manufactures.

Rossi has Titles in all classes across several Eras, including the deadly 500's. He is by far a better Motorcycle racer than any of them. And by racer, I mean Speed, Psychology, craft and consistency. There is no other current rider who has entered turn 1 in a race outside the top ten and gone on to win the race, Rossi has done this several times across all eras, Including last year at Malaysia-a feat which most thought never possible again on an 800.

Rossi has the unique ability to assess how fast he needs to go to win races and championships, he doesn't care who is fastest in practice, or even qualifying. Of the current crop of competition the only other Rider I feel who posses this ability is Jorge.

Not only this, Rossi could have retired several times to another Motorsport or to sit on his boat with his millions, with his record as GOAT of the modern age in tact. Yet he continues to compete with far younger and very talented challengers, and as is now-chase them down, injured, bulimic and another year older on a very quirky Machine in a heavily regulated series full of extraordinarily complex technology aiding riders performance..... This is something which is rare indeed, in fact of the modern greats, None have tried it and been successful on four manufactures, or even two......Rossi has less to prove than most riders in History, yet he is still out their trying....

Rossi's move to Ducati shows the true competitive spirit of the man and his team who follow, Most of his fans including myself thought he was mad, most of us still do! But it also takes a lot of 'Crazy' to succeed in this game......

It's pointless to compare Rossi's seasons when he wasn't competing against Stoner. That's like saying

Rossi was faster in the past than Stoner is in the present.

The only thing that really matters (if you're comparing the two) is what they've accomplished while competing

against each other.

Rossi is older and has a glorious past. Stoner is younger and has an incredibly promising future.

To say definitively that Rossi is the faster rider - makes no sense as the evidence of Stoner's victories

over Rossi clearly says otherwise. What you can say definitively is Rossi who is 7 years Stoner's senior

has more titles.

BHarvey · Mar 31, 2011

Points from 2006-2011

Rossi- 1409

Stoner- 1236

Pedrosa- 1201

Points from 2008-2011

Rossi- 921

Stoner- 750

Pedrosa- 744

Lorenzo- 854

Points from 2000-2005 (Biaggi and Gibernau both still in MGP)

Rossi- 1917

Biaggi- 1222

Gibernau- 926

From a points perspective, it becomes clear that Rossi had no real competition from Biaggi or Gibernau.

That could come from both of them sucking, or Rossi just being that good, or both.

He has had much stiffer competition in the last five years and has still done quite well.

We can all make of it what we will, and we will, and each have our own ideas about who is best, fastest, or luckiest in terms of equipment, but in the end it is the passion we have for the greatest form of motorsport that unites us all.

Keshav · Mar 31, 2011

Nino said:
WTF, everyone agrees he did very well in 2007. But although the Ducati didn't handle as the M1, it had the best straight line speed. Still he got the job done.

As for this season, you can .... yourself silly about Stoner on the Honda all you want, but you can't deny that Honda have thrown massive amounts of money to win an 800cc title. Hell, Pedrosa won several races last year when the Honda appeared to the fastest bike on the grid. Now they have a seamless gearbox to give themselves an extra three tenths...doesn't mean Stoner can develop.

Again the griping over what is really a non-issue. Who gives a .... about development issues? Does anyone pay hundreds of dollars to go to Grand Prix and jump up and down in the grandstands yelling; "Ooooh look at that guy develop that bike!"???

Have you ever heard anyone breathlessly oohing and ahhing over the development skills of Hailwood, Agostini, Sheene,

Roberts, Spencer, Schwantz, Rainey, Doohan etc??? All this nonsense about development skill is pathetic pettifogging.

Racers are loved and honored for racing. Period.

mylexicon · Mar 31, 2011

inam said:
I thought in 08 and 09 he showed young Lorenzo who was the boss, more so in 09 when they were both fit and healthy.

When you gloat about Rossi beating up on a rookie with inferior tires, you only confirm what is obvious to the rest of us--Rossi is just part of the alien pack now. He doesn't have the most 800cc wins, and he will likely share the record for most 800cc titles with either Stoner or Lorenzo at the end of this season. In 2010, Lorenzo was about .01 from the ideal lap at a majority of the circuits which means Rossi wouldn't have beaten him regardless of what happened at Mugello. BTW who won first during 2008? Rossi or Lorenzo?

Lorenzo has the 1 plate which means he's the boss, and he earned the #1 plate with 9 wins last season (he only placed lower than Rossi at 3 events). If people want to talk about Rossi as if he is still a relevant competitive force in MotoGP, they are going to have to wait until he shows something. Right now, Rossi can't even beat the person who replaced him at Yamaha. Perhaps that will change in the near future, but now is not the time to pretend that Rossi is still capable of what he did in 2008 and 2009.

frizzle · Mar 31, 2011

inam said:
I thought in 08 and 09 he showed young Lorenzo who was the boss, more so in 09 when they were both fit and healthy.

