How to make motorcycle racing

pit stops are a bad idea because they go against the spirit of this particular series which is a ~100 km sprint.

if people really want the racing to be more exciting, here's what i'd like to see (none of them are real possibilities and may contradict each other or be incongruous, but a boy can dream):

1. 500cc 2 strokes. I said it. I understand the need to switch to 4 strokes and the need for manufacturers to develop electronics for the market and such, but if all we're talking about is racing, then bring back the 500cc GP machines. This would also potentially get more teams back into the series since they are infinitely cheaper to run than 4 strokes.

2. Ban TC/Institute a control ECU rule. Let's get the riders back in control. It's interesting to hear the comments of Hodgson, RL Hayden, and Rossi on the difference between racing with TC and w/out and how much it takes away from the rider. Ban it.

3. Control Tire. That's right, I said it. Not because i'm a fan of a particular rider or team or whatever, but all the people complaining about Rossi/Michelin's problems or reveling in Bridgestone's dominance are more interested in allegiances than exciting racing. the fact is that if you really want exciting racing, a control tire is the fastest way to level the playing field.

4. Two races a weekend. All that build up for 45 mins is a little anticlimactic. as well, if a rider has a bad race, there's another chance. this would keep the points close together.

5. A more evenly spread out season. Maybe 1 race every other weekend instead of bunching 5 straight races together or having a month long break.

6. More rider development. We need more talent. The red bull rookie's cup is a great idea and i'm glad to see it. we need more of that. otherwise we are going to continue to get 1 guy who comes along every few years who dominates, then an off couple years, then another dominator, etc.

7. Some kind of rule providing security for satellite teams regarding parts. Not sure how this would work out, but it would ensure at least equal or similar machinery (max ?!?) for the non-factory teams.

and finally, what i would consider THE most important change...

8. At least two or three umbrellas girls for every rider on the grid. duh.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Son of Doohan @ Jul 26 2007, 10:26 PM) [snapback]81645[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Ridiculous! Mick Doohan would have one nothing with a push start! Melandri's brilliant ride on the weekend would have been non existent as well! I love it just the way it is, but maybe getting rid of traction control would be a good idea!

but then stoner wouldn't win !!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(drumfu @ Jul 26 2007, 11:21 PM) [snapback]81655[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
pit stops are a bad idea because they go against the spirit of this particular series which is a ~100 km sprint.

if people really want the racing to be more exciting, here's what i'd like to see
1. 500cc 2 strokes. I said it. I understand the need to switch to 4 strokes and the need for manufacturers to develop electronics for the market and such, but if all we're talking about is racing, then bring back the 500cc GP machines. This would also potentially get more teams back into the series since they are infinitely cheaper to run than 4 strokes.



damn drumfu, i would love that to but we both now that aint ever going to happen but i agree it would make for more exciting racing that would sort the men from the boys.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(basspete @ Jul 27 2007, 05:10 AM) [snapback]81614[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
The most exciting racing Ive evr watched was the old Pro Am Elsie series. (Some people may find Google helpful here!)

If you want pure exciement in bike racing, put out a load of identical bikes, and the riders pick the keys.

Not gonna happen in GP though, is it?

Pete


Politics? Sponsors? Dorna wanting certain nationalities to win?

I'm not an expert on this sport, so those of you wishing Moto GP were more exciting may school me here. In this era of spec series and other forms of standardization, Moto GP has remained relatively open and manages to be one of the most exciting series on the planet. Does it really need fixing? This is the first year of the 800 era; I'm still waiting patiently for Michelin to adjust to the tire rule and for everyone else to catch up to Ducati. Once those two things fall into place, things should get better.

I also like the sprint race format because it encourages tire management. This aspect has worked well for the SCCA World Challenge series, which has been the country's best road racing championship for the past few years. While pit stops could make things more interesting, they could also make things less so. Pit stops can divide a race into several sprints. the men with the fastest machines can just haul ... until the pit stop, change tires, and off they go again. With the need for tire management out the window, the best machines can just haul ... the whole time, leaving talented guys with lesser equipment in the dust.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mr. Shupe @ Jul 26 2007, 04:26 PM) [snapback]81663[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
I'm not an expert on this sport, so those of you wishing Moto GP were more exciting may school me here. In this era of spec series and other forms of standardization, Moto GP has remained relatively open and manages to be one of the most exciting series on the planet. Does it really need fixing? This is the first year of the 800 era; I'm still waiting patiently for Michelin to adjust to the tire rule and for everyone else to catch up to Ducati. Once those two things fall into place, things should get better.

I also like the sprint race format because it encourages tire management. This aspect has worked well for the SCCA World Challenge series, which has been the country's best road racing championship for the past few years. While pit stops could make things more interesting, they could also make things less so. Pit stops can divide a race into several sprints. the men with the fastest machines can just haul ... until the pit stop, change tires, and off they go again. With the need for tire management out the window, the best machines can just haul ... the whole time, leaving talented guys with lesser equipment in the dust.



as you said, pit stops would ruin the spirit of this championship. there are already 2 wheel "endurance" races (suzuka 8 is this weekend). these are Grands Prix. it's who can go 100km the fastest. if you increase race distance, force a pitstop or two, you've changed the series. it's like saying, let's increase the 100m dash in the olympics to a 10km run because we want to extend the race. it doesn't make any sense.

regarding how "open" the class is, in a sense that is true, but it doesn't mean anything goes. in addition to the well-known weight and displacement limits, there are plenty of other rules the teams must follow and yes, there are rules that even restrict the types of engine components allowed (just ask WCM). there are even rules that limit dimensions for chassis/body design. so, while yes, there is a fundamental difference from Superbike racing, there are still numerous limits imposed on the teams.

in terms of "most exciting" series, i would say that's subjective and up to each individual to decide. i would definitely say it's the most prestigious, but i think there are strong arguments to be had for WSBK or 250cc GPs being more exciting; but again, that's just subjective.

It’s amazing!!! That whenever the 500/motoGP has had a great champion ala Spencer, Doohan & of course Rossi everybody is trying to think of a way to change the “goal posts” it happened in golf with Tiger Woods, in WRC with Lobe and it will be suggested always!!! Rossi and now with Casey in motoGP!!!

Everybody is trying to change be it the rules, format or whatever else...I say “If It Aint Broke Don’t Fix It!!!”...what is happening in motoGP 2007 with the new 800’s is that we have one team one rider who have shown what great preparation and determination can do!!! And the other top teams (Honda, Yamaha) and their top riders who at the beginning of the 2007 season were that sure of their positions in that team that they thought that its just a matter of getting on their Honda’s, Yamaha’s and everything will just fall into place and happen!!! Sure there are a few things to change, but the tyre rule is not one of them!!! And to suggest the preposterous idea of bringing the 500 two strokes back is absolutely ridiculous!!!

YES...YES...YES... NOW YOURE TALIKNG!!!... “At least two or three umbrellas girls for every rider on the grid”...lol...or better still:...topless or with the riders #’s on her n...les...or something like that would make it interesting!!!

no traction control is the only thing I think would be a nice change

I like the sprint aspect of the race a lot. The bikes are made to last the short distance and go as fast as possible. The long summer break is no good but I think the European long holiday tradition is why. Here in Canada a week is a long holiday. More than likely a 3 day weekend is more like it. Taking a month or 6 weeks off from work is a dream.

Let's have a warm up race with 2 or 3 umbrella girls riding a few of the lucky spectators! I'll put my hand up although the race will probably only last 5 minutes!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(CSCVAW @ Jul 27 2007, 06:10 AM) [snapback]81680[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
It’s amazing!!! That whenever the 500/motoGP has had a great champion ala Spencer, Doohan & of course Rossi everybody is trying to think of a way to change the “goal posts” it happened in golf with Tiger Woods, in WRC with Lobe and it will be suggested always!!! Rossi and now with Casey in motoGP!!!



I'm sorry but Casey does not belong amongst these names, not untill his current form has lasted at least 2 more years, so be patient.

I was just going to say the same. At this point no matter how much you want it to be so, he's not the champion. So far from being a "great champion" he's not even a champion yet. One year doesn't make greatness, give him time, and maybe he will be. Maybe, maybe not. But he's no Doohan, Rossi, Gardner or Rainey. Definitely not yet.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(CSCVAW @ Jul 26 2007, 10:10 PM) [snapback]81680[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
It’s amazing!!! That whenever the 500/motoGP has had a great champion ala Spencer, Doohan & of course Rossi everybody is trying to think of a way to change the “goal posts” it happened in golf with Tiger Woods, in WRC with Lobe and it will be suggested always!!! Rossi and now with Casey in motoGP!!!