You are absolutely correct inam.

In 08 Lorenzo was a flying trapeze artist & a rookie & I agree with you about 09. Vale had his measure.

Last year Lorenzo was the man, before during & after Vales crash.

The problem Vale would have had in 2011 is Lorenzo is still getting quicker with more experience.

Nino · Mar 31, 2011

Talpa said:
Poles don't win Championships......better racers do, for that is what its all about unless you are competing in a 'Time-Trial'

Touche

Nino · Mar 31, 2011

michaelm said:
I have no problem either with honda throwing massive money at their bike or with admitting they are doing so, just as I have no problem with ducati throwing as much money as they can lay their hands on at their bike, whether or not this is more than was previously available. That's premier class prototype racing.

If you want to say rossi is an excellent developer I will agree with you. Stoner may well be a poor developer, but the question is not whether rossi is a better developer but whether the 2010-2011 ducati is developable; evidence that it is does not yet exist as far as I can see.

With regard to the current honda I do notice that the other hrc riders are no longer complaining about the power delivery, which they might still be mucking about with to the detriment of the performance potential of the bike in the absence of stoner. I do wonder whether dani has had a tendency to over-refine the bike.

Wait till the races after Estoril.

If the Desmosedici hasn't improved by then, it's going to be a long season for Ducati.

Talpa · Mar 31, 2011

Keshav said:
Really and truly - you mis-read the dialog. It's not Rossi being slagged. It's all the the rabid Rossi-fans who from

2007 - 2010 denigrated Stoner's accomplishments in a perpetual flood of damned if he does, damned if

he doesn't, griping, saying Stoner only won (when he was doing so well) because of the way the Ducati

rode itself. It was four long years of listening to Rossi-fanatics, unhappy at Rossi having been beaten

by Stoner (the same way - the same people denigrated Hayden) going on endlessly about "The GOAT"

and how Stoner was nothing compared with Stoner. So naturally - when "The GOAT" jumps on Stoner's

old ride and can barely make it into 7th place - some of us are bound to point the hubris of those

who refused to concede the brilliance of Stoner and his capacity to ride a poorly designed bike to

so many victories.

Fair Enough, though its a long time since 2007 and some of those gripes were justified back then, 7th place first time out on a very inconsistent machine, just beaten by the man who took his spot on the factory Yamaha, considering current 'H' seriously revitalized technical competition, also with injury might be far better than you think.....Stoner is Brilliant yes, and so are the others. Jorge rode a far more impressive race at Qatar in fact. Stoners capacity to consistently ride that bike successfully had gone after 2008.

Hayden may have been denigrated wrongly yes, but its fair to say that he hasn't even come close to repeating his 2006 efforts, and I'm a fan!

You are seriously mis-reading the dialogue, Rossi fans have been slagged yes, but much more so Rossi has been. Two wrongs don't make a right......you are now slagging like the slaggers for exactly the same thing that they were being slagged for slagging on.....

Except far more petty and imaginary as the Rider being slagged has a record leagues ahead of the others....

That makes you a hypocrite and a slagger!

Lessons still haven't been learnt after 2006-07. It would be far more intelligent to keep your .... in your trousers and wait and see as Michm is doing before slagging, for if it turns, as it well could, the current slaggers will be, rightly so, slagged into oblivion!

frizzle · Mar 31, 2011

Nino said:
Wait till the races after Estoril.

If the Desmosedici hasn't improved by then, it's going to be a long season for Ducati.

I think if their changes post Estoril haven't drastically improved the bike, then they may switch all their focus on to next years bike.

Nino · Mar 31, 2011

Keshav said:
Again the griping over what is really a non-issue. Who gives a .... about development issues? Does anyone pay hundreds of dollars

to go to Grand Prix and jump up and down in the grandstands yelling; "Ooooh look at that guy develop that bike!"???

Have you ever heard anyone breathlessly oohing and ahhing over the development skills of Hailwood, Agostini, Sheene,

Roberts, Spencer, Schwantz, Rainey, Doohan etc??? All this nonsense about development skill is pathetic pettifogging.

Racers are loved and honored for racing. Period.

Yes, except Stoner was constantly moaning about the bile at Ducati, yet showed no ability to turn things around.

Instead he regressed. Who gives .... about development? I'm pretty sure the Ducati engineers weren't thrilled when their rider wasn't able to give them good feedback. Hence they weren't bothered about seeing him leave and targeted Lorenzo and Rossi.

Of course many people view that as s mistake, but what will people say if Rossi is able to make the bike more rideable, and be fast on it?

Actually, I already know what you will say - 'But, but Rossi had Ducati's ear!'

michaelm · Mar 31, 2011

Nino said:
Wait till the races after Estoril.

If the Desmosedici hasn't improved by then, it's going to be a long season for Ducati.

Agreed. I think it is likely he will get something more out of it in the end anyway though, even if it is just from his shoulder improving. As I have said before doubtless they have not given up this year and nor should they, but their strenous efforts are also directed at assessing whether the design concept is viable for the new bike, or whether they need to go narrower angle V2 etc.

Talpa · Mar 31, 2011

Keshav said:
It's pointless to compare Rossi's seasons when he wasn't competing against Stoner. That's like saying

Rossi was faster in the past than Stoner is in the present.

The only thing that really matters (if you're comparing the two) is what they've accomplished while competing

against each other.

Rossi is older and has a glorious past. Stoner is younger and has an incredibly promising future.

To say definitively that Rossi is the faster rider - makes no sense as the evidence of Stoner's victories

over Rossi clearly says otherwise. What you can say definitively is Rossi who is 7 years Stoner's senior

has more titles.

I was asked to give a comparison, that's what I did. At present while they've been competing against each other Rossi has it as well, well and truly

Points;

Rossi 1400

Stoner 1092

championships;

Rossi 2 wins, 2 thirds, 1 second

Stoner 1 win, 1 second, 1 eighth, 2 fouths

wins;

Rossi 26

Stoner 24

podiums;

Rossi 58

Stoner 43

Any more Stats you need? Stoner hasn't beaten Rossi in any of these stats since they have been competing against each other......makes a fair point for my answer...

frizzle · Mar 31, 2011

Nino said:
Yes, except Stoner was constantly moaning about the bile at Ducati, yet showed no ability to turn things around.

Instead he regressed. Who gives .... about development? I'm pretty sure the Ducati engineers weren't thrilled when their rider wasn't able to give them good feedback. Hence they weren't bothered about seeing him leave and targeted Lorenzo and Rossi.

Of course many people view that as s mistake, but what will people say if Rossi is able to make the bike more rideable, and be fast on it?

Actually, I already know what you will say 'But, but Rossi had Ducati's ear!'

Ducati have had, Stoner, Capirossi, Hayden, Barros, Melandr etc.

Are they all poor developers?

A quote from cyclenews late last year

One of the reasons Stoner left Ducati was the lack of updates. Stoner and Hayden have both said that what they start the season with is pretty much what they end it with. There aren't a lot of major updates, which isn't surprising for a small company. Many believe that one of the major reasons Ducati closed down their World Superbike program was to devote those resources to MotoGP. Burgess thinks that Rossi will have a close relationship with Ducati engineering whiz Filippo Preziosi and that "Valentino will be picking the phone up fairly regularly, if not every night, and I'm sure that's what Filippo would like to hear.

Like I said before they closed down their superbike team to fund Rossi & his crew.

Stoner & Hayden got virtually the same bike at start & end of the year.

And you talk of development skills? It's money nothing more.

Does Valentino have to put up with the same bike all year? Absolutely not.

Why doesn't he just do what Stoner did with the bike he was given? Shut the .... up & win on it.

Nino · Mar 31, 2011

Frizzle said:
Ducati have had, Stoner, Capirossi, Hayden, Barros, Melandr etc.

Are they all poor developers?

A quote from cyclenews late last year

Like I said before they closed down their superbike team to fund Rossi & his crew.

Stoner & Hayden got virtually the same bike at start & end of the year.

And you talk of development skills? It's money nothing more.

Does Valentino have to put up with the same bike all year? Absolutely not.

Why doesn't he just do what Stoner did with the bike he was given? Shut the .... up & win on it.

How do you know that the bike wasn't developed much because Stoner wasn't able to bring much to the table in terms of feedback. It's a two way process, and one thing we have seen from Stoner are fits of anger and sulks. We've seen Rossi get angry, but we've also seen him develop a crap Yamaha. When he was unable to defend his title he came back stronger. Stoner fought hard for one year, then flopped.

Maybe because Rossi bring sponsors to the table. Even when he's winning Stoner sometimes gets booed because he's seen as having no personality, and complaining too much.

BHarvey · Mar 31, 2011

Well, Rossi was whining about his shoulder at the end of 2010, and at the beginning of 2011 he is still whining about it, which means EVEN IF he was still at Yamaha, he would STILL be whining about the shoulder and saying it was costing him.

frizzle · Mar 31, 2011

Nino said:
How do you know that the bike wasn't developed much because Stoner wasn't able to bring much to the table in terms of feedback. It's a two way process, and one thing we have seen from Stoner are fits of anger and sulks. We've seen Rossi get angry, but we've also seen him develop a crap Yamaha. When he was unable to defend his title he came back stronger. Stoner fought hard for one year, then flopped.

Maybe because Rossi bring sponsors to the table. Even when he's winning Stoner sometimes gets booed because he's seen as having no personality, and complaining too much.

As I said money talks, not development skills. The rest of your post is your opinion because you want it to be. None of it is based on anything other than that.

I'll stick with Stoner & Haydens statements instead if it's all the same to you?

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