Everybody is trying to change be it the rules, format or whatever else...I say “If It Aint Broke Don’t Fix It!!!”...what is happening in motoGP 2007 with the new 800’s is that we have one team one rider who have shown what great preparation and determination can do!!! And the other top teams (Honda, Yamaha) and their top riders who at the beginning of the 2007 season were that sure of their positions in that team that they thought that its just a matter of getting on their Honda’s, Yamaha’s and everything will just fall into place and happen!!! Sure there are a few things to change, but the tyre rule is not one of them!!! And to suggest the preposterous idea of bringing the 500 two strokes back is absolutely ridiculous!!!

YES...YES...YES... NOW YOURE TALIKNG!!!... “At least two or three umbrellas girls for every rider on the grid”...lol...or better still:...topless or with the riders #’s on her n...les...or something like that would make it interesting!!!



none of the points i made have anything to do with rossi or doohan-esque dominance, nor do they have anything to do with whether i prefer one rider or team over another. they are things that i would like to see happen to the series because i believe they would make the racing more exciting.

the FIM changes the rules every year. sometimes the rules changes are huge (500s to 990s or 990s to 800s). sometimes the rule changes are small. but the rules change all the time. i'm not sure why you're so averse to the idea, if so, you should be complaining to the FIM, not us. you sound quite content with how the 07 season is going, yet, this is the 1st season with many many rule changes? i do not see any internal consistency in your position. it sounds like you're more interested in your personal allegiences and who you support than the idea of making racing more exciting.

you say "if it ain't broke, don't fix it", but does that mean you want to go back to 06 rules? how about 02? you contradict yourself.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(antfan @ Jul 27 2007, 12:10 AM) [snapback]81659[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Politics? Sponsors? Dorna wanting certain nationalities to win?



All of the above and of course the manufacturers not making the bikes on the grid!

Pete

I'd go back to 990s as the racing was better. True, it's the 800s first year so maybe once everyone gets up to speed it will improve.

No pitstops please, but it's been exciting when we've gone from a dry race to a wet race and there have been bike changes.

I say 750cc lean burn 2 strokes. Ditch the traction control and let the tyre manufacturers go nuts on development.

Lets go back to the series being completely irrelevant to road bikes, on bikes that you have to be a god to ride.

I dunno if it would make the series closer, coz I think a lot of the new guys would struggle on them, but it would make for a seriously exciting spectacle.


But hey, you know me, I love the smell of 2 strokes........................

Pete

Personally I think if you bang a control tyre/tire and get rid of TC in there you can't ask for fairer than that.

However,

If you run a major tyre manufacture such as Michelin/Bridgestone and your rival can sling up posters saying: "

The premier motorcycling class uses our tyres!"

It's going to be better marketing for them, it'll drive money out the sport, but if all we're talking about is racing, control tyre and no TC!

Phil

yeah no tc, we all love seeing riders loose thier toes and fingers now.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinky @ Jul 29 2007, 06:56 PM) [snapback]82137[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
yeah no tc, we all love seeing riders loose thier toes and fingers now.



two riders in WSBK lost digits this season. both use traction control. i hope you aren't trying to say having traction control means riders won't lose fingers because that's obviously not true.

wow 2 riders, thats really statistically significant

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(xx CURVE xx @ Jul 26 2007, 07:00 PM) [snapback]81587[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
pit stops..thats just stupid...Moto GP is a SPRINT RACE.

to make it more exciting...easy...bring back the 990s, trash the tracktion control and tire rule.


i agree with 1 of your points about loose the traction control but i belive the tyre rule and the 800's should stay.
you cant just drop the tyre rule its fair i feel as your a rossi fan that maybe swaying you for the rule change, im a rossi fan too but its not the rule its the quality of the tyre michelin need to pull there heads out of there rear and produce better rubber simple as that.
the 800's should stay as its shaken up all the riders its better to see other riders winning and not the usual suspects.

i also think the race time and laps should stay i dont want to see 24hr
le mans motogp.

i hope you dont find this offensive its just my opinion